GDT - WCQF (Game 4) Sharks at Kings - 7:30PM

[Cmon_WTF]

I would obviously agree that scoring isnt everything, but when you are jumbo, heater, or marleau, scoring absolutely must be part of your game. If they go scoreless, I dont care how well they work or play along the boards, the sharks will lose. I can hardly credit them with much as they have exactly 0 PP points. On the PP, scoring is all there is to it, and they have produced zilcho. If they score 2 and give up 3, it's bad, but scoring less than a goal per game combined for those three doesnt cut it, no matter how you look at it.

You focus too much on just goals. You need to look at points as it is a better indicator of offensive production than singling out goals. A goal has to be scored to record a point so weather it's a goal or an assist is irrevelent. You should also take into consideration goals produced while that line or that player is on the ice, also a better indicator than just looking at goals. A player can be very instrimental in the scoring of a goal an not record a point on the play. There are many, many variables you should consider that go far beyond a single stat.

 

[rares]

You focus too much on just goals. You need to look at points as it is a better indicator of offensive production than singling out goals. A goal has to be scored to record a point so weather it's a goal or an assist is irrevelent. You should also take into consideration goals produced while that line or that player is on the ice, also a better indicator than just looking at goals. A player can be very instrimental in the scoring of a goal an not record a point on the play. There are many, many variables you should consider that go far beyond a single stat.

At least it's better than focusing on +/- stats like he usually does... give him a break!

 

[Cbrower91]

At least it's better than focusing on +/- stats like he usually does... give him a break!

lmao rares! we must be growing as a board because they won by alot and we are still bitching about the players performance

 

[Stackem]

This is starting to feel like off season talk again, but to put rules point in simple terms, do you think you're getting fair return on $21 Mil worth of salary?

I personally don't even have to pause on this one. Absolutely not..

But for the moment, who cares, I'm enjoying the wins...

 

[KillerVee]

we must be growing as a board because they won by alot and we are still bitching about the players performance

Growing like....maturing?

Cause that's the same shit you guys have always done.

 

[filosofy29]

This is starting to feel like off season talk again, but to put rules point in simple terms, do you think you're getting fair return on $21 Mil worth of salary?

I personally don't even have to pause on this one. Absolutely not..

But for the moment, who cares, I'm enjoying the wins...

This ^

 

[TheRobotDevil]

I'm starting to think the devils and sharks boards are related.If I didn't know better I would think I was on the devils board.

 

[Destroydacre]

I like that. Yeah he doesn't even have a letter on his sweater and he is very chirpy to the refs. Kind of odd that Nichol was able to get under his skin, but that's why you gotta love Nichol.

Thornton was a beneficiary of a line change. He came off the bench and no one on the Kings picked him up. Easy skate to the front and Wellwood fed him nicely. Up till this game, I thought Patty and Seto's games were being hurt by playing with Thornton. If Joe can just simplify his game and use his strength and size to do basic things such as winning and controlling pucks, but minus the urge to complete fancy passes, we'll see Marleau and Seto get more chances on net.

True but to Thornton's credit he did go to the front of the net instead of the half wall.

 

[Cmon_WTF]

This is starting to feel like off season talk again, but to put rules point in simple terms, do you think you're getting fair return on $21 Mil worth of salary?

I personally don't even have to pause on this one. Absolutely not..

But for the moment, who cares, I'm enjoying the wins...

It's not really fair to group them all together like that.

From Thornton, yes, I think the Sharks have gotten more than thier money's worth form him so far this post season. If there were a Selke award for the post season he'd easily be one of the front runners.

Heatler, Marleau, and Boyle are a definate, no, with Dany being easily the worst of those three.

 

[sjrules99]

You focus too much on just goals. You need to look at points as it is a better indicator of offensive production than singling out goals. A goal has to be scored to record a point so weather it's a goal or an assist is irrevelent. You should also take into consideration goals produced while that line or that player is on the ice, also a better indicator than just looking at goals. A player can be very instrimental in the scoring of a goal an not record a point on the play. There are many, many variables you should consider that go far beyond a single stat.

OK, then if points are a better indicator then the big 3 have 8 total points. Clowy alone has 7 and add in pavs and couture and you have 15 total, pretty much double the production.

And if you talk about goals produced while a player is on the ice,then that IS +/-, and if you go by that, then still the 4,5,6 guys are a combined +6 vs. the big 3 at EV.

No matter how you slice it, the big 3 are taking a backseat to the middle 3. I would say the 'top' line has been the 3rd best so far with obviously clowe-couture at #1 and pavs' line as #2.

It is kinda sad (or great?) when a line featuring Torrey F'ing Mitchell and Kyle Waiverwood are arguably outperforming a line with Jumbo and Marleau . Certainly, pavs' line has more combined goals and an equal number of combined points to go along with a combined +9.

 

[sjrules99]

On the flip side, it's incredible to see how well clowe and couture are dominating out there. Also, it's amazing how two total castoffs and arguable minor leaguers it would seem like mitchell and wellwood have suddenly gelled into a legit scoring line.

