2019 NBA Playoffs thread

[bksballer89]

Defense wasn't their problem

 

[tlance]

Defense wasn't their problem

Damn.

Dude got Harden to defend a bit.

He is a miracle worker!

 

[Heatles84]

Thoughts? @TurnUpTheHeat @Heatles84

I wouldn't mind it because from everything I'm hearing, the free agency class of 2020 is pretty horrible so why not Conley who has 2 years left on his contract instead of wasting money on a mediocre free agent next summer?

Wouldn't mind Conley quite honestly. But I don't want to give up our 1st round pick for him given that he'll turn 32 at the start of the year. But it does look like Memphis is aware they need to hit the reset button. Tough call.

 

[Heatles84]

Damn.

Dude got Harden to defend a bit.

He is a miracle worker!

Gladly take him on the Heat's coaching staff. There'll be a spot likely open with Juwan Howard eyeing the Michigan job.

 

[tlance]

Gladly take him on the Heat's coaching staff. There'll be a spot likely open with Juwan Howard eyeing the Michigan job.

Yeah. He seems like a really good assistant.

 

[dtgold88]

Your big error is pretending playing in the NFL is a regular job. Regular jobs don't require you to literally almost kill yourself for your employer. Regular careers last longer than 4 years. So, bad analogy

That's a great deflection, but here is the problem. You know the risks NFL players take, yet odd you didn't answer the question. So which are you choosing, A or B?

 

[dtgold88]

And you want everything skewed to the owners.

I get that you probably heard the same thing I did as a kid, that one of the big moments in a Jewish boy's life is when he realizes his chances of playing professional sports are much less than his chances of owning a team. But dang.

Problem is I have said I'd like something in between what players in NFL get and what they get in MLB/NBA. So, no, I don't want it all skewed to the owners. But guess who wants it 100% skewed to the players?

 

[dtgold88]

No.

I want multi-year contracts to be guaranteed like in every other sport.

If the owner messes up by signing the wrong player, that is his fault.

so as I said.....you want it skewed 100% to the player.

 

[dtgold88]

Terrible analogy.

Total wast of a post.

Hey, would you rather have a job that pays you 50K with no guarantees, or one that pays up $2million with no guarantees.

SMH

That's the point. They get far more than guys in the real world. Oh, and the $2 mil deal does have guarantees. NFL players usually are guaranteed 40% or more of their deal. Rookies - who have never proven anything - get 100% of their 4 year deal if they are picked in round 1. Later rounds get less but signing bonus is guaranteed.

Know many other businesses where even the best of the best get 4 year guarantees from roughly $5 mil to $30 mil to start? With no college debt (unless mommy and daddy paid)?

 

[tlance]

That's the point. They get far more than guys in the real world. Oh, and the $2 mil deal does have guarantees. NFL players usually are guaranteed 40% or more of their deal. Rookies - who have never proven anything - get 100% of their 4 year deal if they are picked in round 1. Later rounds get less but signing bonus is guaranteed.

Know many other businesses where even the best of the best get 4 year guarantees from roughly $5 mil to $30 mil to start? With no college debt (unless mommy and daddy paid)?

Ok.

Let's start over.

I get that you have zero empathy for professional athletes making more in 1 year than you do in a lifetime.

I get that.

Relative to the other major professional sports, NFL is by far the most dangerous in terms of long term player health and have by far the weakest player's association and worst labor terms.

So, if you think that the NBA and MLB have labor terms that 100% favor the players, then yes. That is what I want.

 

[dtgold88]

Ok.

Let's start over.

I get that you have zero empathy for professional athletes making more in 1 year than you do in a lifetime.

I get that.

Relative to the other major professional sports, NFL is by far the most dangerous in terms of long term player health and have by far the weakest player's association and worst labor terms.

So, if you think that the NBA and MLB have labor terms that 100% favor the players, then yes. That is what I want.

No need to make it personal as I do just fine for myself. Funny, though, you think my issue is with players who make a lot of money while you clearly have one with owners who make a lot more. I wont pretend to try and guess what you earn and say an owner might make more in a few weeks than you might see in your working years.

Never disagreed with your assertions about NFL terms compared to MLB and NBA. Probably why I said I'd like to see them all somewhere in between MLB/NBA and NFL. Not 100% skewed to the players like you want.

 

[tlance]

No need to make it personal as I do just fine for myself. Funny, though, you think my issue is with players who make a lot of money while you clearly have one with owners who make a lot more. I wont pretend to try and guess what you earn and say an owner might make more in a few weeks than you might see in your working years.

Never disagreed with your assertions about NFL terms compared to MLB and NBA. Probably why I said I'd like to see them all somewhere in between MLB/NBA and NFL. Not 100% skewed to the players like you want.

No man.

You are putting words in my mouth that I have never said.

All I want is guaranteed contracts like the other sports have. That is all I have said.

How in the world does that skew things to favor the players 100%?

You are literally creating narratives to argue at this point.

 

[dtgold88]

No man.

You are putting words in my mouth that I have never said.

All I want is guaranteed contracts like the other sports have. That is all I have said.

