Kiper cracks me up

[boogiewithstu2007]

“There simply isn't a better player development program in the NFL right now than Seattle's,” Kiper wrote. “The players the Seahawks draft -- the players I've spent many hours evaluating and making calls on -- are often players that evolve, improve and become something new after Seattle drafts them.”


LOL nice excuse for your lack of evaluating talent there Mel.... Just admit when your wrong man...

 

[Mariners_44]

Mel Crapper >>>>>>

He's still willing to give a shit grade, but we have baby steps here.

 

[Wolvie]

That is some pretty good spin by Kiper. truth is, I think he actually believes it too. In his mind, he is absolutely correct and those guys suck and should have been drafting right where he said they should. But once they get drafted by us, they all magically become something much more talented

 

[kcden]

And the guys at the top of his board that fail are functions of a team's shitty player development...

 

[boogiewithstu2007]

And the guys at the top of his board that fail are functions of a team's shitty player development...

 

[poewelch84]

Mel is a spin doctor for sure, plenty of teams do a good job of developing talent.

 

[gohusk]

Meh. He's an annoying blowhard but he doesn't bother me too much. He thought Wilson was too short and said if Wilson couldn't do it then he never wants to hear about a short QB again, which basically saying that if a guy with the ridiculous skill set can't play past his height than nobody can, so it isn't like he didn't think highly of his skill set. He was right about Bruce Irvin who is a little bit of a bust, and who the hell thought that Sherman was going to end up being the best corner in the league.

 

[Sharkonabicycle]

Huh? He's spot on.

Everyone evaluates Seattle's draft the same. Bunch of head scratchers that Seattle develops and creates something amazing out of. Kiper if anything is admitting he's failed just as much as everyone out there.

The draft is not about what you create and coach up. It's about what value you get and who is a great "PROSPECT" based on the combine, pro day, and interviews. Seattle takes guys that are considered reaches based on football ready skills, but they take athletes and coach the heck out of them. Not many teams can do that. You have to have a pretty rare coaching staff and FO ability to do this.

Kiper is spot on, I am right with him. Seattle for the most part has 'reached' for talent they have molded into great players but that has nothing to do with draft value. Not every team can draft ridiculous athletes and mold them into all pro players. You have to grade the draft based on value of the selection, what you COULD'VE done with your selection, etc. It's exactly why I give the Rams a C grade. Sure Aaron Donald and Greg Robinson are great. They had 2 top 15 picks. But what they COULD'VE done with those picks and needs at other positions? A joke. And let's be honest, Earl Thomas/Okung was no surprise. That draft class was loaded and if you didn't get pro bowlers out of your first round pick LOL, wow.

One of the few times I'll agree with Kiper but for those of you disagreeing, can I have some of what you're smoking?

 

[Sharkonabicycle]

Huh? He's spot on.


The draft is not about what you create and coach up.

Sorry, I meant draft GRADES are not about what you create and coach up. The draft is ALL about what you create and coach up. That's how successful teams are built.

You can't grade a team highly than another team because they have a better coaching staff in place. Doesn't work that way. You have to grade a team net neutral to other teams on what the talent to pick ratio actually means (and talent goes far beyond physical). Seattle is probably best in business at developing athletic players at the moment, but it defies conventional wisdom. Few teams draft pure athletes and coach them into something incredible on the field. The Raiders did this for a # of years and were laughed at in the early 00s when they took athletic freaks they couldn't coach up.

So I get it.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Draft Gurus are all full of it. They bitch about not getting value or that guy could of been pick a round or two later and some times they may be right, but usually they really have no idea. So many player went much much later then the draft gurus expected, Just as a example which draft guru expected David Yankey to last to the 5th round at 145th pick? So of course some players get picked earlier then expected by gurus. Would that player been available later? The gurus think so, but would they have been? Nobody really knows, not even GMs for sure.

 

[boogiewithstu2007]

Huh? He's spot on.

Everyone evaluates Seattle's draft the same. Bunch of head scratchers that Seattle develops and creates something amazing out of. Kiper if anything is admitting he's failed just as much as everyone out there.

The draft is not about what you create and coach up. It's about what value you get and who is a great "PROSPECT" based on the combine, pro day, and interviews. Seattle takes guys that are considered reaches based on football ready skills, but they take athletes and coach the heck out of them. Not many teams can do that. You have to have a pretty rare coaching staff and FO ability to do this.

Kiper is spot on, I am right with him. Seattle for the most part has 'reached' for talent they have molded into great players but that has nothing to do with draft value. Not every team can draft ridiculous athletes and mold them into all pro players. You have to grade the draft based on value of the selection, what you COULD'VE done with your selection, etc. It's exactly why I give the Rams a C grade. Sure Aaron Donald and Greg Robinson are great. They had 2 top 15 picks. But what they COULD'VE done with those picks and needs at other positions? A joke. And let's be honest, Earl Thomas/Okung was no surprise. That draft class was loaded and if you didn't get pro bowlers out of your first round pick LOL, wow.

One of the few times I'll agree with Kiper but for those of you disagreeing, can I have some of what you're smoking?

You can't coach up someone if it's not there to begin with... Pete let's people go all the time because he knows when it's not there.... Kiper is flat out making excuses... These so called draft experts miss all the time... Kiper misses ALLOT of the time... Pete just doesn't listen to the hype he listens to himself and what he feels makes a potentially good football player... But he knows when to give up and he's not shy about it... He turned over Seattle's roster more than any other coach in the league..

