POLL Better Michigan head football coach

[THUNDER]

Who ya got?

Fielding H. Yost

165-29-10

 

[Across The Field]

He was still transitioning though, very similar thing happened at WVU. It took a few years for that offense to get everything and even then there was an argument that he needed better OL players. The thought was Pryor was pretty much a lock for WVU had RR stayed but... didn't happen and that was on WVU.

I had heard that TP talk back when he was a recruit, but I don't put a lot of stock into it. RR was after him hard when he went to michigan, which had basically unlimited resources and could build a better team around him, and he still chose OSU.

At any rate, though, we saw what OSU was with TP - a pretty good team, but not an ultra-elite one. When you look at the games he lost in his last few years at WVU when they were elite, they were low-scoring games against physical defenses. South Florida beat him in his last two years, for example, as did Pitt. Same with VT in 05. Those are the types of defenses RR was facing in the B1G. It's the main reason Ohio State clobbered Oregon in the NCG. We beat them by 22 points despite turning the ball over 4 times. They ran a similar RR-type of spread that year, and it worked against most of their opponents, but when they faced an aggressive, physical defense, they were flustered and couldn't make it work.

 

[ericd7633]

I had heard that TP talk back when he was a recruit, but I don't put a lot of stock into it. RR was after him hard when he went to michigan, which had basically unlimited resources and could build a better team around him, and he still chose OSU.

At any rate, though, we saw what OSU was with TP - a pretty good team, but not an ultra-elite one. When you look at the games he lost in his last few years at WVU when they were elite, they were low-scoring games against physical defenses. South Florida beat him in his last two years, for example, as did Pitt. Same with VT in 05. Those are the types of defenses RR was facing in the B1G. It's the main reason Ohio State clobbered Oregon in the NCG. We beat them by 22 points despite turning the ball over 4 times. They ran a similar RR-type of spread that year, and it worked against most of their opponents, but when they faced an aggressive, physical defense, they were flustered and couldn't make it work.

Lol. They avg 47 ppg against Michigan State, Utah and Stanford who were more efficient on defense that year than OSU was. That wasn't a great OSU defense that year, although they did play great in that game.

 

[Across The Field]

Lol. They avg 47 ppg against Michigan State, Utah and Stanford who were more efficient on defense that year than OSU was. That wasn't a great OSU defense that year, although they did play great in that game.

Every single starter on the 2014 OSU defense played/is playing in the NFL, and 9 of them were drafted. That doesn't include the numerous backups who also played meaningful snaps that were drafted early. 11 guys from the defensive 3 deep were drafted in the first 3 rounds of the NFL draft. If you don't think that was an outstanding defense, you are flatout wrong. They weren't necessarily elite, but they were insanely talented. Efficiency doesn't automatically mean better, unless you're also telling me that 2014 Utah State was also a better defense than 2014 Georgia.

Oregon also had the Heisman-trophy winning QB and tons of weapons. I'm not saying they were a bad offense, I'm saying that running that style of offense doesn't mean you're going to be successful against everyone. OSU had a full season of film on that Oregon offense to watch, and they responded by stifling them for the majority of the game. Other than the opening drive and one big play that went for a TD, Oregon couldn't do much. It's the same reason why michigan had Denard Robinson running the RR offense as it was designed for a good amount of the 2010 season but couldn't do shit against OSU.

 

[ericd7633]

Every single starter on the 2014 OSU defense played/is playing in the NFL, and 9 of them were drafted. That doesn't include the numerous backups who also played meaningful snaps that were drafted early. 11 guys from the defensive 3 deep were drafted in the first 3 rounds of the NFL draft. If you don't think that was an outstanding defense, you are flatout wrong. They weren't necessarily elite, but they were insanely talented. Efficiency doesn't automatically mean better, unless you're also telling me that 2014 Utah State was also a better defense than 2014 Georgia.

Oregon also had the Heisman-trophy winning QB and tons of weapons. I'm not saying they were a bad offense, I'm saying that running that style of offense doesn't mean you're going to be successful against everyone. OSU had a full season of film on that Oregon offense to watch, and they responded by stifling them for the majority of the game. Other than the opening drive and one big play that went for a TD, Oregon couldn't do much. It's the same reason why michigan had Denard Robinson running the RR offense as it was designed for a good amount of the 2010 season but couldn't do shit against OSU.

They were pretty much successful against everyone though. Like I said they avg 47 ppg against those teams I listed. Stanford was the #2 scoring defense in the country and they put up 45 against them. And yeah, OSU had great talent, but that didn't really translate to on the field results. With the exception of the game against Oregon.

You just made a blanket statement about them, which wasn't true.

