AAA Texas 500

[Bandwagonbo2]

Well, damn could Jeff Gordon not have cause a serious accident when he knocked Rusty Wallace out of the way at Bristol in the early 2000's?

Let me ask you this. Phoenix in 2012, who was the bad guy, Jeff Gordon or Clint Bowyer?

Brad needed a win to advance, he should be going all out for the win. Harvick is in a similar position as Brad, that's why he bumped Brad out of the way for second.

You do know that Bristol is where lots of issues like that happen,right. Thats why its one of the biggest sought after tickets. Its known if you are in the lead, that you will get bumped. Seen Sr. do it many times at that track, so i guess Sr. is a dirty driver too huh?

 

[Chewbaccer]

The roles would not have been reversed and thats where you fail in your argument. No way Gordon or 90% of the other drivers on that track try to do what Brad did at that point. Thats what we are trying to get across to you. He intentionally tried to create a hole where a car was and he ended up causing a fellow chaser to finish a lap down due to that stupid ass move. No one wants to race with a guy who does not respect the other drivers on the track enough to race them clean. Its coming and whats funny is Hendrick has three drivers not in the chase that can deal the blow and it not hurt their chances. Kahne could do it and it look like a racing accident because he has had enough of them in the last few weeks.

Gordon was in position to be content with running third. He had a 2nd last week. Keselowski lost a transmission last week and finished 30th. With this Chase format, it's gonna breed aggressive racing from desperate drivers. The points are bunched up now, but at the time it looked like Brad K needed a win to advance.

 

[4down20]

.....really?

If anyone wants to see what a line is, compare the distance between Gordon and Johnson through the turn. You'll see that it really doesn't change very much. At the same time, you can see that Brad wasn't even clear of Johnsons left side when he touched Gordon. It's very clear Gordon was on the 2nd line.

It's also clear that Brad didn't want to lift and lose the run he had and that is why he did it. Seen it 1000's of times in sim racing, and it's always frowned upon. Repeated incidents like this gets people thrown out of leagues.

 

[Bandwagonbo2]

Jr is quiet, but he is a really nice and humble guy. I raced online with him a good bit back in the years. It's why he's my favorite driver. I raced with Martin Truex Jr way too much, and he was a huge cry baby. I don't care for him at all.

I have been out to his house outside of Kannapolis area. He is an alright guy, but you get the feeling he doesnt want to be troubled with most people.

Sr's wife is a total bitch. from what I've seen of her. I was chatting with one of Jr's crew members one day and he said Jr. is not a big fan of hers and talks bad about her all the time. Dont know if thats true, but thats what i heard.

 

[Chewbaccer]

You do know that Bristol is where lots of issues like that happen,right. Thats why its one of the biggest sought after tickets. Its known if you are in the lead, that you will get bumped. Seen Sr. do it many times at that track, so i guess Sr. is a dirty driver too huh?

I'm not calling Jeff Gordon anyone a dirty driver.

You're the one doing that.

But, Phoenix 2012, who's the bad guy, Jeff Gordon or Clint Bowyer?

 

[Chewbaccer]

If anyone wants to see what a line is, compare the distance between Gordon and Johnson through the turn. You'll see that it really doesn't change very much. At the same time, you can see that Brad wasn't even clear of Johnsons left side when he touched Gordon. It's very clear Gordon was on the 2nd line.

It's also clear that Brad didn't want to lift and lose the run he had and that is why he did it. Seen it 1000's of times in sim racing, and it's always frowned upon. Repeated incidents like this gets people thrown out of leagues.

Watch again. Jeff moved up the track for a moment before entering the turn opening up the hole for Keselowski. Jeff didn't close the hole fast enough. When Brad made his move, Gordon was over a lane away from Johnson, when contact was made, he was right b y Johnson's door. It was a racing accident and should go down as one, but Jeff Gordon moved down on Brad Keselowski.

 

[Bandwagonbo2]

I'm not calling Jeff Gordon anyone a dirty driver.

You're the one doing that.

But, Phoenix 2012, who's the bad guy, Jeff Gordon or Clint Bowyer?

I would have to go back and look at the race, but I know that Bowyer and Gordon have had issues on and off the track. Sometimes shit happens, but they race each other clean now and it might be due to a case of act right that was dealt back towards Bowyer that got him seeing clearly. Point of this is, Professional drivers treat each other with respect on the track, or should. Brad does not do this and it shows by the number of times he has been in the hauler, just this year alone.

 

[Iron Eagle]

It seems to me Harvick and Smoke also wanted to run the line that doesn't exist.


Jeff walked up trying to build momentum and left a gap. ...you can't judge this based on the way it's been done before. This format is something new.

