Jordan Devey named starting right guard

[Pattersonca65]

hard to say cause who (ie O-linemen) you draft depends on how value arises? The value that arises in round 2 onward, depends on what happened round 1. Don't think you're saying we should've taken a linemen in round 1, or are you?

even if we did draft one, doesn't mean he goes directly into the line-up AND, be better than what we have now?

Good question. You never know. You're an old time 49er fan like me. Harris Barton started his rookie year and did pretty well but others haven't. Remember Orlando Pace for the Rams? I think he had a pretty good career. I remember his rookie year Tim Harris abused him for a bunch of sacks.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

hard to say cause who (ie O-linemen) you draft depends on how value arises? The value that arises in round 2 onward, depends on what happened round 1. Don't think you're saying we should've taken a linemen in round 1, or are you?

even if we did draft one, doesn't mean he goes directly into the line-up AND, be better than what we have now?

Deep, your draft philosophy is a real mystery. You are as firmly entrenched in the "best player available" camp as anyone I know, and yet you criticize a guy like Tank Carradine for not playing while backing up pro bowl caliber players. How can you justify those two positions? If guys need to hit the field ASAP to justify their draft position, doesn't a team almost have to draft for need?

The reality is that if we knew Davis was gone, we would have drafted more for need. Maybe not in the first round, but almost certainly at some point in the first four rounds.

 

[Pattersonca65]

Deep, your draft philosophy is a real mystery. You are as firmly entrenched in the "best player available" camp as anyone I know, and yet you criticize a guy like Tank Carradine for not playing while backing up pro bowl caliber players. How can you justify those two positions? If guys need to hit the field ASAP to justify their draft position, doesn't a team almost have to draft for need?

The reality is that if we knew Davis was gone, we would have drafted more for need. Maybe not in the first round, but almost certainly at some point in the first four rounds.

You would think so. But I am not so sure with Baalke lately.

 

[VASFfan]

Maybe we just go to a nearly pure power ground game and minimize throwing the ball? It would be very old school, but we've got some RB's who could do it (particularly Hyde) and it might be a way to avoid turnovers and getting Kaep killed? Grind it out, control the ball, try to keep games close. And I mean, REALLY minimize throwing the ball. Not 'balance' in the 50/50 sense but throwing it much less than that.

 

[HighTopFade]

Maybe we just go to a nearly pure power ground game and minimize throwing the ball? It would be very old school, but we've got some RB's who could do it (particularly Hyde) and it might be a way to avoid turnovers and getting Kaep killed? Grind it out, control the ball, try to keep games close. And I mean, REALLY minimize throwing the ball. Not 'balance' in the 50/50 sense but throwing it much less than that.

Sounds logical. Convert Kaep into a Game Manager.

 

[deep9er]

Deep, your draft philosophy is a real mystery. You are as firmly entrenched in the "best player available" camp as anyone I know, and yet you criticize a guy like Tank Carradine for not playing while backing up pro bowl caliber players. How can you justify those two positions? If guys need to hit the field ASAP to justify their draft position, doesn't a team almost have to draft for need?

The reality is that if we knew Davis was gone, we would have drafted more for need. Maybe not in the first round, but almost certainly at some point in the first four rounds.

not "firmly entrenched" but yes, over to that side. But this isn't connected to drafting IR players, why are you trying to connect it?

Again, not picking on Carradine himself, but on the concept of drafting IR players. When Baalke started this, DID think it was worth a shot. But after three drafts, there is enough tangible results to base an opinion.

If you take "Carradine should hit the field" in a vacuum, then no wonder you and Patterson don't get me? But i posted it in the context of an IR player, ie his progress getting back from IR. This refers to an IR player returning the next season, and performing like the steal we think we have. Not being hard core about him returning game 1 of year 2...ASAP. But which IR player so far, came back in a reasonable time?

There is performance and there is time, if an IR player doesn't meet both, then why continue doing it? Carradine just may perform like a 1st rounder THIS season, but its his 3rd season. For Looney it is lack of performance. For Lattimore it was both. For Thomas time is now ticking. So far none of these guys are close to meeting "return on investment".

 

[Crimsoncrew]

not "firmly entrenched" but yes, over to that side. But this isn't connected to drafting IR players, why are you trying to connect it?

Again, not picking on Carradine himself, but on the concept of drafting IR players. When Baalke started this, DID think it was worth a shot. But after three drafts, there is enough tangible results to base an opinion.

