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A noise rule vs. the 12th Man? Unheard of -- or is it?

Doublejive

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A noise rule vs. the 12th Man? Unheard of -- or is it?


It must have been the world record the noisy Seattle fans set on Sunday night, because apparently a few bandwagon 49ers fans just heard about the 12th Man for the first time.

That is the only reasonable explanation for the noise complaint filed by the neighbors way down in San Francisco -- people apparently unfamiliar with the idea of home-field advantage in sports.

While we all laugh at these chuckleheads now for crying about unsportsmanlike conduct by cheering home crowds, believe it or not, there was a time when the NFL agreed with them.

The 12th Man has been around since the Seahawks first populated the Kingdome back in 1976. And the Kingdome really got rocking when Chuck Knox arrived in 1983 and led the Hawks to the playoffs. In fact, the team retired the No. 12 in honor of the fans in 1984 as the Hawks were busy finishing their best season to date (12-4).

But as the 1980s wore on and opposing teams got tired of trying to shout above the din of the Kingdome's deafening denizens, NFL owners actually voted to shut up the fans. The 1989 rule covered the entire league, but everyone knew it was aimed mostly at the Seahawks, their 12th Man and the Kingdome.

Knox was incensed by the rule, accusing owners of trying to "take away our fans' right to participate in the game."

In a preseason game against San Francisco in 1989, the league tried to send the 12th Man a message right away. Quarterback Steve Young appealed to referee Red Cashion three times, and Cashion threw three flags against the Hawks. Of course, all each hanky did was incite the crowd even more. It was comical -- and the league should have known that was the Pandora's Box it was opening.

As Paul Moyer, a safety for those Seahawks, said: "We're trying to get them (the fans) to tone it down, and they are getting louder. How can you penalize 67,000 people?"

Knox was still ticked off about the rule as the season opener approached. He said they should create a rule against throwing dog bones, as fans in Cleveland's Dawg Pound did, and one against throwing snowballs, as fans in Denver often did.

Commissioner Pete Rozelle apparently heard the wisdom of Knox's words, because on the eve of the season Rozelle told his officials to be judicious in penalizing home teams and also to penalize any offense that did not run a play when the officials thought it was quiet enough to do so.

Rozelle effectively vetoed the owners' vote.

In a game at the Kingdome that October, Denver QB John Elway stepped away from center three times and the referee warned the crowd three times -- but he never threw a flag. And then Elway was sacked by Seattle's speedy pass rusher, Rufus Porter.

In 1990, the raucous 12th Man helped Porter dominate the Cincinnati Bengals in a memorable Monday night upset by the Seahawks, and Bengals coach Sam Wyche said, "The fans were great to Seattle and not abusive to us, but obviously there is no crowd noise rule anymore."

The rule actually remained on the books until March 2007, when NFL owners quietly killed it.

They did so even though the Seahawks' outdoor stadium, which opened in 2002, had become every bit as loud as their indoor concrete mausoleum had been.

It was so loud for one game during the Seahawk's 2005 Super Bowl season that the Giants were called for 11 false starts. The next year, as the Giants reluctantly returned to Seattle, All-Pro defensive end Michael Strahan told reporters it was the loudest stadium he had ever been to.

"You can barely hear yourself talk. You can barely hear yourself think, actually," he said. "It's not just you against the Seahawks. This truly is a 12th man-type situation where you're playing against the fans, too."

A couple of seemingly new 49ers fans just found that out.

A noise rule vs. the 12th Man? Unheard of -- or is it? - Seattle Seattle Seahawks | Examiner.com
 

Doublejive

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In a game at the Kingdome that October, Denver QB John Elway stepped away from center three times and the referee warned the crowd three times -- but he never threw a flag. And then Elway was sacked by Seattle's speedy pass rusher, Rufus Porter.

<---Was at that game.
 

Tech_God

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I recall being at least to one game (dad had season tickets back then) where the Seahawks were penalized at the Kingdome due to crowd noise. As an earlier poster said, all the flags did was get the crowd stirred up even louder.

With the billions the NFL makes off us fans, the dumbest thing they did back then was try to take us out of the game. For once, thank God that greed helped steer them into the right direction by letting the ticket paying fans be able to cheer for their team.
 

Doublejive

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So for all you people claiming it is just the field think again because it is the fans.
 

RobBase

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Niner fans are fegs

original.jpg






 

Doublejive

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I recall being at least to one game (dad had season tickets back then) where the Seahawks were penalized at the Kingdome due to crowd noise. As an earlier poster said, all the flags did was get the crowd stirred up even louder.