 

[Sharkonabicycle]

You can't coach up someone if it's not there to begin with... Pete let's people go all the time because he knows when it's not there.... Kiper is flat out making excuses... These so called draft experts miss all the time... Kiper misses ALLOT of the time... Pete just doesn't listen to the hype he listens to himself and what he feels makes a potentially good football player... But he knows when to give up and he's not shy about it... He turned over Seattle's roster more than any other coach in the league..

Not sure I follow. So Pete let's go of people all the time cause it's not there, so why draft them? In any event, did you read the comment I posted right after?

Of course Kiper misses a ton. He is also somewhat spot on for a lot of picks. Nobody is going to predict the draft perfectly. Over 66% (just in who attends pro bowl) 'bust' in most drafts. Nobody can call that.

But for Kiper to come out and say, "Seattle develops their draft players best out of anyone" is a compliment to Seattle and a knock against himself or just flat out truthful statement.

Seattle drafts unconventionally. 99% of critics (not just Mel) critique Seattle for it, but eat crow after Seattle develops their athletes to be solid players. Fail to see what you're not getting. Goes back to my point in that thread, not a lot of teams have the coaching and player leadership Seattle does. Few if any. It's wise to think that Seattle's drafting style will bust. Seattle's draft style since Schneider/Carroll arrived defies conventional draft wisdom. So did Michael Jordan in the NBA. His playstyle did the same thing and look how that panned out. Same with Seattle - I rest my case. If you have the goods, sell the goods. Not many teams do.

Thanks.

 

[boogiewithstu2007]

Not sure I follow. So Pete let's go of people all the time cause it's not there, so why draft them? In any event, did you read the comment I posted right after?

Of course Kiper misses a ton. He is also somewhat spot on for a lot of picks. Nobody is going to predict the draft perfectly. Over 66% (just in who attends pro bowl) 'bust' in most drafts. Nobody can call that.

But for Kiper to come out and say, "Seattle develops their draft players best out of anyone" is a compliment to Seattle and a knock against himself or just flat out truthful statement.

Seattle drafts unconventionally. 99% of critics (not just Mel) critique Seattle for it, but eat crow after Seattle develops their athletes to be solid players. Fail to see what you're not getting. Goes back to my point in that thread, not a lot of teams have the coaching and player leadership Seattle does. Few if any. It's wise to think that Seattle's drafting style will bust. Seattle's draft style since Schneider/Carroll arrived defies conventional draft wisdom. So did Michael Jordan in the NBA. His playstyle did the same thing and look how that panned out. Same with Seattle - I rest my case. If you have the goods, sell the goods. Not many teams do.

Thanks.

It's Kiper covering himself because he looked dumb giving Seattle such low draft grades... Pete and John don't listen to the hype they listen to themselves on what they think makes a good prospect... And there better than Kiper at it...

 

[poewelch84]

It's Kiper covering himself because he looked dumb giving Seattle such low draft grades... Pete and John don't listen to the hype they listen to themselves on what they think makes a good prospect... And there better than Kiper at it...

That is why they are paid to actually be NFL executives and Kiper works for ESPN.

 

[Sharkonabicycle]

It's Kiper covering himself because he looked dumb giving Seattle such low draft grades... Pete and John don't listen to the hype they listen to themselves on what they think makes a good prospect... And there better than Kiper at it...

Nearly everyone gave Seattle low grades, and Seattle didn't really get that high of a grade this year. I don't think Kiper gave them an A or A+ this year either.

Again, grades are based on the value you get for the pick given, whether via trade or selection. It's the reason the 9ers get great grades every year. They take people that fall and get great value for their pick. Obviously the 9ers SO FAR have zero clue how to translate it to the field, but that's probably because (like the Hawks) they are so deep and talented at the starter level.

Regardless, you cannot get butt hurt about draft grades. I also see no way how Kiper is covering his butt. He made an obvious true statement. Seattle knows how to develop their picks. They are questionable when taken and Seattle based on many mocks and grading systems generally reaches, but they develop it well. Good job Seattle.

 

[poewelch84]

Nearly everyone gave Seattle low grades, and Seattle didn't really get that high of a grade this year. I don't think Kiper gave them an A or A+ this year either.

Again, grades are based on the value you get for the pick given, whether via trade or selection. It's the reason the 9ers get great grades every year. They take people that fall and get great value for their pick. Obviously the 9ers SO FAR have zero clue how to translate it to the field, but that's probably because (like the Hawks) they are so deep and talented at the starter level.

Regardless, you cannot get butt hurt about draft grades. I also see no way how Kiper is covering his butt. He made an obvious true statement. Seattle knows how to develop their picks. They are questionable when taken and Seattle based on many mocks and grading systems generally reaches, but they develop it well. Good job Seattle.

Like I've mentioned before It's hard to have zero clue how to translate it on the field when you make it to the NFC Championship game 3 years in a row and one Super Bowl with a bunch of guys you drafted or signed as undrafted free agents/free agents.

 

[jerseyhawksfan79]

Mel Kiper should do more homework on the guys that are selected rounds 3 thru 7. The first two rounds are almost no brainers, but Kiper lacks the brain power to realize talent in the later rounds which is why his grades are clearly incorrect most of the time.

 

[boogiewithstu2007]

That is why they are paid to actually be NFL executives and Kiper works for ESPN.

This is true...