Hypothetical Situation..........

[HaroldSeattle]

It seems like it after the SB year when things started with a downward trend and haven't recovered.

I always felt after the last SB they should of traded Thomas and Sherman among others, then take their lumps to be able to restock thru the draft and have the cap space to add players once they were in a position to go for it again. Still I can’t complain about all the wins and playoffs that came with sticking with those players.

 

[jerseyhawksfan79]

I always felt after the last SB they should of traded Thomas and Sherman among others, then take their lumps to be able to restock thru the draft and have the cap space to add players once they were in a position to go for it again. Still I can’t complain about all the wins and playoffs that came with sticking with those players.

That's a tough sell since they were in their prime but that talk shouldn't have to happen if the FO could hit on draft picks.

 

[flyerhawk]

I always felt after the last SB they should of traded Thomas and Sherman among others, then take their lumps to be able to restock thru the draft and have the cap space to add players once they were in a position to go for it again. Still I can’t complain about all the wins and playoffs that came with sticking with those players.

Trading 2 future Hall of Famers in their prime is a tough sell.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

That's a tough sell since they were in their prime but that talk shouldn't have to happen if the FO could hit on draft picks.

The combination of having to pay thru the nose to keep the studs after their rookie contracts expire and picking towards the end of every single round in the draft means you got to be a magician to keep being at the top. Typically you end up getting less bang for the buck from the second contract players and your forced to reach on the picks because the cream is already off the board. That pretty much is what happened and thus the attempt to trade for the Jimmy Graham and Adams which were counter productive. Now they are painted into a corner with little cap space and little draft capital and a roster full of holes.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Trading 2 future Hall of Famers in their prime is a tough sell.

It is a tough sell. However refusing to hand out record breaking contracts is easier to defend and that would of been the better tack to take.

 

[jerseyhawksfan79]

The combination of having to pay thru the nose to keep the studs after their rookie contracts expire and picking towards the end of every single round in the draft means you got to be a magician to keep being at the top. Typically you end up getting less bang for the buck from the second contract players and your forced to reach on the picks because the cream is already off the board. That pretty much is what happened and thus the attempt to trade for the Jimmy Graham and Adams which were counter productive. Now they are painted into a corner with little cap space and little draft capital and a roster full of holes.

Most teams don't let guys go in their prime. Yes the contracts are high but they're the corner stones of the franchise. This team reaches on picks cause they think they can out smart the rest of the NFL and have failed at it. If they just stuck with BA when their turn was called, we could be having a different discussion about our depth.

 

[Screamin12th]

Thomas most definitely needed to be traded in 2016 same with Michael Bennett, Sherman also. This would have give the Hawks a HUGH break in salary and a ton of picks in the draft. Sherman in 2016 was worth a 2nd still maybe even a 1st at that time, Thomas a 1st possibly more and Bennett a 2nd and possibly more. Those 3 players could have netted the Hawks 5-6 picks in the top half of the coming drafts ( 2016, 2017+ ). The Hawks had to release some up and coming younger guys to keep those players under contract, further depleting the talent on the roster. Hind sight is 20/20 like they say.

I do believe had they traded those guys we would be in a much better light today. With out a doubt I believe this 100%.

 

[Anointed One]

New England has been excellent in doing so... They don't give out big contracts and they've been able to hit on their picks while also stock piling picks... Model franchise on how to run one...

 

[JMR]

The big question is whether we get rid of John Schneider as well.

In my opinion, almost from day 1 PC and JS have presented themselves as a package deal. I've heard on multiple occasions when asked who had final say, the response was pretty non-committal toward 1 person or the other. It's been along the lines of "we get together, talk about it, and come to an agreement." I've heard the gist of that repeated a countless number of times.

