2014 Top Prospects

[calsnowskier]

The nuclear wasteland that was the Giants system was a hot topic on the boards pre-Timmeh (Cain was the island in the sea of dreck).

Who did the Giants produce in the 90's and 00's pre-Timmeh?

Cain
Lowry
Mueller
Rios
Williams
Feliz
Sandoval
Liriano
Correia
Nathan
Torrealba


Cain and Sandoval are part of the "new philosophy" and Mueller, Feliz and Nathan are the only significant products of the system in a 15-20 year span (Lowry's career ended too soon to be included). Of course there were plenty of shuttlers and journeymen, but that is not the point of the discussion.

 

[Stokes1931]

The nuclear wasteland that was the Giants system was a hot topic on the boards pre-Timmeh (Cain was the island in the sea of dreck).

Who did the Giants produce in the 90's and 00's pre-Timmeh?

Cain
Lowry
Mueller
Rios
Williams
Feliz
Sandoval
Liriano
Correia
Nathan
Torrealba


Cain and Sandoval are part of the "new philosophy" and Mueller, Feliz and Nathan are the only significant products of the system in a 15-20 year span (Lowry's career ended too soon to be included). Of course there were plenty of shuttlers and journeymen, but that is not the point of the discussion.

Nick's career will NEVER end!

 

[calsnowskier]

Nick's career will NEVER end!

????

Are you thinking of Nick Lowery? I never heard of Nick Lowry.

 

[calsnowskier]

DrB just posted his annual top 50 a couple days back, so I figured this is as good a time as any to get this thing started.

Here is my top 10 as of now...

Crick
Escobar
Blackburn
Hembree
Mejia
Susac
Williamson
Stratton
Arroyo
Flores

7 pitchers in the top 10 is both good and bad. We are SUPER deep in pitching prospects, not so much in hitters. However, we do have guys like Panik, Brown, Cabrera and Villalona who did not make my top 10 who could break out and be anywhere from solid MLBer to superstar. Heck, at his time next year, Cabrera could be the overall #1, and that isn't much of a stretch.

As for pitchers that did not make the final top 10, Mella and Blach are probably the highlights for starters with Law and Hall the CLEAR studs from the pen. Both Law and Hall could be ready as soon as this year, and with Hembree, reminds me of Atlanta from a few years ago with their 3 closers coming up all at the same time.

As for the actual top 10, Crick is the clear 1 and Escobar is the clear 2. 3 and further down is a complete crap-shoot. We have about 20 guys who could put up an argument for the #3 spot.

Approx 1 year later...

Crick - a bit of luster off his shine, but he is still a top prospect. Probably our #3 prospect.
Escobar - Dealt in the Peavy trade after apparently falling out of favor with the PsTB.
Blackburn - In AFL as a reliever. Not super concerned about this unless that bleeds into ST.
Hembree - See Escobar. Other bully arms in the org have stepped up, so likely not a huge loss.
Mejia - Next man up? Had a moderately OK season in '14.
Susac - Graduated in '14 and is really pushing the issue with Posey.
Williamson - Early TJ surgery in '14. This will be a big year for him. I still have high hopes.
Stratton - Had an OK year, but has not been putting up first round numbers. '15 will be a big year for him.
Arroyo - Rough start in '14, but put up monster numbers after a break and demotion. I am still excited.
Flores - Still young and a few years away.

 

[calsnowskier]

I just noticed that draft order is determined before the playoffs!!

SCORE!!!

We have the #22 pick (before FA signings that may eliminate picks) as well as a potential sandwich pick. We can get a good player at #22.

Anyone know what determines the order of the FA compensation picks?

 

[MarcoPolo]

I just noticed that draft order is determined before the playoffs!!

SCORE!!!

We have the #22 pick (before FA signings that may eliminate picks) as well as a potential sandwich pick. We can get a good player at #22.

Anyone know what determines the order of the FA compensation picks?

Same as for regular draft picks: record during regular season play (if tied, look at previous season's play).

 

[calsnowskier]

Same as for regular draft picks: record during regular season play (if tied, look at previous season's play).

 

[tzill]

Mejia suspended

Giants pitching prospect suspended 50 games | CSN Bay Area

 

[Mays-Fan]

Mejia suspended

Giants pitching prospect suspended 50 games | CSN Bay Area

Just asking here.

OK, so he serves his 50. Then what? Do we keep him? I'm guessing we do. Shyte happens. Then in June or whatever we give him the ball again and life goes on.

How does this compare then with those who want to keep Melky out of our organization for a very similar violation?

Is there an organization in MLB that has NOT had a PED suspension of some kind? How far back do you go?
Do the Pirates avoid formerly PED-suspended players because Dock Ellis pitched a no-hitter in the '70's while tripping his balls off?

Just asking here.

 

[msgkings322]

Just asking here.

OK, so he serves his 50. Then what? Do we keep him? I'm guessing we do. Shyte happens. Then in June or whatever we give him the ball again and life goes on.

How does this compare then with those who want to keep Melky out of our organization for a very similar violation?

Is there an organization in MLB that has NOT had a PED suspension of some kind? How far back do you go?
Do the Pirates avoid formerly PED-suspended players because Dock Ellis pitched a no-hitter in the '70's while tripping his balls off?

Just asking here.

You can't see a difference between some random minor leaguer and a very public situation like Melky, and before that Bonds? Legalistically, sure, it's the 'same'. But in the context of the organization wanting to move as far past the Bonds circus as possible, I completely understand why they are doing it this way.

Melky ain't coming back. And for that matter maybe neither is Mejia.

