Eagles realease Mathis

[deerpathdave]

You really put no stock in the offseason program? The teams have been at work since April 20th.

Seriously. If you skipped two months of work where every single other employee was showing up, you don't think that it would affect your standing in the organization?

 

[ctc]

Look at the Salary Cap numbers. There are plenty of teams with the space to sign Mathis and several with some critical needs. Plus its not that hard to restructure a contract or two to make some additional space. Teams do it all the time...when they want to.

Anyone with less than $10mm is not a candidate. That leaves about 3 teams.

 

[ctc]

Seriously. If you skipped two months of work where every single other employee was showing up, you don't think that it would affect your standing in the organization?

Running around in your shorts tells you all you need to know about how someone is going to handle, how improved he's gotten in handling a bull rush by a guy that outweighs him by 35lbs doesn't it.

 

[PhillyGreen]

Anyone with less than $10mm is not a candidate. That leaves about 3 teams.

There are 17 teams with at least $9.8 mil. Yes I know it is not $10 mil but $9.8 is close enough but if we are sticking to the actual $10 mil number that leaves still 13 teams.

 

[ctc]

There are 17 teams with at least $9.8 mil. Yes I know it is not $10 mil but $9.8 is close enough but if we are sticking to the actual $10 mil number that leaves still 13 teams.

And of those how many need a guard and value the position enough to pay up?

 

[PhillyGreen]

And of those how many need a guard and value the position enough to pay up?

I honestly have not looked deep enough into that but may when I get a chance. However if the "BEST" guard in the NFL all of a sudden comes available many teams especially SB contenders who do not have a Pro-Bowl Guard should be looking into it.

 

[deerpathdave]

Anyone with less than $10mm is not a candidate. That leaves about 3 teams.

You clearly have no clue how contracts are structured. If they want to pay him top dollar, a team could give him a 4 year deal with a $20M signing bonus and annual salaries, of $1M, $1M, $1M, and $15M. $38M contract over 4 years of which he would only see three of them for $23M. Top dollar for his position. The Salary Cap hit in 2015 would be $6M. That is the absolute upper end.

 

[ctc]

You clearly have no clue how contracts are structured. If they want to pay him top dollar, a team could give him a 4 year deal with a $20M signing bonus and annual salaries, of $1M, $1M, $1M, and $15M. $38M contract over 4 years of which he would only see three of them for $23M. Top dollar for his position. The Salary Cap hit in 2015 would be $6M. That is the absolute upper end.

And that leaves them nothing if players get injured and need to be replaced.

 

[deerpathdave]

Running around in your shorts tells you all you need to know about how someone is going to handle, how improved he's gotten in handling a bull rush by a guy that outweighs him by 35lbs doesn't it.

So I guess the answer is no, you don't value the offseason program. Clearly 99.8% of the players and teams view it differently as they run these programs and get that kind of attendance. Its a big deal and jobs are won and lost in the offseason program all the time. We just don't learn about it til later.

 

[ctc]

So I guess the answer is no, you don't value the offseason program. Clearly 99.8% of the players and teams view it differently as they run these programs and get that kind of attendance. Its a big deal and jobs are won and lost in the offseason program all the time. We just don't learn about it til later.

That you think mere attendance gives u information about one's ability is telling.

 

[PhillyGreen]

And that leaves them nothing if players get injured and need to be replaced.

If I am not mistaken and I could be wrong would probably need a cap guru to confirm but i though there is cap relief for players that are put on IR.

 

[deerpathdave]

And that leaves them nothing if players get injured and need to be replaced.

Your math is way off bud. 17 of these teams have $9.8M or more in space, so even if these threw $6M at Mathis, they still have alot of room. Teams play this cap space game all the time. They could simply tack 2 more artificial years on to the hypothetical Mathis contract and his cap hit goes down another $1.67M to $4.33M If teams want Evan Mathis, they can pay him.

 

[deerpathdave]

That you think mere attendance gives u information about one's ability is telling.

lol. Somehow I think those coaches do a little more than take attendance.

 

[ctc]

Your math is way off bud. 17 of these teams have $9.8M or more in space, so even if these threw $6M at Mathis, they still have alot of room. Teams play this cap space game all the time. They could simply tack 2 more artificial years on to the hypothetical Mathis contract and his cap hit goes down another $1.67M to $4.33M If teams want Evan Mathis, they can pay him.

You're getting desperate.

Only if they're willing to eat a lot of dead money. The guy has 2 maybe 3 years left and you think teams are going to sign him to a 6-7 year deal? PFFFFFFFFFFFT!!!!!!!!!!

The only team that might do that is one that thinks it can win it all this year or next. In the list you've got there's only one team that might do that.

 

[ctc]

lol. Somehow I think those coaches do a little more than take attendance.

You were offering attendance as the metric. Now it's something more?

So how exactly do they evaluate a players ability to handle a bull rush? Looking at the tape Tobin couldn't handle it could he. So how have they determined that now he can?

 

[deerpathdave]

You're getting desperate.

Only if they're willing to eat a lot of dead money. The guy has 2 maybe 3 years left and you think teams are going to sign him to a 6-7 year deal? PFFFFFFFFFFFT!!!!!!!!!!

The only team that might do that is one that thinks it can win it all this year or next. In the list you've got there's only one team that might do that.

Again, you don't seem to get it. These players never see the back end of these deals. The hypothetical deal I put out there would never see years 4-7. It would be cancelled before then. Its all about manipulating the cap room from one year to another. Go read up on the cap a little before you spout off some more.

 

[ctc]

Again, you don't seem to get it. These players never see the back end of these deals. The hypothetical deal I put out there would never see years 4-7. It would be cancelled before then. Its all about manipulating the cap room from one year to another. Go read up on the cap a little before you spout off some more.

If you're signing the guy to a $20mm bonus the backend is irrelevant. They still have to amortize the bonus in a balloon if he retires or they cut him.

 

[deerpathdave]

You were offering attendance as the metric. Now it's something more?

So how exactly do they evaluate a players ability to handle a bull rush? Looking at the tape Tobin couldn't handle it could he. So how have they determined that now he can?

I offered the metric as proof that the teams and players value this time and put a ton of time and effort into it. As far as how they evaluate, alot of this stuff is closely held info. We can only speculate. I am of the opinion (but don't know) that alot of this weight room and "classroom" time probably gets alot more physical than anyone is willing to admit.

 

[deerpathdave]

If you're signing the guy to a $20mm bonus the backend is irrelevant. They still have to amortize the bonus in a balloon if he retires or they cut him.

Yes...now you seem to be catching on. Teams routinely shift cap space from year to year with this approach. They can use cap space from future (and past) years and do all the time.

 

[ctc]

Yes...now you seem to be catching on. Teams routinely shift cap space from year to year with this approach. They can use cap space from future (and past) years and do all the time.

Well then my point stands that no team, save perhaps one that thinks it can win now, will be willing to eat $12-$15mm in dead money when he's gone in two years.