Marvin on Carson "quitting"

[vancelot23]

Carson's stats the last 4 games last year:

Pit-20 of 32, 178 yrds, 1 TD, 3 INTs, loss
Cle-14 of 23, 209 yrds, 0 TD, 0 INTs, win
SD-16-21, 269 yrds, 4 TD, 0 INT, win
Bal-32 of 45, 305 yrds, 1 TD, 2 INTs, loss

That's hall of fame material.

 

[cincygrad]

Most of the easy teams were in the beginning of the season which we lost due to epic chokage from a multitude of players (and coaches).

We also lost 8 games by 7 points or less. It's not like they blew bombshells all season. Better competition, worse defense, along with a coach who loves to keep it close, and those were the results. The team wasn't 4-12 bad.

As for the final 2 games, you already mentioned SD, but Carson played pretty well against Baltimore aside from the blown passes at the end of the game. Despite that and despite passing 45 times, he still managed to complete 71% of them. And you could tell the body language was different in those last 2 games with EVERYONE with the 2 divas out.

I'm not a fan of the stats about 'losing by this amount.' A loss is a loss and it often comes down to the play of your key players. In 2009 we won all of our games by a small margin. Outside of a few teams each year that obviously suck, the difference between being good and being bad is pretty small. My only suggestion was that the leader of your team checking out could definitely account for this difference.

 

[flamingrey]

Nonetheless, we've argued about Carson ad nauseum.

That is what was said and it was a bitch move by Marvin. But that's not surprising. Even the players who should feel betrayed, if anyone, came out and made only positive remarks about the entire situation. The sooner we can get that snake out of here, the better.

 

[flamingrey]

I'm not a fan of the stats about 'losing by this amount.' A loss is a loss and it often comes down to the play of your key players. In 2009 we won all of our games by a small margin. Outside of a few teams each year that obviously suck, the difference between being good and being bad is pretty small. My only suggestion was that the leader of your team checking out could definitely account for this difference.

Which is why I pointed out there wasn't much difference between 2009 and 2010 other than stiffer competition and worse defense. That alone would make the difference between barely winning a game and barely losing a game.

 

[cincygrad]

Nonetheless, we've argued about Carson ad nauseum.

That is what was said and it was a bitch move by Marvin. But that's not surprising. Even the players who should feel betrayed, if anyone, came out and made only positive remarks about the entire situation. The sooner we can get that snake out of here, the better.

The players were coached to say nothing. Marvin has eluded to that several times. And what's positive about saying that you don't care because the guy isn't here. Clearly the team doesn't miss their leader and isn't all that unhappy about him being gone. He wasn't that good and he wasn't a guy that people felt all that close to. If he were, this team would have imploded (as I had thought they might) this season. It's pretty clear that they didn't really need Carson - And it seems to me that they are rallying around the fact that he's gone.

 

[flamingrey]

The players were coached to say nothing. Marvin has eluded to that several times. And what's positive about saying that you don't care because the guy isn't here. Clearly the team doesn't miss their leader and isn't all that unhappy about him being gone. He wasn't that good and he wasn't a guy that people felt all that close to. If he were, this team would have imploded (as I had thought they might) this season. It's pretty clear that they didn't really need Carson - And it seems to me that they are rallying around the fact that he's gone.

Actually, the players spoke about their relationship with Carson and all wished him luck in Oakland. Thought what he did was in his and his family's best interest. Carson has also spoken about his relationship with his teammates. After games their families all used to go out for dinner and Carson talked about how he cherished those moments more than any other time. By all standards I would say they were a pretty close-knit group. That is all based off what those who have spoken have said.

"If they were close to him, they would have imploded..."? Doesn't happen in sports, nor does it ever happen. The Bulls lost the GOAT because he didn't feel like playing anymore, and they were fine. I'm sure there are plenty of examples out there.

They're a better team everywhere else on the field - ST, defense is much much better, offense is much better for a variety of reasons (none that HAVE to include QB...I can't wait until someone flops on that one) - and facing an easier schedule. Of course they're a better team. It has nothing to do with rallying around Carson being gone.

Those are ridiculous presumptions with no basis in fact and all conjecture.

 

[cincygrad]

Actually, the players spoke about their relationship with Carson and all wished him luck in Oakland. Thought what he did was in his and his family's best interest. Carson has also spoken about his relationship with his teammates. After games their families all used to go out for dinner and Carson talked about how he cherished those moments more than any other time. By all standards I would say they were a pretty close-knit group. That is all based off what those who have spoken have said.

"If they were close to him, they would have imploded..."? Doesn't happen in sports, nor does it ever happen. The Bulls lost the GOAT because he didn't feel like playing anymore, and they were fine. I'm sure there are plenty of examples out there.

They're a better team everywhere else on the field - ST, defense is much much better, offense is much better for a variety of reasons (none that HAVE to include QB...I can't wait until someone flops on that one) - and facing an easier schedule. Of course they're a better team. It has nothing to do with rallying around Carson being gone.

Those are ridiculous presumptions with no basis in fact and all conjecture.

What the hell does the ST have do with this? Same players here that were here last season. Same coach. Why is the offense better? Because Jay Gruden, a guy that never coached in the NFL (aside from helping his brother) is the coordinator? What was hard about playing the Browns, Dolphins or Bills last season?

