Brett gardner gets 13 mill a year?

[gowazzu02]

Good lord. Cano at 25 is a bargain if the brett gardners of the world are getting 13!

 

[unlvmariners]

Maybe a little over priced but I wouldn't have a problem with a contract for a Brett Gardner type player in the $10-$13M per range.

 

[Logicallylethal]

Brett Gardner is essentially a healthy Guti without the power or Ackley if he ever decides to be more aggressive on the base paths

I understand his value with his speed and the gloves...but if I'm going to spend 13 mil a year I would rather spend it on a good hitter with okay defense than an okay hitter with good defense

 

[gowazzu02]

This is always why I just laugh at people who laud the yankees for their home grown and kept products like jeeter, bernie and mo.

Of course they were able to keep them, because they didn't have to battle the yankees overpaying in free agency.

 

[seattlefan75]

This is why its so hard to sign free agents when you over pay for mediocre players like gardner that get $50mil the good players will ask for $100 mil contracts. If michael saunders put up ellsbury numbers he would be asking for a TON of money

 

[Logicallylethal]

It's crazy how many people on the mlb general board are defending this contract and brett gardner

 

[NWinAZ]

I don't see an issue with it. Look how hard we have been looking to find one legit MLB OF over the years. They got their guy and $13M is almost half of some of these other free agents got and they got him on a shorter term. Fans have to take the money element out of it because owners aren't exactly going bankrupt. It is about adding talent and he is talent. I would take him over any of our OF's in a heartbeat.

Santana wants 4/$50M and fans go nuts saying no way. Why the heck not? Look what we have currently and you are telling me he couldn't improve the rotation? M's to make billions on TV deal so it won't hurt there. Yes they have to give up a pick, but it isn't like we have been so hot on drafting anyways. I will take a MLB player over an unknown TBD draft pick any day. Even known, top end draft picks haven't produced much for us in like...forever.

 

[StanMarsh51]

It's crazy how many people on the mlb general board are defending this contract and brett gardner

His past 3 full seasons he's averaged a 5.2 WAR...how much do you think a 5 WAR player is worth?

Look at comparable players who recently signed contracts:
Coco Crisp signed for $11.5M a season
Michael Bourn signed for $12M a season
Ellsbury signed for $21+M season

When Austin Jackson (who is also a comparable player) nears free agency or becomes one, he'll probably get a similar deal.


So how is Gardner's contract out of this world when it's right about where the market has valued that type of player based on the other guys listed?

 

[gowazzu02]

His past 3 full seasons he's averaged a 5.2 WAR...how much do you think a 5 WAR player is worth?

Look at comparable players who recently signed contracts:
Coco Crisp signed for $11.5M a season
Michael Bourn signed for $12M a season
Ellsbury signed for $21+M season

When Austin Jackson (who is also a comparable player) nears free agency or becomes one, he'll probably get a similar deal.


So how is Gardner's contract out of this world when it's right about where the market has valued that type of player based on the other guys listed?

I still dont understand WAR.

All I know is when you get a guy of Gardners talent and give him this type of contract, it drives the market up for the real talent thats out there. and forces them to leave wherever their at and go to the NY, bos, LA teams because their the only ones who can afford them. Ahhh baseball..........

 

[StanMarsh51]

I still dont understand WAR.

All I know is when you get a guy of Gardners talent and give him this type of contract, it drives the market up for the real talent thats out there. and forces them to leave wherever their at and go to the NY, bos, LA teams because their the only ones who can afford them. Ahhh baseball..........

The market price for that caliber player was already driven up well before Gardner signed his deal, and some of those teams that contributed towards it weren't 'big market teams'....

Last year, the 3 comparable players who signed 3+ year deals for $10+M per season:
-Indians signed Bourn for $12M per season
-Giants signed Pagan for $10M per season
-Red Sox signed Victorino for $13M per season

You can also lump BJ Upton in there (he had more power than those guys but probably wasn't as good overall), as he got $15M a season from the Braves.


So a number of those teams that hand out those deals I wouldn't characterize as 'big market teams' who are taking all the talent.

 

[NWinAZ]

Yup, yup.

 

[Logicallylethal]

I'm not a big fan of WAR to be honest. I think it values defense way too much in a game where hitting and pitching are much bigger contributors to the game.

In my opinion...defense in baseball is equivalent to special teams in football. If you are already a good team with a good foundation...having great defense may push you over the top.

But if you are a team missing the main elements to be successful...there is no way you can win by building a team around guys who can't really hit but are fast and can play defense

At the end of the day if your pitching is terrible it doesn't matter if you have 3 Ken Griffey Jrs out there in the outfield.

 

[Logicallylethal]

His past 3 full seasons he's averaged a 5.2 WAR...how much do you think a 5 WAR player is worth?

Look at comparable players who recently signed contracts:
Coco Crisp signed for $11.5M a season
Michael Bourn signed for $12M a season
Ellsbury signed for $21+M season

When Austin Jackson (who is also a comparable player) nears free agency or becomes one, he'll probably get a similar deal.


So how is Gardner's contract out of this world when it's right about where the market has valued that type of player based on the other guys listed?

I don't think those guys deserve that money to begin with.

 

[cezero]

Gardner is worth 11-13, imo.

WAR is invaluable as a measuring tool. You won't find a competent organization that doesn't place a premium on consistent high WAR and UZR. Old schoolers have a hard time with it, despite seeing how ignoring it or undervaluing it "pays off"...Mariners for the past decade, cough.

 

[Tacoma_canuck]

I don't think it effects the market as much as people think. Maybe a decade ago you could say that but these days, contracts like this are pretty common. I would take a guy like Gardner over B.J. Upton any day. The guy is an average hitter but didn't he have a pretty good OBP? I seem to remember hearing or reading that somewhere last year. Anyway, he has great speed and is a very good defensive player. Not a good fit for some teams maybe, if they need production but not a terrible signing when it's the Yanks. That 13M translates to about 5M for most small market teams.