As funny as it sounds It's officially "you're either first or last."

 

[Chewbaccer]

I have been out to his house outside of Kannapolis area. He is an alright guy, but you get the feeling he doesnt want to be troubled with most people.

Sr's wife is a total bitch. from what I've seen of her. I was chatting with one of Jr's crew members one day and he said Jr. is not a big fan of hers and talks bad about her all the time. Dont know if thats true, but thats what i heard.

I don't have any trouble believing that. Terresa was a big reason Jr left DEI for Hendrick. She helped turn a fast rising race team into a second tier at best team.

 

[4down20]

I have been out to his house outside of Kannapolis area. He is an alright guy, but you get the feeling he doesnt want to be troubled with most people.

I can't blame him for that. I would hate to be famous. I never bothered him online because I didn't want to be just another person like that. Other people got closer to him and he had he's buddies/crew, I wasn't one of them. He actually gave a couple of guys rides in smaller circuits based on their online ability.

But when things happened, he didn't bitch and didn't make an ass of himself. He wasn't like DO YOU KNOW WHO I AM? kind of person, and I liked that a ton.

Truex on the other hand was terrible about that kind of stuff, and he was only in the nationwide series back then. I remember one time back in iracing beta his car blew up on a fixed setup race and he complained and made an ass of himself for the remainder of the race. It was like ugh, just shut the fuck up dude.

Sr's wife is a total bitch. from what I've seen of her. I was chatting with one of Jr's crew members one day and he said Jr. is not a big fan of hers and talks bad about her all the time. Dont know if thats true, but thats what i heard.

Not surprising honestly. Knew something had to be up with him to leave DEI like that. I have to believe it was hard for him to do.

 

[Bandwagonbo2]

Watch again. Jeff moved up the track for a moment before entering the turn opening up the hole for Keselowski. Jeff didn't close the hole fast enough. When Brad made his move, Gordon was over a lane away from Johnson, when contact was made, he was right b y Johnson's door. It was a racing accident and should go down as one, but Jeff Gordon moved down on Brad Keselowski.

You are wrong, notice that they are entering a turn. Anyone who has been in a Sprint Cup car knows you hit your marks and follow your lines. Gordon was following his line into the turn and Brad was trying to go around Johnson knowing that he had a small hole, but also knew that Gordon would be following his line into the turn. Its not clean racing. Racers dont just drive around a track, they hit marks and follow lines that have worked for their cars. Brad was wrong in what he tried to do and cost a fellow chaser spots. Many in the pits will look at this as trying to take out a driver who is in the chase with you.

 

[Chewbaccer]

I would have to go back and look at the race, but I know that Bowyer and Gordon have had issues on and off the track. Sometimes shit happens, but they race each other clean now and it might be due to a case of act right that was dealt back towards Bowyer that got him seeing clearly. Point of this is, Professional drivers treat each other with respect on the track, or should. Brad does not do this and it shows by the number of times he has been in the hauler, just this year alone.

So, Jeff Gordon trying to wreck Clint Bowyer, but failing and wrecking himself, only to limp around, then hook Bowyer driver side first into the wall also collecting Almirola and Logano in hard crashes wasn't a malicious act? Then he had the audacity to hide behind his pit crew when Bowyer was looking for him.

BTW, Gordon was mad an an event that took place months earlier at Martinsville when Gordon and Johnson were literally the only ones who stayed out on 100 lap tires late in the race, and Bowyer was pushed from behind to the point where it was either make it 3 wide or check up and lose at least 10 spots.

You're telling me that you don't think Brad Keselowski should go all out for a win when at the time it looked like he must win to stay alive for the championship.

And with this format, you can't compare racing etiquette to years past. The format calls for ultra aggressive racing.

 

[Chewbaccer]

You are wrong, notice that they are entering a turn. Anyone who has been in a Sprint Cup car knows you hit your marks and follow your lines. Gordon was following his line into the turn and Brad was trying to go around Johnson knowing that he had a small hole, but also knew that Gordon would be following his line into the turn. Its not clean racing. Racers dont just drive around a track, they hit marks and follow lines that have worked for their cars. Brad was wrong in what he tried to do and cost a fellow chaser spots. Many in the pits will look at this as trying to take out a driver who is in the chase with you.

So, you're in agreement. Brad was trying to win the rac, just like Jeff Gordon was, and it was a racing accident, and if it had been between David Ragan and Ricky Stenhouse nobody would have cared.

 

[Bandwagonbo2]

I can't blame him for that. I would hate to be famous. I never bothered him online because I didn't want to be just another person like that. Other people got closer to him and he had he's buddies/crew, I wasn't one of them. He actually gave a couple of guys rides in smaller circuits based on their online ability.