 

[Across The Field]

They were pretty much successful against everyone though. Like I said they avg 47 ppg against those teams I listed. Stanford was the #2 scoring defense in the country and they put up 45 against them. And yeah, OSU had great talent, but that didn't really translate to on the field results. With the exception of the game against Oregon.

You just made a blanket statement about them, which wasn't true.

It's not like they shutout another top national offense in Wisconsin or anything either. Ohio State had one of the top defenses in the nation in 2014, even in the efficiency rankings.

Oregon was successful playing in a conference that isn't exactly daunting from a defensive standpoint. They did a great job jumping on Michigan State early in the year. Clearly Dantonio was sorely out-coached. However, that style of offense just won't work long-term in the B1G. Again, there's a reason you don't see it. Take a look at what RR's offense at Ole Miss looked like last year against tough defenses in the SEC. 62nd in the nation in efficiency, and that was with a mobile QB with 1,000+ yards rushing.

 

[ericd7633]

It's not like they shutout another top national offense in Wisconsin or anything either. Ohio State had one of the top defenses in the nation in 2014, even in the efficiency rankings.

Oregon was successful playing in a conference that isn't exactly daunting from a defensive standpoint. They did a great job jumping on Michigan State early in the year. Clearly Dantonio was sorely out-coached. However, that style of offense just won't work long-term in the B1G. Again, there's a reason you don't see it. Take a look at what RR's offense at Ole Miss looked like last year against tough defenses in the SEC. 62nd in the nation in efficiency, and that was with a mobile QB with 1,000+ yards rushing.

Yeah, OSU was very good in 2014 on defense. I wouldn't call them elite or anything(talent notwithstanding). 26th in scoring defense, 16th in efficiency. My point though was you suggesting Oregon struggled with "physical, aggressive" defenses, which wasn't the case. They avg 41 ppg against the top 5 defenses they faced that season. They were pretty clearly the best offense in the country that season. And it's not like the Pac 12 had bad defenses that season. They actually had more top 25 defenses than the B1G did that year.

 

[ericd7633]

Yeah, OSU was very good in 2014 on defense. I wouldn't call them elite or anything(talent notwithstanding). 26th in scoring defense, 16th in efficiency. My point though was you suggesting Oregon struggled with "physical, aggressive" defenses, which wasn't the case. They avg 41 ppg against the top 5 defenses they faced that season. They were pretty clearly the best offense in the country that season. And it's not like the Pac 12 had bad defenses that season. They actually had more top 25 defenses than the B1G did that year.

As for RR last year, they were severely outmatched in terms of talent. They only returned 3 offensive starters from the previous team. If you give him the 2018 roster, they are no doubt a top 10 offense. @Across The Field

 

[Across The Field]

As for RR last year, they were severely outmatched in terms of talent. They only returned 3 offensive starters from the previous team. If you give him the 2018 roster, they are no doubt a top 10 offense. @Across The Field

Is that a joke?

QB:
Matt Corral - 4*
John Rhys Plumlee - 4*

RB:
Jerrion Ealy - 5*

WR:
Elijah Moore - 4*
Miles Battle - 4*

I know I'm missing more. It's ignorant to act like Ole Miss doesn't have talent. That's arguably the most talent roster he's ever coached.

 

[Across The Field]

Yeah, OSU was very good in 2014 on defense. I wouldn't call them elite or anything(talent notwithstanding). 26th in scoring defense, 16th in efficiency. My point though was you suggesting Oregon struggled with "physical, aggressive" defenses, which wasn't the case. They avg 41 ppg against the top 5 defenses they faced that season. They were pretty clearly the best offense in the country that season. And it's not like the Pac 12 had bad defenses that season. They actually had more top 25 defenses than the B1G did that year.

I actually never said Oregon struggled that year with physical, aggressive defenses. I said RR's offenses have, and that's true. Oregon's offense struggled against OSU because it was the most talented defense they faced all year, and clearly Urban had done his homework and knew exactly how to shut Oregon down.

Again, there's a reason you don't see offenses like that succeed in the B1G. Or the SEC, for that matter. You don't see teams win national titles with them, either, which is why RR isn't a HC anywhere anymore.

 

[ericd7633]

Is that a joke?

QB:
Matt Corral - 4*
John Rhys Plumlee - 4*

RB:
Jerrion Ealy - 5*

WR:
Elijah Moore - 4*
Miles Battle - 4*

I know I'm missing more. It's ignorant to act like Ole Miss doesn't have talent. That's arguably the most talent roster he's ever coached.

