reily signed with skins

[Sharkinva]

what i saw was you overestimated his market value and when people tried to tell you you went on a rant about how we didnt value our guys and we were making a huge mistake

fact is we were very much right

Historically over the last 15 years, we havent valued our own guys. And letting him go for two FA ILB would have been a huge mistake. Just because he stayed and took a below market contract doesnt mean he isnt worth just as much as the other teams players some of you go gaga over.

And be careful you might throw a shoulder rotator patting yourself on the back.

 

[j_y19]

I said this early on in this discussion about Riley and his signing proves it further. Allen is very very good at establishing a player's value and sticking to that number. He doesn't panic and he's not afraid to let a player test the market because he knows he has offered a fair value. Riley now is about the 10th player over 4 years that has turned down our original offer, tested the waters, and has come back to sign. The only player we have lost that we wanted to keep during Allen's tenure here was lorenzo and we just couldn't afford him. The jury is still out on his ability to evaluate talent, but I can see how anyone could question his ability to manage the cap and sign the players he wants to keep.

 

[skinsdad62]

Historically over the last 15 years, we havent valued our own guys. And letting him go for two FA ILB would have been a huge mistake. Just because he stayed and took a below market contract doesnt mean he isnt worth just as much as the other teams players some of you go gaga over.

And be careful you might throw a shoulder rotator patting yourself on the back.

history is history shark , new regime new things

gruden and allen werent here in the beginning

and dont worry about my shoulder i have been working it out because some more issues are coming that i am right about and i will call it out because i certainly wasnt spared when the debating was going on

and you werent the only guy

 

[j_y19]

Historically over the last 15 years, we havent valued our own guys. And letting him go for two FA ILB would have been a huge mistake. Just because he stayed and took a below market contract doesnt mean he isnt worth just as much as the other teams players some of you go gaga over.

And be careful you might throw a shoulder rotator patting yourself on the back.

Shark, he did not sign a below market offer. He signed onto exactly what the market offered him. He got the best deal he could get and it is what he deserved. A few teams overpaid and the rest of the league decided not to follow.

 

[gkekoa]

Historically over the last 15 years, we havent valued our own guys. And letting him go for two FA ILB would have been a huge mistake. Just because he stayed and took a below market contract doesnt mean he isnt worth just as much as the other teams players some of you go gaga over.

And be careful you might throw a shoulder rotator patting yourself on the back.

He didn't take a below market contract. Other teams just didn't offer him the contract we did.

 

[Sharkinva]

When other ILBs are getting deals in the range of 6-7 MIllion a year and we signed him for $4.3, thats below market. Its all good. Im glad he signed with the Skins. But he is better than you guys give him credit for.

 

[j_y19]

This is the thing. I don't see anyone saying he isn't an adequate ILB, this whole debate was just one of market value, not proficiency. His market value has been set. You keep acting like the Skins forced him to take their offer. Why do you think it is he didn't sign elsewhere?

 

[gkekoa]

When other ILBs are getting deals in the range of 6-7 MIllion a year and we signed him for $4.3, thats below market. Its all good. Im glad he signed with the Skins. But he is better than you guys give him credit for.

And apparently better than the entire league gives him credit for because nobody offered him more.

 

[Sharkinva]

And apparently better than the entire league gives him credit for because nobody offered him more.

NO body in the league thought Wilson was better than a backup. No one in the league thought Brady was better than a backup as well. And most of the league thought Leaf, and RG3 were worth top ten picks. So that being said... the league is no where near perfect on talent evaluation.

 

[j_y19]

NO body in the league thought Wilson was better than a backup. No one in the league thought Brady was better than a backup as well. And most of the league thought Leaf, and RG3 were worth top ten picks. So that being said... the league is no where near perfect on talent evaluation.

Really? Really? You are comparing Brady and Wilson to Riley? Here's the difference between those 2 and Riley. While the league missed on both of them in the draft, Riley has 4 years NFL experience, they had none. Much different situation.

