Game Thread: 5.22 dogs @ Kal

[tzill]

1. M Yastrzemski (L) RF
2. B Posey (R) C
3. B Crawford (L) SS
4. B Belt (L) 1B
5. E Longoria (R) 3B
6. A Dickerson (L) LF
7. M Dubón (R) 2B
8. M Tauchman (L) CF
9. S Kazmir (L) P

A lefty starter! Trolly those trollying trolly dodgers.

5-4 good guys. Five and dive for Kaz

 

[calsnowskier]

So shocking to see Belt K then do his Linus-walk back to the dugout.

 

[LHG]

So shocking to see Belt K then do his Linus-walk back to the dugout.

Linus is the 4th best hitter on this team. He does K excessively but he also is tied for 1st in walks with Longoria, but with 19 fewer PAs than Longoria.

 

[LHG]

Hitters with worse OPS than Tauchman: Casali and all pitchers. Clearly, being the 12th best hitter on this team requires a regular presence in the lineup.

 

[Stokes1931]

Somehow, we just knew this would happen after scoring 19 runs on Thursday against the Reds. Giants now have one run and 5 hits in the last 13 innings against a very good Dodger pitching staff. And that lone run came on a throwing error. Step it up, fellas.

 

[calsnowskier]

I strongly dislike this bully

 

[calsnowskier]

Linus is the 4th best hitter on this team. He does K excessively but he also is tied for 1st in walks with Longoria, but with 19 fewer PAs than Longoria.

Pardon my French, but gtfo with this “best hitter on the team” bs.

In a row of port-a-potties after a college football game, the least used one still smells like shit. It doesn’t deserve any accolades for being the “best smelling port-a-potty”.

 

[calsnowskier]

Tropeano looks like he will fit right in.

 

[msgkings322]

Told y'all the Dodgers would be a problem

 

[calsnowskier]

Told y'all the Dodgers would be a problem

We should have listened. None of us thought they were any good and they would be an easy sweep.

But not you...

Nope. You knew better...

 

[Stokes1931]

The Giants' defense has been surprisingly good through the first 40 games.

The first 2-error game was the last on in Cincy.

The second was today, so 2 in 3 days.

Hope this is not a trend.

And today, the emergency starter gave up 1 run, the bully gave up 5 runs.

 

[LHG]

The Giants' defense has been surprisingly good through the first 40 games.

The first 2-error game was the last on in Cincy.

The second was today, so 2 in 3 days.

Hope this is not a trend.

And today, the emergency starter gave up 1 run, the bully gave up 5 runs.

Was Kazmir on a strict pitch count? Because I don't understand having him only go 4 innings when he pitched well and the bullpen sucks.

 

[LHG]

Tropeano looks like he will fit right in.

 

[LHG]

Pardon my French, but gtfo with this “best hitter on the team” bs.

In a row of port-a-potties after a college football game, the least used one still smells like shit. It doesn’t deserve any accolades for being the “best smelling port-a-potty”.

Then maybe this will help. Before today's game, he was tied with Bryan Reynolds for 27th in the NL in OPS (minimum 100 PAs). Add in the AL, and they are tied for 50th best. Only 6 of the players above him are full time first baseman and 5 of those 6 are in the AL.
I understand that you have a thing against him but I believe your criticisms are not completely valid. He's not a future Hall of Famer, not even close. But he's valuable to this team and better than you think. That is my subjective two cents.

 

[calsnowskier]

Then maybe this will help. Before today's game, he was tied with Bryan Reynolds for 27th in the NL in OPS (minimum 100 PAs). Add in the AL, and they are tied for 50th best. Only 6 of the players above him are full time first baseman and 5 of those 6 are in the AL.
I understand that you have a thing against him but I believe your criticisms are not completely valid. He's not a future Hall of Famer, not even close. But he's valuable to this team and better than you think. That is my subjective two cents.

1) I openly stated a few years ago that I don’t dislike him as much as I say on these boards. We were stuck in an echo chamber, so I volunteered to be the Belt-pessimist (Beltimist?).

2) Based on Belts salary, bragging that he ranks 50th in anything is not a valid brag. Further, given his lack of premium position, it means even less. He has a more productive bat than Crawford. No one argues he doesn’t. Yet few complain about Crawford’s production or his value to the team. And they make similar amounts.

Belt is a legit MLBer. We got GREAT value getting him in the 5th round. When all is said and done, he will be fondly remembered as a good Giant. But he has been a bad value for his salary for most of his career, and has undershot expectations for his production for much of his Giants career.

 

[LHG]

1) I openly stated a few years ago that I don’t dislike him as much as I say on these boards. We were stuck in an echo chamber, so I volunteered to be the Belt-pessimist (Beltimist?).

2) Based on Belts salary, bragging that he ranks 50th in anything is not a valid brag. Further, given his lack of premium position, it means even less. He has a more productive bat than Crawford. No one argues he doesn’t. Yet few complain about Crawford’s production or his value to the team. And they make similar amounts.

Belt is a legit MLBer. We got GREAT value getting him in the 5th round. When all is said and done, he will be fondly remembered as a good Giant. But he has been a bad value for his salary for most of his career, and has undershot expectations for his production for much of his Giants career.