We've had some poor drafts more often than not since 2014. There have been some really good picks here and there, but not enough to keep the overall talent level of this team at a contender level. We have squandered many first round picks either by taking players that didn't pan out or trading them away w/o getting enough value in return. And now we sit here coming off a draft where we selected 3 players and don't even have a 1st round pick in 2022 at a time when that will be the best draft slot this team could have had since probably 2010. That has to lay at the feet of JS/PC as a tandem because that's what they've repeatedly told us they are.

It's by far the best 10 year stretch in franchise history, but all good things come to an end....including Russell Wilson's prime, which we are on the verge of wasting if we don't make a bold move and bring people in here above him to take advantage of what we have before it's too late.

 

[flyerhawk]

In my opinion, almost from day 1 PC and JS have presented themselves as a package deal. I've heard on multiple occasions when asked who had final say, the response was pretty non-committal toward 1 person or the other. It's been along the lines of "we get together, talk about it, and come to an agreement." I've heard the gist of that repeated a countless number of times.

We've had some poor drafts more often than not since 2014. There have been some really good picks here and there, but not enough to keep the overall talent level of this team at a contender level. We have squandered many first round picks either by taking players that didn't pan out or trading them away w/o getting enough value in return. And now we sit here coming off a draft where we selected 3 players and don't even have a 1st round pick in 2022 at a time when that will be the best draft slot this team could have had since probably 2010. That has to lay at the feet of JS/PC as a tandem because that's what they've repeatedly told us they are.

It's by far the best 10 year stretch in franchise history, but all good things come to an end....including Russell Wilson's prime, which we are on the verge of wasting if we don't make a bold move and bring people in here above him to take advantage of what we have before it's too late.

Yeah. I'm fine with moving on from JS at this point. Although, not because of the drafting. Honestly, drafting is more or less a crap shoot. The Patriots have been great for 20 years, not because of their drafting prowess, but because of their ability to maximize the abilities of veterans. IMO, this is where the Hawks have really struggled. Particularly on the DL and OL. I'm not sure there is a team that crumbles when they lose an OL starter as badly as the Hawks do.

 

[JMR]

Yeah. I'm fine with moving on from JS at this point. Although, not because of the drafting. Honestly, drafting is more or less a crap shoot. The Patriots have been great for 20 years, not because of their drafting prowess, but because of their ability to maximize the abilities of veterans. IMO, this is where the Hawks have really struggled. Particularly on the DL and OL. I'm not sure there is a team that crumbles when they lose an OL starter as badly as the Hawks do.

I guess it's an "all of the above" thing for me. The current state of the team/roster leads me to conclude that we haven't properly stocked it with talent, or the coach(es) are not getting out of the talent what they should. Either way, it's time for something new.

 

[LionsWhyMe]

OH MY!!! One bad year without a winning record and the sky is falling. You might be able to get Matt Patricia from the Patriots, another year under Bill Bilicheat may have done wonders... MP was 13-29-1 while the Head Coach for the Lions. From the sounds of it reading this thread, any HC you guys get will be like another Matt Patricia.

 

[MrS]

Schneider should be as culpable as PC at this point. He has at least as much responsibility for the draft failures as Pete, if not more.

clearly you are unaware that our GM has no control over any personnel moves. get with the program!

Yah I mean from my end it's a "I think" or "Believe/feel", obviously I don't work for the Seahawks or have any knowledge of how they run their FO, but at least as of the last 5 or so years, that's how it's struck me. I think when Carroll resigned they gave him pretty much free reign given his track record...

There was a lot of good signings/trades that Seattle made early on though that I believe were 100% Schneider. Now it seems like we overpay everyone with ZERO bargain deals, make very few bargain splashes in free agency, and trade WAY too much capital for guys that are... eh?

if anything, the early success in the draft was all carroll. when he no longer knew the players coming up, their drafts really started to stink. schneider is culpable and should be shit canned immediately.