How in the world does that skew things to favor the players 100%?

You are literally creating narratives to argue at this point.

You just said I must be jealous of the players as they will earn more in a year than I will in my lifetime. That has zero to do with my line of thinking here, just like I wouldn't accuse you of coming up with your comments out of jealousy of the owners.

I don't think your views here are off base. I just don't agree.

 

[tlance]

You just said I must be jealous of the players as they will earn more in a year than I will in my lifetime. That has zero to do with my line of thinking here, just like I wouldn't accuse you of coming up with your comments out of jealousy of the owners.

I don't think your views here are off base. I just don't agree.

And that is fair.

I did say that.

In response to you, for the second time saying that "I want labor rules to favor the players 100%"

Which I never said or implied.

What I did say is that I want guaranteed contracts like in the other sports which you even sort of agreed with earlier today.

 

[dtgold88]

And that is fair.

I did say that.

In response to you, for the second time saying that "I want labor rules to favor the players 100%"

Which I never said or implied.

What I did say is that I want guaranteed contracts like in the other sports which you even sort of agreed with earlier today.

actually, no, what I said was I'd like something in between what NFL players get and what NBA/MLB players receive (as far as guarantees). Yet for some reason you think I am 100% for the owners and cannot own up to you favore the players 100% (which you do, and that's your right).

 

[trojanfan12]

Imo, it's not about favoring the players 100% or the owners 100%. It's about what's fair relative to the risk.

If and NFL player signs a contract any bonus money and maybe the first couple of years are guaranteed. That's why, when discussing the value of a players contract, the question: "How much of that is guaranteed?" is usually one of the first asked about an NFL players contract.

So, in the NBA and MLB, if a player signs a contract and suffers a career ending injury or an injury that leaves him less effective on the court, he still gets the full value of his contract.

But, in the NFL, where a player is more likely to suffer that kind of injury, depending on when the injury happens, he could literally be released and not get 1 more dime on his contract.

 

[dtgold88]

Imo, it's not about favoring the players 100% or the owners 100%. It's about what's fair relative to the risk.

If and NFL player signs a contract any bonus money and maybe the first couple of years are guaranteed. That's why, when discussing the value of a players contract, the question: "How much of that is guaranteed?" is usually one of the first asked about an NFL players contract.

So, in the NBA and MLB, if a player signs a contract and suffers a career ending injury or an injury that leaves him less effective on the court, he still gets the full value of his contract.

But, in the NFL, where a player is more likely to suffer that kind of injury, depending on when the injury happens, he could literally be released and not get 1 more dime on his contract.

He could, but seems like more often than not they reach an injury settlement......and of course he's also received much of his guaranteed money upfront.

Of course, I've never once said the NFL rules on contracts is perfect.

 

[tlance]

actually, no, what I said was I'd like something in between what NFL players get and what NBA/MLB players receive (as far as guarantees). Yet for some reason you think I am 100% for the owners and cannot own up to you favore the players 100% (which you do, and that's your right).

I favor the players having guaranteed money.

That does not mean I think every aspect of the labor deal should favor the players. There should be some terms for both sides. In a fair negotiation, there always is.

NBA and MLB have better deals because their player associations actually have enough leverage to challenge the owners and the negotiation is a level playing field.

The NFL is not, so the current labor terms clearly favor owners. That is the point.

 

[dtgold88]

I favor the players having guaranteed money.

That does not mean I think every aspect of the labor deal should favor the players. There should be some terms for both sides. In a fair negotiation, there always is.

NBA and MLB have better deals because their player associations actually have enough leverage to challenge the owners and the negotiation is a level playing field.

The NFL is not, so the current labor terms clearly favor owners. That is the point.

And don't think I ever said anything to the contrary. I just don't want the guarantees to be 100% skewed to the players (should have made that clear, as I didn't think you wanted entire labor agreement skewed to the owners).

Do I think NFL is better than MLB/NBA when it comes to guarantees? IMO, yes I do. I think 100% guarantees are absurd. Sure, you can say if it's a bad deal it's on the owners for signing a bad deal. But as we know in both sports you are signing guys based on what they did, and cannot always know what they'll do in the future.

I do think a happy medium are the types of deals where they are shorter with club options for a year or 2.

 

[tlance]

And don't think I ever said anything to the contrary. I just don't want the guarantees to be 100% skewed to the players (should have made that clear, as I didn't think you wanted entire labor agreement skewed to the owners).

Do I think NFL is better than MLB/NBA when it comes to guarantees? IMO, yes I do. I think 100% guarantees are absurd. Sure, you can say if it's a bad deal it's on the owners for signing a bad deal. But as we know in both sports you are signing guys based on what they did, and cannot always know what they'll do in the future.

I do think a happy medium are the types of deals where they are shorter with club options for a year or 2.

I think a fair compromise would be something like what the NBA had with the amnesty clause.

Stretch provisions are like a more player friendly amnesty, but I am not opposed to that as long as there are strict limits to how often teams can use them.

In the NFL, good, productive players get cut all the time because the team can find a younger, cheaper and probably less productive alternative.

And I believe that is wrong.