 

[calsnowskier]

Wow. Just wow.

Dude was on the juice? And he had the kind of year he had?

And just 1 year ago, we thought we had pitching prospect to spare. I do not remember SO MANY relatively high pitching prospects in one organization nose dive all at the same time before. Not a single one of the Uber-Arms has done jack-shit in the last year, outside of kill their value.

Very depressing.

 

[calsnowskier]

Serious question...

Did the org let a roving pitching coach go in the last year? Did they hire a new one? Did they change some internal philosophy regarding pitching prospects in the last year?

 

[Mays-Fan]

You can't see a difference between some random minor leaguer and a very public situation like Melky, and before that Bonds? Legalistically, sure, it's the 'same'. But in the context of the organization wanting to move as far past the Bonds circus as possible, I completely understand why they are doing it this way.

Melky ain't coming back. And for that matter maybe neither is Mejia.

I dunno, this thinking sounds a lot like the Churchill joke whose punchline is "Madam, we already know what you are, now we're just negotiating the price."

There's a difference in player stature, yes, but there's really no difference in principle. The Bonds thing was basically 10 years ago. And again I ask: What organization, particularly among the elite, has NOT has a PED issue? If it's legal for Melky to play, it's legal for Melky to play HERE.

We might catch some flak, but tough beans. It's time to be able to move on.

 

[calsnowskier]

You can't see a difference between some random minor leaguer and a very public situation like Melky, and before that Bonds? Legalistically, sure, it's the 'same'. But in the context of the organization wanting to move as far past the Bonds circus as possible, I completely understand why they are doing it this way.

Melky ain't coming back. And for that matter maybe neither is Mejia.

Agree.

The issue has more to do with optics than any kind of actual organizational stance. No ownership group REALLY cares about the PED issue, outside of how it affects income (in the positive OR negative). The Giants were portrayed as the face of the PED culture in the '90s and '00s (rightly or wrongly). Therefore, they HAVE to be in damage control mode for at least a generation or so to clean the image.

Melky was a High-profile case. He was on an MVP pace and got caught. On top of that, he did not handle it properly on a personal level in the clubhouse. Mejia is a kid who only the most fervent of Giants fans have even ever heard of. Comparing the two situations is absurd.

Will he be back in the org? Absolutely. Javier came back this year after his suspension.

 

[MarcoPolo]

You can't see a difference between some random minor leaguer and a very public situation like Melky, and before that Bonds? Legalistically, sure, it's the 'same'. But in the context of the organization wanting to move as far past the Bonds circus as possible, I completely understand why they are doing it this way.

Melky ain't coming back. And for that matter maybe neither is Mejia.

Mejia wasn't taking steroids - he was taking a stimulant. And a stimulant that is generally found in weight-loss pills (was, actually, since it's outlawed in the U.S. and Canada and the EU and ...). If you've seen Mejia (or pictures of him) you might see why he might be taking weight-loss pills. And if they were from 'home' (Dominican Republic) he might not have even known he was taking it. The team (at ALL levels, and most especially in the minors) has to regularly, and often, stress to the kids that they shouldn't take *anything* without checking with the team's 'expert' on whether it contains a prohibited substance. That includes over-the-counter cold syrup.

I'm pretty sure Mejia will be back and the Giants will just forget about it, because it really isn't a big deal.

 

[calsnowskier]

Mejia wasn't taking steroids - he was taking a stimulant. And a stimulant that is generally found in weight-loss pills (was, actually, since it's outlawed in the U.S. and Canada and the EU and ...). If you've seen Mejia (or pictures of him) you might see why he might be taking weight-loss pills. And if they were from 'home' (Dominican Republic) he might not have even known he was taking it. The team (at ALL levels, and most especially in the minors) has to regularly, and often, stress to the kids that they shouldn't take *anything* without checking with the team's 'expert' on whether it contains a prohibited substance. That includes over-the-counter cold syrup.

I'm pretty sure Mejia will be back and the Giants will just forget about it, because it really isn't a big deal.

Similar to the Mota situation.

Mota had taken either an OTC or prescription (forget which) that had some newly prohibited ingredient. The league even went as far as to say that they fully believed that it was simply a mistake. But he still broke the rules, and was suspended. When his suspension was over, the org accepted him back, with little question.

 

[tzill]

Wow. Just wow.

Dude was on the juice? And he had the kind of year he had?

And just 1 year ago, we thought we had pitching prospect to spare. I do not remember SO MANY relatively high pitching prospects in one organization nose dive all at the same time before. Not a single one of the Uber-Arms has done jack-shit in the last year, outside of kill their value.

Very depressing.

Not what the article said; it was amphetamines not steroids or HGH.

 

[MarcoPolo]

Similar to the Mota situation.

Mota had taken either an OTC or prescription (forget which) that had some newly prohibited ingredient. The league even went as far as to say that they fully believed that it was simply a mistake. But he still broke the rules, and was suspended. When his suspension was over, the org accepted him back, with little question.

Yeah, that's why I mentioned cough syrup. He claimed he used *his daughter's* cough syrup because he had a cold, he was miserable, and he used what he already had at home.

 

[calsnowskier]

I just noticed that draft order is determined before the playoffs!!

SCORE!!!

We have the #22 pick (before FA signings that may eliminate picks) as well as a potential sandwich pick. We can get a good player at #22.

Anyone know what determines the order of the FA compensation picks?

With Cuddyer and Martin signing with other, non-protected teams, the Giants now pick #20.

 

[calsnowskier]

I am un-stickying this thread with the creation of the new 2015 version...