With the billions the NFL makes off us fans, the dumbest thing they did back then was try to take us out of the game. For once, thank God that greed helped steer them into the right direction by letting the ticket paying fans be able to cheer for their team.

I know i have went to concert's in the KingDome and they were just as loud as a Seahawk game,hell i saw Ronnie James Dio with Yngwie Malmsteen there people honestly think that would not be loud?
 

blstoker

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Maybe the NFL will require soundproof barriers around the field so the fans can't be heard.

I say that in jest, but I'm sure someone will think it's a great idea and run with it.
 

Doublejive

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Also when the Kingdome was built, it was intentionally designed to have bad acoustics. This was to deter its use as a venue for rock concerts. (Of course, this was never mentioned to the taxpayers who were voting to pay for the thing!)
 

RoboticDreams

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but what I want to know is if Colin Kaepernick shaved off one of his eyebrows or did he welch on the bet

It was a make believe commercial. I'm guessing no.
 

Tech_God

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it seamed like a bet to me on national tv .. so Colin Kaepernick is a welcher and his word as a man is no good .. figures

As much as I hate the Niners, what part of "it wasn't a REAL bet" do you not understand? Since it was a fake bet, the FAKE commercial of him shaving his eyebrow (shown immediatly after the game) should be good enough for you. :gaah:
 

Berkeley_Blues

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I'm a long time Niner fan but I was born in Seattle.

I'm proud of the Seahawks fans. They've always been incredibly into football. Hell, I remember the days back in the King Dome. That shit was loud too. Seattle has always had very passionate football fans.
 

Podunkparte

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I'm one of the younger/newer Seahawks fans. Started following them in 2003. I loved seeing Ken Hamlin lay down some huge hits back then. The game I really took notice of as far as fan interaction was that 11 false start Giants game. You could tell how much of an impact the noise had on the game itself and that does nothing but encourage us to be even louder. To me that game was a turning point. Didn't they miss 2 FG chances to win the game?
 

dude82

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I'm one of the younger/newer Seahawks fans. Started following them in 2003. I loved seeing Ken Hamlin lay down some huge hits back then. The game I really took notice of as far as fan interaction was that 11 false start Giants game. You could tell how much of an impact the noise had on the game itself and that does nothing but encourage us to be even louder. To me that game was a turning point. Didn't they miss 2 FG chances to win the game?

I believe so.
 

WizardHawk

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So for all you people claiming it is just the field think again because it is the fans.

:wtf: wait, your proof that the acoustics of the stadium doesn't aide the noise is an example of a DOME which actually added more? :scratch:

It isn't speculation, it is science and is well understood. They have been building facilities to shape sound for hundreds of years, only most of it has been to improve the sound coming from the stage out, not the fans in.

I doubt anyone is saying the stadium is the only factor in fan noise here, but if there was no sound shaping roof would they still have reached 136db? Certainly not and that is a fact. How many less db is the question.

The kingdome was an even better sound amplification system because there was no escape for the sound. The open end around the hawks nest and the open top of the stadium allow sound to exit. What is impressive about the clink is how it is louder than the current domes remaining as they should normally always push more sound for the above reasons.

To those complaining about the noise and using that 136db for some political agenda keep in mind that those large numbers don't happen while the teams are trying to get off a play. The crowd broke the record twice and both were responses to big plays, not while the 9'ers were in the huddle or at the line of scrimmage. I'm sure had they had a meter at the playoff game against the saints a few years back the 'beast quake' run would have probably shattered that mark substantially.

Seattle has an outstanding fan base that knows their sound can influence the game and I'm not sure it would be possible to get any more out of them than they do, but lets be honest and admit the stadium acoustics plays its part. It's just basic science.
 

Doublejive

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Wizard i am not going to answer everything but the KjngDome was built not to have good acoustics also the upper bleachers at Clink register 110 decibels and what that means is that is not solely the noise being bounced back,yes some of it is but not hardly what people say it is,also Seattle fans and you would know this if you have been to a game stomp on the bleachers for added effect that has been going on since the kingdome.
 

Doublejive

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In the end though sure it is nice that we broke that record and that we have a rabid fan base when it comes to cheering,but the only that matters to me is the affect that the 12th man has on games i could care less about decibels etc,plus we all know that the 12th man is smart on when to get loud,we do not need any prompting from an announcer or some screen etc.
 
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