My 2014 Moves (If I only owned the Team Edition)

[johnfree63]

NW, I'm going to bring this all the way back to your original post. I'm not a fan of signing Hughes so I thought I'd just bring up the idea of signing Josh Johnson. Because of Johnson's injury at the end of the year, he might be in line for a similar contract as Hughes (by that I mean a 1yr deal south of 12M) and he's a much better pitcher then Hughes.

 

[seafan]

I really wonder from where people think a team this bad is somehow just a few little pieces away from being good. The comparisons to Oakland and Tampa are about as delusional as anything I've ever seen anywhere on any message board.

Because theres a lot of reasons to be optimistic. Ive already touched on the starting pitching.

3B: Seager has it locked down.
SS: Its hard for me to believe that miller/franklin isnt going to be an upgrade from ryan and theres a chance thats its a pretty big upgrade.
2B: With the second half ackley had hitting over 300 plus franklin i think 2B is the position that will upgrade the most from last year.
C: Im not as high on him as most are but a full year of zunino will be better than what we had last year.
1B: Id stick with smoak for another year, he wasnt horrible last year but we do need a lot more from 1B to get to the playoffs. I dont think hes a big enough drag to stop this team from being 500 though.
DH: This is one of the spots we should add to or 1B and put smoak at DH.
OF: The outfield is the biggest problem of the team we need 2 top free agents here. I think one OF spot can be filled in house but i think theyd be smart to leave one spot open and let the kids fight for it.

I think its pretty easy to see that with a couple free agents almost every position might be upgraded from last year, add the upgrades with the pitching and i think that team could +500.

 

[NWinAZ]

NW, I'm going to bring this all the way back to your original post. I'm not a fan of signing Hughes so I thought I'd just bring up the idea of signing Josh Johnson. Because of Johnson's injury at the end of the year, he might be in line for a similar contract as Hughes (by that I mean a 1yr deal south of 12M) and he's a much better pitcher then Hughes.

I hear your point and if this was last off season I would be 100% with you. He really disappointed me this year and I am just not sure if M's are in a place where they can take a chance on a guy like him for that money. If we are talking the $6M-$8M ($8M being what Saunders got), then I would be okay with it. Or I would be fine if they spent a little more while increasing payroll to $100M+.

Not hating the idea, but it does scare me a bit as we now sit.

 

[NWinAZ]

Because theres a lot of reasons to be optimistic. Ive already touched on the starting pitching.

3B: Seager has it locked down.
SS: Its hard for me to believe that miller/franklin isnt going to be an upgrade from ryan and theres a chance thats its a pretty big upgrade.
2B: With the second half ackley had hitting over 300 plus franklin i think 2B is the position that will upgrade the most from last year.
C: Im not as high on him as most are but a full year of zunino will be better than what we had last year.
1B: Id stick with smoak for another year, he wasnt horrible last year but we do need a lot more from 1B to get to the playoffs. I dont think hes a big enough drag to stop this team from being 500 though.
DH: This is one of the spots we should add to or 1B and put smoak at DH.
OF: The outfield is the biggest problem of the team we need 2 top free agents here. I think one OF spot can be filled in house but i think theyd be smart to leave one spot open and let the kids fight for it.

I think its pretty easy to see that with a couple free agents almost every position might be upgraded from last year, add the upgrades with the pitching and i think that team could +500.

I personally am not going to try and crush your optimism, but as a day 1 fan I have been let down too many times before and a little improvement (and that is maybe a little improvement) won't get us to .500. We have Franklin, Miller, Zunino, and Iwakuma coming back for their 2nd go around and the baseball world hasn't been all the nice to us lately on sophomore seasons.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Kind of funny how every off-season us fans think of all these great ideas then none of it ends up happening and we go into the next season with virtually the same roster plus or minus a Brendan Ryan or Joe Saunders.

 

[NWinAZ]

Kind of funny how every off-season us fans think of all these great ideas then none of it ends up happening and we go into the next season with virtually the same roster plus or minus a Brendan Ryan or Joe Saunders.

Ain't that the truth. I have always said that October though December is the best time to be a Mariners fan. We can speculate all we want and until after the first of the year we aren't usually disappointed because we are still waiting for that one big move. Then al the free agents start signing and we are left with the Saunders of the world like you said.

 

[johnfree63]

I hear your point and if this was last off season I would be 100% with you. He really disappointed me this year and I am just not sure if M's are in a place where they can take a chance on a guy like him for that money. If we are talking the $6M-$8M ($8M being what Saunders got), then I would be okay with it. Or I would be fine if they spent a little more while increasing payroll to $100M+.