It's not like he would be traded to a team that is just a Russ Wilson away from winning a Super Bowl. He'll be traded to the Giants or the Panthers or the Raiders or a team like that which has more problems than just QB and offensive lines that are suspect.

he will no trade clause any team that cant win immediately

Russ hasn't played well since the injury but he was playing just fine before that. The complete lack of a running game was the real problem.

he started stinking it up last year. its time to face facts that he is not the QB he used to be and is definitely not worth 40m per year.

the only way i would keep him is if he took a big paycut and agreed to be a game manager. we let russ cook and it was a failure.

 

[jerseyhawksfan79]

OH MY!!! One bad year without a winning record and the sky is falling. You might be able to get Matt Patricia from the Patriots, another year under Bill Bilicheat may have done wonders... MP was 13-29-1 while the Head Coach for the Lions. From the sounds of it reading this thread, any HC you guys get will be like another Matt Patricia.

I pray the FO is smarter than that.
I don't think the sky is falling but a change at HC is needed. We need an offensive mind to kick start the offense.

 

[flyerhawk]

I pray the FO is smarter than that.
I don't think the sky is falling but a change at HC is needed. We need an offensive mind to kick start the offense.

I'm not even sure that we need a new creative offensive mind so much as we need someone who takes a different approach towards the game in general. Or at least adapts his approach based on the players he has.

 

[jerseyhawksfan79]

I'm not even sure that we need a new creative offensive mind so much as we need someone who takes a different approach towards the game in general. Or at least adapts his approach based on the players he has.

At the very least an offensive minded coach for HC.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

I feel some here are refusing to recognize that the roster is a mess, even though the problems with have been posted by some here. Couple of them:





The problem is the change from accumulating draft capitol like they did at the beginning. @flyerhawk put a finger on it here in this post:



So the problems are changing from accumulating draft stock to trying to take shortcuts ( most which didn't work out as well as wanted). I know in the early drafts Pete had a lot of first hand knowledge of players in college and used that to the Seahawks advantage. However after 4 years that knowledge became obsolete and the draft became more dependent on scouts and the GM because a head coach can't be scouting college players because he coaching starting with camp and until the season is done. So it falls to the GM and scouting staff to identify and rank players in the upcoming draft. I'm sure Pete looked at video of players in the short time between the end of season and the draft but the info is filtered by who the GM feels needs to looked at. Then we saw draft results plummet. In part due to drafting late and in part due to scouting that was not producing. Got to think that played a part in the change from draft accumulation to shortcuts.
So what needs to happen is to get back to accumulating draft stock and maybe some change to the front office (JS) and the scouting department. Changing from a successful head coach to a unknown really should only happen if the head coach is blocking that return to draft accumulation. Obviously there is going to be some pain involved in getting the roster restocked. Not going to happen in a season. I'm reconsidering the idea of moving RW, most due to what looks like a mediocre draft class in 2022 ( the 2023 draft class isn't looking strong either). However changes need to be made to increase draft capitol and cap space pronto. Maybe a new GM? Although hitting on a better one is not going to be easy either.
Once the season is finished for the NFL we'll find out what the changes are going to be. Lot of drama in these decisions.

 

[flyerhawk]

There are no easy fixes right now. While I do think that the Seahawks record this year is more aberation than reflection of the talent, I do think that we need to make some significant changes if we want to get back to winning a Super Bowl.

Going full rebuild makes absolutely no sense when you have Wilson. Getting a new coach and/or new GM doesn't require a full rebuild and in fact I would imagine any new coach would demand that Wilson stays.

 

[MrS]

the defense is almost completely depleted of talent at every level with a few exceptions, the offense is set at WR but not much else. we are seeing the fruits of either not picking in the first round or making bad picks all together.

I just dont see how the guys that built the current roster are going to fix it.

 

[returnofjakedog]

clearly you are unaware that our GM has no control over any personnel moves. get with the program!

Pure speculation. We, the fanbase as a whole, are not privy to the power structure of the organization. It is possible PC makes the calls but it supposedly was equal early on (as per their own statements), and there has been no definitive evidence to show that has changed.