As for implosion not happening in a locker room - I disagree. Sticking with the NBA, what happened to the Celtics last season? Kendrick Perkins was a big-time glue guy in that locker room. The Celts traded him and weren't the same team after. Many have speculated that his trade was a turning point in their season and several of their stars were upset by the move.

 

[flamingrey]

What the hell does the ST have do with this? Same players here that were here last season. Same coach. Why is the offense better? Because Jay Gruden, a guy that never coached in the NFL (aside from helping his brother) is the coordinator? What was hard about playing the Browns, Dolphins or Bills last season?

As for implosion not happening in a locker room - I disagree. Sticking with the NBA, what happened to the Celtics last season? Kendrick Perkins was a big-time glue guy in that locker room. The Celts traded him and weren't the same team after. Many have speculated that his trade was a turning point in their season and several of their stars were upset by the move.

ST was mentioned as one area we've improved in since last season. Last season our ST was horrible.

You can mention Gruden's credentials all you want - and it makes for a nice post - but the fact is he has a great scheme and he sure as hell knows what he's been doing. He's gotten praises from just about everyone who has talked about the Bengals.

The Browns game was given up mostly by the defense. Against the Browns they got called for the silly holding call which didn't allow them to get the ball back. Against the Bills they gave up 35 2nd half points. What did the defense do to both of those teams this year? Shut them down.

Kendrick Perkins made that defense go. It wasn't because he was such a great guy and the players loved him. They DID. But the reason for their defense falling apart was they lost the anchor of that defense. They knew what they had, but they thought they could plug in Shaq to take his role as defensive anchor, but he could never stay on the court. Furthermore, the same way the Celts dropped off defensively, the Thunder absolutely became a beast on that end. Not because they had some sort of instant brotherly bond with him, but because he's just that good.

Agree to disagree.

 

[cincygrad]

Happy to agree to disagree.... I'm happy Palmer is gone - I liked him as a player but I thought he was physically done. I think the team is in a better place without him.

 

[futballiscool]

Carson had the balls to stare down MB. He never blinked. Then he took the high road out of Cincinnati. I'll always respect him for it..

as far as what he has left in the tank that's anyone's guess

 

[DanBengalfan]

NFL.com news: Raiders' Palmer faced Chiefs with knowledge of 15 plays

he has 15 plays in the tank, that's what he has, lol.

 

[cincygrad]

NFL.com news: Raiders' Palmer faced Chiefs with knowledge of 15 plays

he has 15 plays in the tank, that's what he has, lol.

That's funny. Before the Chiefs game I suggested that he shouldn't play because he wouldn't know the offense. Bunch of folks told me I was silly because 'of course he knows the offense, he's worked with Hue before!!'

Guess we'll see how he does with a bigger playbook next week.

 

[jwil007]

Fuck Palmer! Bleeding quittin ass bitch....There you go...You dont have to like it agree with it or read it.....The lil baby is a quitter.....And once the Essays in Oakland start watchin him pick 6 the Raiders to losses they are going to spray paint his house....LOL

 

[flamingrey]

That's funny. Before the Chiefs game I suggested that he shouldn't play because he wouldn't know the offense. Bunch of folks told me I was silly because 'of course he knows the offense, he's worked with Hue before!!'

Guess we'll see how he does with a bigger playbook next week.

C'mon let's not stretch the truth. I don't think anyone said 'he knows the offense'. Unless you're talking about a different board.

Anyone - including myself - who thought he should play were counting on him having a run game, TE/RB screens, and short routes to protect him. None of which is available when down 21 points and you have to call plays you otherwise wouldn't call. Most of them were deep pass plays.

That said, considering Boller put them in a 0-21 hole after the first series in the 3rd quarter, maybe they should HAVE played Carson from the start.

 

[flamingrey]

Fuck Palmer! Bleeding quittin ass bitch....There you go...You dont have to like it agree with it or read it.....The lil baby is a quitter.....And once the Essays in Oakland start watchin him pick 6 the Raiders to losses they are going to spray paint his house....LOL

You forgot about the ghetto hoodlums (is that a double negative?).

 

[flamingrey]

I'm not sure when he "quit", but it was easy to see by his body language pretty much from mid season on that he was unhappy with what was going on. As far as his best games being at the end of the season, maybe he had come to terms with his decision for the future, and TO and Chad weren't there, so he relaxed because of his peace of mind and just let it rip those last two games.....

I missed this post the first time around, but that's an excellent point. Something I hadn't considered. Certainly possible (though I do still stand by my opinion).

 

[jwil007]

You forgot about the ghetto hoodlums (is that a double negative?).

whateva

 

[flamingrey]

If we're going to call out the "essays", we should call out the other half as well. Especially for someone who goes up in arms (figuratively) when that other half is called out by someone else.

 

[jwil007]

whateva

 

[bengaldoug]

Fuck Palmer! Bleeding quittin ass bitch....There you go...You dont have to like it agree with it or read it.....The lil baby is a quitter.....And once the Essays in Oakland start watchin him pick 6 the Raiders to losses they are going to spray paint his house....LOL

Don't you mean "smuck Palmer?"