However, thus far, the biggest difference maker for SJ has gotta be White. The sharks controlled the 1st period until he went down and then just hung on to get the dramatic game 1 win. Without him in game two their D looked slow and immobile and the whole team was so bad. Then he comes back, and although he had a pretty bad 1st 21 minutes, he picked it up big time and has been arguably one of the best players the last two games. I look forward to seeing if he can handle the skill and speed of chicago, detroit, or vancouver. It's a whole different animal trying to stop toews-kane-hossa, the sedin twins, or datsyuk-zetterberg-franzen, as opposed to brown-williams-smyth. Nevertheless, He looks like a real keeper that is tailormade for today's post-lockout NHL.

 

[Cmon_WTF]

OK, then if points are a better indicator then the big 3 have 8 total points. Clowy alone has 7 and add in pavs and couture and you have 15 total, pretty much double the production.

And if you talk about goals produced while a player is on the ice,then that IS +/-, and if you go by that, then still the 4,5,6 guys are a combined +6 vs. the big 3 at EV.

No matter how you slice it, the big 3 are taking a backseat to the middle 3. I would say the 'top' line has been the 3rd best so far with obviously clowe-couture at #1 and pavs' line as #2.

It is kinda sad (or great?) when a line featuring Torrey F'ing Mitchell and Kyle Waiverwood are arguably outperforming a line with Jumbo and Marleau . Certainly, pavs' line has more combined goals and an equal number of combined points to go along with a combined +9.

Seto and Marleau have been disappointing IMO and that leads to much of Thornton's scoring woes. But as I said in my previous post, if there were a Selke award for the post season Thornton would be at the top of the list for it. Thornton right now is playing with two guys who games have been lacking this series to say the least.

Pavelski has been the 3rd best player on his line and been an overall disappointment with extremely poor fundimentals and decision making both with and without the puck in the defensive and neutral zone.

Couture and Clowe have been flat out phenominal, especially having to carry that anchor around, but at the same time you have to be aware that much of there success is due to Thornton and Pavelski's line drawing the tougher line and d-pairing match-ups. They have been making a mokery of LA's 3rd line and 3rd pairing dmen.

 

[li0lsh]

Other than seto's OT goal, he has been really disappointing in this series. Trying to be too fancy when entering in the zone producing constant turnovers at the point is no bueno. Good to see jumbo with a goal last night--boy did he need it.

 

[sjrules99]

Seto and Marleau have been disappointing IMO and that leads to much of Thornton's scoring woes. But as I said in my previous post, if there were a Selke award for the post season Thornton would be at the top of the list for it. Thornton right now is playing with two guys who games have been lacking this series to say the least.

Pavelski has been the 3rd best player on his line and been an overall disappointment with extremely poor fundimentals and decision making both with and without the puck in the defensive and neutral zone.

Couture and Clowe have been flat out phenominal, especially having to carry that anchor around, but at the same time you have to be aware that much of there success is due to Thornton and Pavelski's line drawing the tougher line and d-pairing match-ups. They have been making a mokery of LA's 3rd line and 3rd pairing dmen.

Agreed for sure as well about seto. He seems like a younger marleau. Able to be a speedster and has a great shot, but is just way too inconsistent. Obviously, at this point in his career, patty is far better, but I see them as having a similar skill set. Still seto is just 24, which is a solid 3 or 4 years before players usually max out their potential. As such, I am a bit more forgiving for him, and hopefully he'll find his game a bit.

I was really happy to see demers score. I had high hopes of a 35-40 pt season for him this year, and while he was very solid defensively, the offense kinda dried up. If he can be a bit of a threat, that would be really nice.

I agree that jumbo has been fine defensively, but for a player like him, he needs to beat his counterparts, not contain them. His job is not just to not allow goals but to create them too. The goal he got was a serious gift, not so much a great play by him (though a stellar play by wellwood). The only other point he has was a 2nd assist on a great shot-pass from boyle to patty and jumbo really didnt do anything. As such, while he's been fine in his own end, which is an improvement for him, he has been invisible offensively and terribad at best on the PP.

 

[Cmon_WTF]

Agreed for sure as well about seto. He seems like a younger marleau. Able to be a speedster and has a great shot, but is just way too inconsistent. Obviously, at this point in his career, patty is far better, but I see them as having a similar skill set. Still seto is just 24, which is a solid 3 or 4 years before players usually max out their potential. As such, I am a bit more forgiving for him, and hopefully he'll find his game a bit.

I was really happy to see demers score. I had high hopes of a 35-40 pt season for him this year, and while he was very solid defensively, the offense kinda dried up. If he can be a bit of a threat, that would be really nice.

I agree that jumbo has been fine defensively, but for a player like him, he needs to beat his counterparts, not contain them. His job is not just to not allow goals but to create them too. The goal he got was a serious gift, not so much a great play by him (though a stellar play by wellwood). The only other point he has was a 2nd assist on a great shot-pass from boyle to patty and jumbo really didnt do anything. As such, while he's been fine in his own end, which is an improvement for him, he has been invisible offensively and terribad at best on the PP.

It takes an entire line to produce offense, especially in the PO's, and Thornton has been working hard to create chances. He had a bad game 2 (but what Shark didn't) and his puck management in the 1st period of game 3 was vomit worthy, outside of that I like what I've seen out of his offensive game. He's winning battles, he's crashing the net, he's creating chances, but unfortunately has received almost no support from his linemates.