Not hating the idea, but it does scare me a bit as we now sit.

That's where the switching to a pitchers park thing comes into play though. Outside of his HR rate his numbers were basically the same as they've always been. I'd be willing to go with a 1 yr deal with IP bonuses and a large mutual option for the 2nd year, kind of like what the M's did with Bedard a couple years ago.

 

[Baseballnut77]

I prefer to think of it this way. despite the record we weren't that far from being a 500 team and that is while are 3-4-5 starters were horrendous and with a couple of rookies going through ups and downs (and injuries) and Ackley learning how to hit again late. Now we will most likely start walker and Paxton in 2 of those holes and while they are young there is no doubt that they are an upgrade from last year miller/franklin/zunino and even Ackley will probably be better with time under their belt. if it were my money and understanding the M's "budget" I would go big for ellsbury and choo. We need hitters more than we need HR hitters as last seasons numbers proved

 

[NWinAZ]

That's where the switching to a pitchers park thing comes into play though. Outside of his HR rate his numbers were basically the same as they've always been. I'd be willing to go with a 1 yr deal with IP bonuses and a large mutual option for the 2nd year, kind of like what the M's did with Bedard a couple years ago.

That kind of deal I would be fine with as well. I wonder what his average fastball was this year compared to the past? Was he down much?

 

[NWinAZ]

"if it were my money and understanding the M's "budget" I would go big for ellsbury and choo. We need hitters more than we need HR hitters as last seasons numbers proved"

That I can agree with. I like better all-around players than one dimensional players. I could handle one 40+ potential HR, nothing else guy in a lineup, but not two or more like we had with Smoak/Morse/Morales...and yes I know I am stretching the 40+ potential HR category with them.

 

[cezero]

Yeah, difference of opinion. I certainly won't complain if some kind of magic happens next season.

 

[johnfree63]

That kind of deal I would be fine with as well. I wonder what his average fastball was this year compared to the past? Was he down much?

It was the same as 2012 (Average 92.8 MPH) but down from his peak of 94.9 MPH in 2010. However, only Matt Garza among the eligible Free Agents threw faster last year.

 

[NWinAZ]

That makes me worry less since he is the same as the year before. Not worried about how hard he throws, but would be worried in major drop in velocity since that is usually a sign of arm trouble.

 

[seafan]

I personally am not going to try and crush your optimism, but as a day 1 fan I have been let down too many times before and a little improvement (and that is maybe a little improvement) won't get us to .500. We have Franklin, Miller, Zunino, and Iwakuma coming back for their 2nd go around and the baseball world hasn't been all the nice to us lately on sophomore seasons.

To say there will only be minor improvements means our rookies will have to be pretty bad. Our catchers hit a combined .195 last year, our second basemen hit .214, our SS hit 230 and seager had a down year hitting 260. Its not like all these guys need to be all stars to be huge upgrades over last year.

Add to that an improvement in starting pitching, bullpen and hopefully some FA OFs. I dont think 500 is at all out of reach. Were going to have to agree to disagree on this one.

 

[NWinAZ]

My only point is that there are no guarantees. Those are all bad numbers, but there is no proof that they are the exception compared to be the norm. I believe one day we will see .500 ball again in Seattle, but not w/o some big changes and change is not something M's do very often...at least for the positive. Here is to hoping that this is the year.

 

[NWinAZ]

Just thought I would bring this thread back for kicks. I would like to tell all of those who poo-poo'd my Hughes suggestion that he is looking pretty good right now and as I posted on another thread today M's are looking for another starter. Would have been that good 5th man insurance policy like I knew we would need because you can't count on 3 rookies and a salvage pitcher like Young to carry you a whole season.

6-2 3.46 era.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Just thought I would bring this thread back for kicks. I would like to tell all of those who poo-poo'd my Hughes suggestion that he is looking pretty good right now and as I posted on another thread today M's are looking for another starter. Would have been that good 5th man insurance policy like I knew we would need because you can't count on 3 rookies and a salvage pitcher like Young to carry you a whole season.

6-2 3.46 era.

He is actually one of my concerns going forward. I haven't seen all of his games, but he doesn't look as good as his ERA indicates and I worry he may fall apart sooner rather than later.

 

[NWinAZ]

I agree and that worries me as well. I also worry about Elias only because rookies always worry me.