I hadn't completely forgotten the origination of your disdain for Belt but it seemed to have gotten more critical. Maybe it seems that way because there really isn't much love for Belt any longer.
Belt's contract is higher than what his value given, I won't argue there. His 2021 earnings puts him at the 57th highest paid player in MLB. If that was just position players, then I'd say he's giving the Giants what they pay him but since that also includes pitchers, then he is overpaid. I just don't think as much as some would argue. Furthermore, the Giants were taking a gamble by signing him. He was coming off 2 4.1 WAR years when he inked that extension. They obviously assumed that he would past career numbers in his early 30s, which is a just a bit past prime. I think had they signed him for about $2 million less per year, he'd be closer to earning what he's paid.
While you view 1st base as a non premium position, I would counter that not many guys who move to 1st base even hit as well as he does. How many free-agent outfielders have you seen, who move to 1st base, and hit that well, in the past 5 years? And middle infielders who play 1st base usually do so because the team has a black hole offensively at 1st base and have to pencil someone in at that position.
I think you too easily dismiss what he does for the team. Top 50 is a big deal. That means he should be a starter on any team and is a borderline All-Star (if fans paid more attention to OPS than home runs and popularity).

 

[calsnowskier]

I hadn't completely forgotten the origination of your disdain for Belt but it seemed to have gotten more critical. Maybe it seems that way because there really isn't much love for Belt any longer.
Belt's contract is higher than what his value given, I won't argue there. His 2021 earnings puts him at the 57th highest paid player in MLB. If that was just position players, then I'd say he's giving the Giants what they pay him but since that also includes pitchers, then he is overpaid. I just don't think as much as some would argue. Furthermore, the Giants were taking a gamble by signing him. He was coming off 2 4.1 WAR years when he inked that extension. They obviously assumed that he would past career numbers in his early 30s, which is a just a bit past prime. I think had they signed him for about $2 million less per year, he'd be closer to earning what he's paid.
While you view 1st base as a non premium position, I would counter that not many guys who move to 1st base even hit as well as he does. How many free-agent outfielders have you seen, who move to 1st base, and hit that well, in the past 5 years? And middle infielders who play 1st base usually do so because the team has a black hole offensively at 1st base and have to pencil someone in at that position.
I think you too easily dismiss what he does for the team. Top 50 is a big deal. That means he should be a starter on any team and is a borderline All-Star (if fans paid more attention to OPS than home runs and popularity).

Top 50 is NOT all-star. When compared in the 1B pool, top 4 or top 6 is all-star level.

But again, inking a middle of the road talent at a relative catch all position to a long, expensive contract restricts a teams flexibility. BASICALLY, anyone can play 1B. Granted, he plays at a near GG level (well south of Snow, probably slightly south of Clark), but it is at a position that can be manned by most position players. Not everyone can play SS. Not everyone can play 3B. Not everyone can play CF. Inking a middling CF to a long deal is understandable. Same with C or SS. The pool of players who CAN play those positions is very limited, so even a middling player brings value. A middling 1B just blocks other players who get pushed off their real position.

 

[LHG]

Top 50 is NOT all-star. When compared in the 1B pool, top 4 or top 6 is all-star level.

But again, inking a middle of the road talent at a relative catch all position to a long, expensive contract restricts a teams flexibility. BASICALLY, anyone can play 1B. Granted, he plays at a near GG level (well south of Snow, probably slightly south of Clark), but it is at a position that can be manned by most position players. Not everyone can play SS. Not everyone can play 3B. Not everyone can play CF. Inking a middling CF to a long deal is understandable. Same with C or SS. The pool of players who CAN play those positions is very limited, so even a middling player brings value. A middling 1B just blocks other players who get pushed off their real position.

I said borderline All-Star. To me, that means he should have a shot, especially when only one 1st baseman in the NL is hitting better than him.
I really think you over estimate how many guys slide over to 1st base and hit as well as Belt. Making 1st base the black hole of offense doesn't make sense. Yes, the dollars on his contract was too much, but having a guy who can give you production at any position, even 1st base, is worth keeping. I could see Belt as much more expendable if there were a wealth of hitters who play 1st base or who need a position, but there aren't. The guys on this squad that fit the need for a position would be Darin Ruf, Wilmer Flores, Donovan Solano, Tommy LaStella and Austin Slater. Only Ruf could match (and exceed) Belt's production but his history is a lot more spotty than Belt's. The other 5 would see a production drop of 150 to 200 points in OPS.

 

[calsnowskier]

I am not saying that a shifted player would put up the same production as belt. But belt is paid like he puts up production BETTER than Belt.

And Ruf is actually a decent example of why I never liked the Belt signing. We locked ourselves into paying for an all-star (or near all-level) player at the overflow position (not DH, but close-ish). Ruf has decent potential to put up close to Belt-like numbers for a fraction of the cost. And what he is paid, he can be cut loose at a moments notice without batting an eye. Huff is the same kind of signing (Not his re-up... that was dumb).

Bottom line, Belt has cost us more than just his actual salary. He cost us opportunities. No Huffs. No Burrels. Blocking Ruf (not the end of the world, but I would have Ruf starting, at his salary, with no Belt, and Belt’s money somewhere else on the team (a legit closer? A legit OFer? 2 or 3 MLB mid-inning relievers?)). (Wow, a parenthetical parenthetical idea... we have reach Inception!)

 

[pachyderm]

Damn.

Come on gang.

2 games, we all know who we are.

Let's not get too down on them.