But when things happened, he didn't bitch and didn't make an ass of himself. He wasn't like DO YOU KNOW WHO I AM? kind of person, and I liked that a ton.

Truex on the other hand was terrible about that kind of stuff, and he was only in the nationwide series back then. I remember one time back in iracing beta his car blew up on a fixed setup race and he complained and made an ass of himself for the remainder of the race. It was like ugh, just shut the fuck up dude.



Not surprising honestly. Knew something had to be up with him to leave DEI like that. I have to believe it was hard for him to do.

I got comped on the driving experience at the track by Hendricks team and got some personal instruction by one of his crew members who worked on the track during the week for extra hours. He taught me about how they race and how they follow a set guideline most of the race that they agree upon based on practice sessions. They had a bunch of us out there and we were to follow the lead car(which is like the normal classes) except our speeds were not limited. I can tell you that 170-180 around Charlotte is unreal and will unnerve most people if you are not used to speed like that. We had one car that dropped off the pace and went into the pits, but the rest of us held our own for 25 laps. Experience of a lifetime that i would not want to duplicate, way too fast for me.

 

[Chewbaccer]

Hell, it did happen between Ryan Newman and Matt Kenseth, two chasers, why is nobody outraged about that. It resulted in a 25th place finish for Kenseth and 15th for Newman when both were in the top 10 all race long. Where is the outrage for the aggressive driver that made it 4 wide on a late restart?

 

[4down20]

Watch again. Jeff moved up the track for a moment before entering the turn opening up the hole for Keselowski. Jeff didn't close the hole fast enough. When Brad made his move, Gordon was over a lane away from Johnson, when contact was made, he was right b y Johnson's door. It was a racing accident and should go down as one, but Jeff Gordon moved down on Brad Keselowski.

If you compare the distance between Gordon and Jeff going into the turn, the difference is only a few feet. Gordon was merely diamonding the corner a little to get a run off 2 on Johnson.

And no, they weren't even next to Johnson when contact was made, much less by the door.

 

[Chewbaccer]

This is the first legit debate I've been in on SportsHoopla. Gotta say, it's pretty fun. Nobody getting personally offended over a difference of opinion. Shame it took my old hangout getting shutdown for me to find this place. Wasted years.

 

[Bandwagonbo2]

So, you're in agreement. Brad was trying to win the rac, just like Jeff Gordon was, and it was a racing accident, and if it had been between David Ragan and Ricky Stenhouse nobody would have cared.

No I do not agree it was a racing accident as you call it. It was not clean racing and Brad should know better. He is going to learn his lesson the hard way apparently. Brad knew that Gordon had to maintain his line in the corner and would be doing so, but he chose to drive up into the hole anyway and thats where its not good etiquette. He caused an accident where there was no need to. Both could have continued on and they had plenty of time left to catch Jimmy. As it was Brad screwed himself as well, instead of waiting to see if he could race cleanly and win it. He got nothing in the end and is still on the outside looking in at the top 4 drivers.

 

[4down20]

So, you're in agreement. Brad was trying to win the rac, just like Jeff Gordon was, and it was a racing accident, and if it had been between David Ragan and Ricky Stenhouse nobody would have cared.

Brad divebombed him.

Divebombing someone is taking a tiny hole that only exists for a fraction of a second in which the person on the outside has no chance at all to know the guy is going to put their car in there, while the guy who is doing the divebombing obviously knows the other driver intends to be in the same spot. Generally, the guy on the outside always loses.

It's always been considered dirty.

 

[Chewbaccer]

I can't blame him for that. I would hate to be famous. I never bothered him online because I didn't want to be just another person like that. Other people got closer to him and he had he's buddies/crew, I wasn't one of them. He actually gave a couple of guys rides in smaller circuits based on their online ability.

But when things happened, he didn't bitch and didn't make an ass of himself. He wasn't like DO YOU KNOW WHO I AM? kind of person, and I liked that a ton.

Truex on the other hand was terrible about that kind of stuff, and he was only in the nationwide series back then. I remember one time back in iracing beta his car blew up on a fixed setup race and he complained and made an ass of himself for the remainder of the race. It was like ugh, just shut the fuck up dude.



Not surprising honestly. Knew something had to be up with him to leave DEI like that. I have to believe it was hard for him to do.

She had everything to do with him leaving DEI. She wasn't running the team the way Dale Sr would have wanted it run. By the time Dale Jr left for Hendrick, DEI was a shell of a team. Jr's results were on a downslide.

To me, one of the biggest shames about Dale Sr's death was that if he had lived and retired, I truly believe that DEI could have been the one team to legitimately compete with Hendrick.