 

[Sharkinva]

Really? Really? You are comparing Brady and Wilson to Riley? Here's the difference between those 2 and Riley. While the league missed on both of them in the draft, Riley has 4 years NFL experience, they had none. Much different situation.

I think Riley Played withing the system and did what the coaches asked. While not an all pro, we could do much worse at the position. I think over all he is better than Ellerbe, Butler and as good as Lee. But i get it, sports center and ESPN highlights is what we actually measure players by these days. But I would take riley over any of them.

 

[skinsdad62]

I think Riley Played withing the system and did what the coaches asked. While not an all pro, we could do much worse at the position. I think over all he is better than Ellerbe, Butler and as good as Lee. But i get it, sports center and ESPN highlights is what we actually measure players by these days. But I would take riley over any of them.

so we should overpay because other teams did shark ? if riley could have gotten a better offer he would have taken it .

blaming other teams scouts about his worth is sour grapes

we said he was a solid ILB he was paid like one . you felt he was worth nearly twice as much as he turned out to be perhaps other teams learned from the past

heck the browns paid dansby a foolish amount of money and most of it guaranteed and passed on the younger , just a skilled riley ? i doubt it

 

[Sharkinva]

so we should overpay because other teams did shark ? if riley could have gotten a better offer he would have taken it .

blaming other teams scouts about his worth is sour grapes

we said he was a solid ILB he was paid like one . you felt he was worth nearly twice as much as he turned out to be perhaps other teams learned from the past

heck the browns paid dansby a foolish amount of money and most of it guaranteed and passed on the younger , just a skilled riley ? i doubt it

I felt he was worth 5-6 million a year. and admitted that the market was over paying guys who I feel are NOT worth the deals they got. But I also dont fault him for wanting to get what the market has been willing to pay. So he basically took 700K a year less than what i think he is worth at minimum. But might have been a smarter move for him even if he was offered more. Most guys that leave for the extra $1 million a year end up not living up to the deal and cut two to three years down the road. And lets face it, the Browns are a train wreck of an organization even worse than the Skins have been.

 

[skinsdad62]

I felt he was worth 5-6 million a year. and admitted that the market was over paying guys who I feel are NOT worth the deals they got. But I also dont fault him for wanting to get what the market has been willing to pay. So he basically took 700K a year less than what i think he is worth at minimum. But might have been a smarter move for him even if he was offered more. Most guys that leave for the extra $1 million a year end up not living up to the deal and cut two to three years down the road. And lets face it, the Browns are a train wreck of an organization even worse than the Skins have been.

dude you were debating us about whether we should pay 7 mil for him we paid 4 mil for him nothing else needs to be said

 

[Sharkinva]

dude you were debating us about whether we should pay 7 mil for him we paid 4 mil for him nothing else needs to be said

And you guys were saying he was worth no more than 3-3.5 million at best.

 

[skinsdad62]

And you guys were saying he was worth no more than 3-3.5 million at best.

i had him at about 5 mil max

 

[gkekoa]

I don't think a single person said, at best, give him 3.5 mil. I said his value was 3-4 mil but I'd pay him 5.

 

[j_y19]

And you guys were saying he was worth no more than 3-3.5 million at best.

No. What we are saying is it makes no difference what we think. The market has spoken. His value is in the $4M range.

 

[Sharkinva]

No. What we are saying is it makes no difference what we think. The market has spoken. His value is in the $4M range.

And the market is wrong alot more than its right lately. Riley is the type of player TEAMs used to value. Now its more about sports center and highlights reels. Dont get me wrong, Im glad he is back. But I think he is still under valued by the fan base and the team. I am glad to see though that we didnt throw money at other teams free agents thus far.

 

[skinsdad62]

well i went back to the original link shark and here is the data

i had him at 5 mil
GK had him worth 3.5 mil but would pay 5 mil
JY 5 mil
vt sparks 4-5
skinem 3- 5 mil
skinzwinz 4-5
tcbidness 5 mil

anyone who gave a number gave a number that topped out at 5 mil so i would say try again because most everyone would concede 5 mil

he ended up with 4 not the 7 you advocated