If you take "Carradine should hit the field" in a vacuum, then no wonder you and Patterson don't get me? But i posted it in the context of an IR player, ie his progress getting back from IR. This refers to an IR player returning the next season, and performing like the steal we think we have. Not being hard core about him returning game 1 of year 2...ASAP. But which IR player so far, came back in a reasonable time?

There is performance and there is time, if an IR player doesn't meet both, then why continue doing it? Carradine just may perform like a 1st rounder THIS season, but its his 3rd season. For Looney it is lack of performance. For Lattimore it was both. For Thomas time is now ticking. So far none of these guys are close to meeting "return on investment".

Forget the IR discussion for the moment. Let's say Carradine was totally healthy, but he was trying to put on weight and move from 4-3 DE to 3-4 DE. He plays a position where we had Justin Smith and Ray McDonald. Would he have started the past two years? And if he didn't start in his first two years, wouldn't that be a major question about the draft pick used on him?

Or let's think about Jaquiski Tartt. Also a second round pick, and he's certainly not going to start barring an injury. Isn't that a problem for you?

 

[Hangman]

Looked really good tonight. Had one hold. But other than that was rock solid. We gave up a 7th string TE for him. Killed NE in that trade.

 

[purguy12]

Looked really good tonight. Had one hold. But other than that was rock solid. We gave up a 7th string TE for him. Killed NE in that trade.

he did look good. now we just need to replace martin. i do want to give pears credit. i bashed him this preseason and he had a good game. i do still think he will hurt us against a speed rusher. overall line played well except for penalties.

 

[deep9er]

Forget the IR discussion for the moment. Let's say Carradine was totally healthy, but he was trying to put on weight and move from 4-3 DE to 3-4 DE. He plays a position where we had Justin Smith and Ray McDonald. Would he have started the past two years? And if he didn't start in his first two years, wouldn't that be a major question about the draft pick used on him?

Or let's think about Jaquiski Tartt. Also a second round pick, and he's certainly not going to start barring an injury. Isn't that a problem for you?

Ok, assume Carradine wasn't an IR player, then i'd expect a 2nd round pick (40th overall) to contribute his rookie season, but sit more than play. He may contribute as a role player or even spell the starters, but wouldn't expect him to play a lot. But even so, by his practice, pre-season play, and thru his part-time play, you'd see flashes of his talent.

By the second year, you'd see enough to know he could start if need be. But say we happen to have good, experienced players (Justin and Ray) in his spot. This is ok if he isn't the starter, but point is you seen enough of Carradine by now, to know he can start. By now he would play more and more even though not the starter. He is just hard luck two older guys haven't gone downhill just yet. But Carradine shouldn't STILL be lacking in year 2, shouldn't still be a question mark, shouldn't still be a situational player?

You threw out Jaquiski Tartt, also a 2nd rounder at 46th overall. Same thing, wouldn't expect him to start but be a situational player. So far that is what he's doing, and in a few games i'd think he could spell somebody for a series? Point is he is doing what i'd expect for a mid 2nd rounder, more even. Granted, the specific position makes a little difference, so even if Carradine wasn't this far along his rookie year, i'd still be ok. It is about how strong they come on in year 2, and it should be much stronger for an IR player.

 

[deep9er]

he did look good. now we just need to replace martin. i do want to give pears credit. i bashed him this preseason and he had a good game. i do still think he will hurt us against a speed rusher. overall line played well except for penalties.

can't say Marcus Martin was bad, cause didn't watch enough of him. But from a small sample size, thought he was average and that's ok. From here on, this is his chance to show improvement.

I recall one play where he got bull rushed, and almost got pancaked.

Anyway, the Center has to snap too, and he did well in that department. I'd assume he makes the line calls, and i didn't see miscommunication?

 

[purguy12]

can't say Marcus Martin was bad, cause didn't watch enough of him. But from a small sample size, thought he was average and that's ok. From here on, this is his chance to show improvement.

I recall one play where he got bull rushed, and almost got pancaked.

Anyway, the Center has to snap too, and he did well in that department. I'd assume he makes the line calls, and i didn't see miscommunication?

He had 2 flags on him. He pre snapped once and got blown by 2 times. We had no push up the middle. 0-3 from 2 yards or shorter going up the middle. Overall I would give him a C for the game. I just hope the new guy can start soon. Also can't wait for Kilgore to come back. What happens when Kilgore comes back and Devey is playing well. Martin goes back to the bench.