Cole to Astros

[Calm]

Is saying that what Gonzalez did almost 10 years ago isn't gonna help him right now just an "uneducated guess" too? I guess if what happened a long time ago makes you automatically still better right now than legends like Roger Clemens, John Smoltz, Greg Maddux, Sandy Koufax and those guys must still be better in 2018 than Gerrit Cole is in 2018 too?

You just completely ignoring last year or what?

 

[lilchi721]

That guy Dallas Keuchel is a pretty good pitcher.

Forgot about Keuchel but can he stay healthy?

 

[lilchi721]

Keuchel

But can you trust him to stay healthy

 

[DirtDirtDirt]

I think the Pirates are really overplaying their hand here

They are demanding a Chris Sale type package for Gerrit Cole

 

[soxfan1468927]

But can you trust him to stay healthy

No but I would still call him an ace.

 

[soxfan1468927]

Soundtrack of my youth

Id play "Theres no easy way out" on loop for like an entire summer

Pretty sure Paulie was having sex with that robot by the end of it too

 

[Mike A. S.]

You just completely ignoring last year or what?

So one can has a slightly down year and that means that someone that was best 5-8 years ago is automatically better now? As I said a long time ago it is a matter of opinion but I don't think that because Cole was slightly down last year and Gonzalez was slightly up last year that that means Gonzalez is better now and for the next couple years. A year from now if we look back at this post it's gonna be even more obvious about which one of these guys is better.

 

[tducey]

Cole should be a good pickup for Houston. Also as a Red Sox fan hope they do get Martinez. Be another good bat in that lineup.

 

[Mike A. S.]

You just completely ignoring last year or what?

And should we assume Robbie Ray is better than Chris Sale now? He had a better ERA last year as well.

 

[navamind]

I think it's good get for the Astros since they do need an ace pitcher

Too bad he isn't an ace.

 

[navamind]

Forgot about Keuchel but can he stay healthy?

Cole missed 10+ starts in 2016 and 2014. You can question Keuchel's durability, but Cole isn't any better in that regard. And unlike Cole, Keuchel has actually pitched like an ace outside of one season.

 

[soxfan1468927]

And should we assume Robbie Ray is better than Chris Sale now? He had a better ERA last year as well.

You should learn to have a discussion without comments like this. All it does is change the conversation completely. Obviously the situations aren't close to the same.

 

[Mike A. S.]

You should learn to have a discussion without comments like this. All it does is change the conversation completely. Obviously the situations aren't close to the same.

I sometimes intentionally say ridiculous comments like that just to prove a point. Like in this case that one season doesn't mean someone is better. And that there are so many things to consider on what was even a better season. Obviously there's more than just ERA and I don't think anyone really believes that Ray's season was better than Sale's either, myself included. I'm just trying to say one season doesn't make or break things. And I don't think going back 5+ years matters much for who's better right now either. If we're talking who has had a better career so far than I would definitely agree with you that it's Gonzalez so far, but that's a different discussion.

 

[soxfan1468927]

I sometimes intentionally say ridiculous comments like that just to prove a point. Like in this case that one season doesn't mean someone is better. And that there are so many things to consider on what was even a better season. Obviously there's more than just ERA and I don't think anyone really believes that Ray's season was better than Sale's either, myself included. I'm just trying to say one season doesn't make or break things. And I don't think going back 5+ years matters much for who's better right now either. If we're talking who has had a better career so far than I would definitely agree with you that it's Gonzalez so far, but that's a different discussion.

I got your point. I stopped discussing because disingenuous replies just serve to annoy, they don't prove a point. As you admitted, you know that Ray's season wasn't actually better than Sale's. But you know that Gonzalez's season was better than Cole's. You also know that Sale has a better track record than Ray and you know that Gonzalez has a better track record than Cole. So the comparison, as you already know, was ludicrous. The situations aren't nearly the same so it does nothing to advance your point. It merely distracts.

 

[Mike A. S.]

I got your point. I stopped discussing because disingenuous replies just serve to annoy, they don't prove a point. As you admitted, you know that Ray's season wasn't actually better than Sale's. But you know that Gonzalez's season was better than Cole's. You also know that Sale has a better track record than Ray and you know that Gonzalez has a better track record than Cole. So the comparison, as you already know, was ludicrous. The situations aren't nearly the same so it does nothing to advance your point. It merely distracts.

Yeah, I don't think Ray's was better than Sale's. Yes, I admit Gonzalez's season was better than Cole's but I still don't think that means he's better even "right now". I guarantee I could find an example of a player that I thought legitimately had a better season than another just last year and still isn't as good "right now" anyway.

 

[JohnU]

I got your point. I stopped discussing because disingenuous replies just serve to annoy, they don't prove a point. As you admitted, you know that Ray's season wasn't actually better than Sale's. But you know that Gonzalez's season was better than Cole's. You also know that Sale has a better track record than Ray and you know that Gonzalez has a better track record than Cole. So the comparison, as you already know, was ludicrous. The situations aren't nearly the same so it does nothing to advance your point. It merely distracts.

I just read most of this and other than trying to decide whether Gonzalez is better than Cole, is Gio Gonzalez part of a trade involving Cole? I can't quite decide why this debate has continued.

 

[soxfan1468927]

Yeah, I don't think Ray's was better than Sale's. Yes, I admit Gonzalez's season was better than Cole's but I still don't think that means he's better even "right now". I guarantee I could find an example of a player that I thought legitimately had a better season than another just last year and still isn't as good "right now" anyway.

That's fine, I didn't make that one-season argument. I'm just telling you, throwing out analogies that you don't even believe in yourself is no way to win an argument.

 

[UK Cowboy]

Completely depends on what the Astros gave up. Cole isn't that good.

He's not?

 

[soxfan1468927]

He's not?

No.

 

[Mike A. S.]

That's fine, I didn't make that one-season argument. I'm just telling you, throwing out analogies that you don't even believe in yourself is no way to win an argument.

Those comments serve to prove a point, if they can prove that point than they can help win an argument.