dance of joy

[ckhokie]

Who knew, with all the disagreements between flamingrey and myself, that politics of all things would be what we agree on. I've been in favor of term limits for Congress forever. You're right, it won't happen.

I think everyone is. But lets think for a second who would be the ones actually making that law...

 

[flamingrey]

My point had nothing to do with '47%' but was just making mention to the common misconception that most people pay Federal income tax, which they do not. The wealthy already are taking the lion share of the tax burden. Should the ultra wealthy pay more, absolutely. But let's not discount the fact that most Americans pay nothing more than FICA taxes to the federal government.

Yeah, I understood you. A good portion of the response was more rant than rebuttal. It obviously didn't come off that way.

When you look at the "tax burden", you have to look at percentages, not total income. While the wealthy do pay a lions share of the tax burden, they also have a lions share of the wealth. The wealthy could pay 1% of their taxes and they'd still be taking most of the tax burden.

 

[JBUCK66]

A bad day for Trump is a good day for the masses

Health care for all. It's a good thing. Bare minimal of what gov. can do. America is not the same....it's a change, and a good one

..plus if we can just squeeze some cash out of the filthy rich, we could polish up this country. Don't give me no capitalist drivel either.

 

[DanBengalfan]

The combined wealth of our countries billionaires still wouldn't be enough to cover our nations annual budget deficit. That's the insanity of it all.

 

[bengaldoug]

In 2010, from the IRS website, the top one percent earned 20% of all income, and paid 38% of all income taxes. So what is their "fair share?"

 

[DanBengalfan]

no one wants to draw a line in the sand or name a number.

that's the problem.

Just waste more money on stupid s*** and bitch about how no one wants to pay for it

 

[flamingrey]

In 2010, from the IRS website, the top one percent earned 20% of all income, and paid 38% of all income taxes. So what is their "fair share?"

It's not surprising when you consider 47% of people do not pay any federal taxes as already discussed. So, essentially, you aren't looking at 100% of the income, so it more heavily skews the numbers.

Moreover, the only way to know the significance of that 38% number is determine what their total income was and compare that to how much of the total taxes the "middle class" would pay with the same total income. In effect, what percentage of ALL income taxes would the "middle class" - based on the weighted average of their tax percentage - have paid with that same income. More or less than that 38%? How much more or less?

And I put "middle class" in quotes because in order to determine what their weighted average is, first you have to define "middle class". Not so easy.

At that point, then you can start factoring in things like political clout, burden of the taxes, overall benefits of the system, etc.

End of the day, without the full story, that 38% number has little significance, but it makes a great talking point. Just like that 47% number makes a great sound bite for politicians.

 

[bengaldoug]

no one wants to draw a line in the sand or name a number.

that's the problem.

Just waste more money on stupid s*** and bitch about how no one wants to pay for it

They need to quit wasting money. The federal government's Robin Hood mentality has fostered laziness among the 47% who don't pay income taxes. These people should take initiative to take care of themselves. I'm not saying that they should pay the same rate as the top 1% do, but everyone should have a share in taxes. The bottom 50% earn about 12% of all income, and I don't think it would be wrong for them to assume at least 6% of the income tax burden.

The FICA tax is a complete waste. The average person could take that and invest it for himself and do much better than he can on Social Security. Social Security as it is now is nothing more than a ponzi scheme, because our government has spent that money on other things. And it's the FICA tax that destroys the lower income earners. A person who works for the average median income his whole working career will make approximately $1.3 million for his working career and will pay about $200k in FICA taxes through that time, including the employer's match. At the average rate of increase over that 40 years time just investing in a conservative mutuel fund the average guy could retire a millionaire, yet his Social Security "benefits" must be supplemented with additional investments or he must work until he dies. What a ripoff.

 

[flamingrey]

They need to quit wasting money. The federal government's Robin Hood mentality has fostered laziness among the 47% who don't pay income taxes. These people should take initiative to take care of themselves. I'm not saying that they should pay the same rate as the top 1% do, but everyone should have a share in taxes.

Ignorant statement.

Nonetheless, no different than corporate welfare.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

They need to quit wasting money. The federal government's Robin Hood mentality has fostered laziness among the 47% who don't pay income taxes. These people should take initiative to take care of themselves. I'm not saying that they should pay the same rate as the top 1% do, but everyone should have a share in taxes. The bottom 50% earn about 12% of all income, and I don't think it would be wrong for them to assume at least 6% of the income tax burden.

The FICA tax is a complete waste. The average person could take that and invest it for himself and do much better than he can on Social Security. Social Security as it is now is nothing more than a ponzi scheme, because our government has spent that money on other things. And it's the FICA tax that destroys the lower income earners. A person who works for the average median income his whole working career will make approximately $1.3 million for his working career and will pay about $200k in FICA taxes through that time, including the employer's match. At the average rate of increase over that 40 years time just investing in a conservative mutuel fund the average guy could retire a millionaire, yet his Social Security "benefits" must be supplemented with additional investments or he must work until he dies. What a ripoff.

I am in that bottom 47%. Me and my wife with our deductions do not pay Federal income tax because combined we only make about $38,000 total. I have owned my own company for 15 years, not big by any means, but been able to stay in business and raise my two kids myself as a stay at home dad. My wife works at a bank and works her 40 hours a week. We do not take a single penny of assistance from the State of Ohio or the Federal government outside our standard deductions and I have a hard time calling us lazy Americans.

Even when the State of Ohio was forcing me to lead abate my house or they would kick me out of my home, I racked up my personal debt another 18,000 for a 60,000 house without recieving a penny of assistance from anyone.

So while I appreciate your opinion, I have to wholeheartedly disagree with it.

 

[DanBengalfan]

for the record, the 47% thing kinda bothers me, there's a lot of assumptions built into that:

FactCheck.org : Dependency and Romney’s 47 Percenters

 

[JBUCK66]

taxing the wealthy WILL help


don't kid yourselves........oh yea, they are not worried about your health or well being. They got the repubs totally snockered


America has no History. We are a shopping center

Home of the brave.....just words... land of the free

yea......what does that even mean? 99% of people think they are free

 

[flamingrey]

Simply allowing Bush's tax cuts to expire would generate as much revenue as taxing the 47%. You wouldn't be raising taxes, just allowing some cuts to expire.

 

[flamingrey]

I am in that bottom 47%. Me and my wife with our deductions do not pay Federal income tax because combined we only make about $38,000 total. I have owned my own company for 15 years, not big by any means, but been able to stay in business and raise my two kids myself as a stay at home dad. My wife works at a bank and works her 40 hours a week. We do not take a single penny of assistance from the State of Ohio or the Federal government outside our standard deductions and I have a hard time calling us lazy Americans.

Even when the State of Ohio was forcing me to lead abate my house or they would kick me out of my home, I racked up my personal debt another 18,000 for a 60,000 house without recieving a penny of assistance from anyone.

So while I appreciate your opinion, I have to wholeheartedly disagree with it.

Just admit it, you're lazy.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

Just admit it, you're lazy.

Okay fine. I am lazy!!

 

[flamingrey]

Myth: Welfare increases poverty

 

[CrashDavisSports]

Myth: Welfare increases poverty

You're right, I am lazy. There is no way in hell I am spending my time reading all of that article! lol