Their recruiting ranks in the SEC:

2016 #3(with no Patterson, Brown, Metcalf, Little, Nixon, 5 of their top 6 offensive recruits)
2017 #12
2018 #10
2019 #9

So yes, they had bottom half SEC talent, last year. Not to mention losing basically everyone from the previous year.

 

[ericd7633]

It's the main reason Ohio State clobbered Oregon in the NCG. We beat them by 22 points despite turning the ball over 4 times. They ran a similar RR-type of spread that year, and it worked against most of their opponents, but when they faced an aggressive, physical defense, they were flustered and couldn't make it work.

I actually never said Oregon struggled that year with physical, aggressive defenses. I said RR's offenses have, and that's true. Oregon's offense struggled against OSU because it was the most talented defense they faced all year, and clearly Urban had done his homework and knew exactly how to shut Oregon down.

Again, there's a reason you don't see offenses like that succeed in the B1G. Or the SEC, for that matter. You don't see teams win national titles with them, either, which is why RR isn't a HC anywhere anymore.

It certainly appeared that is what you said. As for RR his offense was very good his last year(despite being bad against OSU). Shame we didn't get to find out what it could have been like in 2011. Would have been even better IMO.

 

[Across The Field]

Their recruiting ranks in the SEC:

2016 #3(with no Patterson, Brown, Metcalf, Little, Nixon, 5 of their top 6 offensive recruits)
2017 #12
2018 #10
2019 #9

So yes, they had bottom half SEC talent, last year. Not to mention losing basically everyone from the previous year.

Those were also ranked in the top 30 nationally, so we're not talking like he was trying to win with Vanderbilt's talent. He still had 4/5* guys but couldn't do much with them. Missouri beat them by two scores and they averaged 13th in the SEC in that timeframe, btw.

 

[Across The Field]

It certainly appeared that is what you said. As for RR his offense was very good his last year(despite being bad against OSU). Shame we didn't get to find out what it could have been like in 2011. Would have been even better IMO.

They struggled against our defense because that's what it was. We had the most aggressive, physical defense they faced that year.

His offense was decent his final year. Lots of points scored when teams were already blowing them out and taking their foot off the gas. Pretty clear that's not the type of offense that is going to be good enough to win the conference. We had way more trouble with their offenses the last couple of years than RR's offenses.

 

[ericd7633]

Those were also ranked in the top 30 nationally, so we're not talking like he was trying to win with Vanderbilt's talent. He still had 4/5* guys but couldn't do much with them. Missouri beat them by two scores and they averaged 13th in the SEC in that timeframe, btw.

Those guys you mentioned were all TR FR or SO. SEC had 14 guys drafted on defense in the first two rounds. They also had a total of two 4 star OL recruits on the roster, one was a RS JR backup the other a TR FR(who redshirted). Also, the 18 and 19 classes weren't top 30. Like I said they were at a clear disadvantage in terms of talent.

 

[ericd7633]

They struggled against our defense because that's what it was. We had the most aggressive, physical defense they faced that year.

His offense was decent his final year. Lots of points scored when teams were already blowing them out and taking their foot off the gas. Pretty clear that's not the type of offense that is going to be good enough to win the conference. We had way more trouble with their offenses the last couple of years than RR's offenses.

That's already been proven false. Their offense was definitely good enough to win the conference, defense was the huge issue.

 

[Winged_Wheel88]

Potato Salad.

 

[Across The Field]

Those guys you mentioned were all TR FR or SO. SEC had 14 guys drafted on defense in the first two rounds. They also had a total of two 4 star OL recruits on the roster, one was a RS JR backup the other a TR FR(who redshirted). Also, the 18 and 19 classes weren't top 30. Like I said they were at a clear disadvantage in terms of talent.

Their average class those three years was ranked 28th overall nationally. They still had highly rated players on his offense and he mustered the 62nd ranked offense. They couldn't even put up numbers against Cal or Memphis. What was the average rank of those recruiting classes?

 

[Across The Field]

That's already been proven false. Their offense was definitely good enough to win the conference, defense was the huge issue.

Tell me how they were going to win the conference scoring 7 points against Ohio State.

 

[ericd7633]

Their average class those three years was ranked 28th overall nationally. They still had highly rated players on his offense and he mustered the 62nd ranked offense. They couldn't even put up numbers against Cal or Memphis. What was the average rank of those recruiting classes?

They had an awful O-line. Out of those highly rated players only 3 were on the field. 2 were TR FR. Cal had a good defense last year. Ole Miss was the first game of the season. They actually improved quite a bit on offense as the season went on, based on how poorly they played against Memphis. Either way, they were still severely outmatched in talent. Having an offense a 2 four stars and a 5 star RB going up against those teams doesn't mean much.