Stop rooting for your team to lose to get better draft odds

[flyerhawk]

If 26 is very high what are top 10 guys? top 5? Double secret super high? very, very, very high? Really not eve sure why it matters in the discussion as i'm sure there are many that are higher (even a lot higher) you like and think are very good players.

The point is that he is a high usage player playing point guard with relatively few assists. If he were on a playoff contender he wouldn't be getting 24 points a game.

I'd argue Lebron a better player now than in 2007 (maybe not 2018). Pistons were a title favorite. I think they'd fight for home court this year with Lebron. Just my opinion....of course would depend on health of rest of team.

The Pistons were a title favorite because the East was pretty terrible that year. The top of the East is not terrible this year.

 

[dtgold88]

The point is that he is a high usage player playing point guard with relatively few assists. If he were on a playoff contender he wouldn't be getting 24 points a game.



The Pistons were a title favorite because the East was pretty terrible that year. The top of the East is not terrible this year.

He's a SG, not a PG so 4+ apg is pretty good, along with 48% shooting. He's not a high volume shooter for a guy getting 24ppg as a guard. You wont find many games where he's taking 20+ and shooting a poor %.

Probably being defending champs helped make them a title favorite, too?

 

[flyerhawk]

He's a SG, not a PG so 4+ apg is pretty good, along with 48% shooting. He's not a high volume shooter for a guy getting 24ppg as a guard. You wont find many games where he's taking 20+ and shooting a poor %.

He's top 20 in shots this year. And only 2 players above him have played as few games or fewer as he has

Probably being defending champs helped make them a title favorite, too?

We just going to pretend 2005 and 2006 didn't happen?

 

[megalodon30]

I never do this anyway. The NBA always manages to screw the Kings in the lottery no matter how bad their season was.

 

[dtgold88]

He's top 20 in shots this year. And only 2 players above him have played as few games or fewer as he has



We just going to pretend 2005 and 2006 didn't happen?

top 20 in shots and top 20 in ppg. That such a problem? Also shooting 48% as a young guard not too shabby is it? Plus the 4+ assists as a SG?

why would we pretend 2005 and 2006 didn't happen?

 

[thunderc]

SGA will go to more all star games than sexton and Garland combined, you can use a pen to Mark that one down.

 

[flyerhawk]

top 20 in shots and top 20 in ppg. That such a problem? Also shooting 48% as a young guard not too shabby is it? Plus the 4+ assists as a SG?

I'm not saying it is a problem. I'm saying that right now he is a big fish in a small pond and historically that usually means that the production is a little inflated. Maybe Jerami Grant really has become an all-star level player in his 9th year. Or maybe he's just on a crappy team which lets him get more shots.

why would we pretend 2005 and 2006 didn't happen?

We were talking about 2007? And I said that the the Pistons were the default favorite because they won 53 games. You said also because they were the defending champs. The Pistons won in 2004. The Heat won in 2006.

 

[dtgold88]

SGA will go to more all star games than sexton and Garland combined, you can use a pen to Mark that one down.

k

 

[broncosmitty]

I'm not saying it is a problem. I'm saying that right now he is a big fish in a small pond and historically that usually means that the production is a little inflated. Maybe Jerami Grant really has become an all-star level player in his 9th year. Or maybe he's just on a crappy team which lets him get more shots.




We were talking about 2007? And I said that the the Pistons were the default favorite because they won 53 games. You said also because they were the defending champs. The Pistons won in 2004. The Heat won in 2006.

Grant has been really impressive.

And I’ve enjoyed the losses while he’s been out. Pistons need to do nothing but make games competitive. And lose.

I root for flashes from young guys and losses. Is what it is.

 

[dtgold88]

I'm not saying it is a problem. I'm saying that right now he is a big fish in a small pond and historically that usually means that the production is a little inflated. Maybe Jerami Grant really has become an all-star level player in his 9th year. Or maybe he's just on a crappy team which lets him get more shots.




We were talking about 2007? And I said that the the Pistons were the default favorite because they won 53 games. You said also because they were the defending champs. The Pistons won in 2004. The Heat won in 2006.

I agree with that first part if they are scoring only because they take a ton of shots but are inefficient. A young guard hitting 48% of his shots and getting 4+ apg as a SG is kind of impressive, no?

None of this is to say he'll be an elite player, but seems a little off to call his ceiling borderline all star when as a 22-year-old he's already a borderline all star and probably 5 years away from his best seasons. Also, it's not like they passed on a much better player and took, say Knox.

My bad on that second part. Went by memory and the memory failed. I thought Pistons won in previous season.

 

[flyerhawk]

Grant has been really impressive.

And I’ve enjoyed the losses while he’s been out. Pistons need to do nothing but make games competitive. And lose.

I root for flashes from young guys and losses. Is what it is.

He's been a nice surprise for the Pistons.

I was listening to Ryen Russillo and Bill Simmons a few days and they were talking about how many players could score 20+ points a game in the right situation. They started off with a pretty low number like 50 but quickly put it well over a 100.

 

[dtgold88]

He's been a nice surprise for the Pistons.

I was listening to Ryen Russillo and Bill Simmons a few days and they were talking about how many players could score 20+ points a game in the right situation. They started off with a pretty low number like 50 but quickly put it well over a 100.

could they have done it on 48% shooting at age 22 and contributed 4+ assists?

did you even consider how absurd (or foolish if you prefer) this is? I mean, only 360 are on gameday rosters for all teams. "Well over 100"? He thinks nearly 1/3rd could go for 20+ a night? what, exactly, is "the right situation"? the G League affiliate?

 

[flyerhawk]

I agree with that first part if they are scoring only because they take a ton of shots but are inefficient. A young guard hitting 48% of his shots and getting 4+ apg as a SG is kind of impressive, no?

You talking about Tyrese Haliburton who is shooting 48% with 5 assists a game? Sexton is doing well. I just don't think it is quite the achievement you think it is.

None of this is to say he'll be an elite player, but seems a little off to call his ceiling borderline all star when as a 22-year-old he's already a borderline all star and probably 5 years away from his best seasons. Also, it's not like they passed on a much better player and took, say Knox.

Most players don't become all-stars. Even among the young guards which ones would you take? Ball, Sexton, or Young? I don't think Sexton was a bad pick. I said that choose Garland was not a great decision mostly because it is really hard to succeed with 2 small point guards.

My bad on that second part. Went by memory and the memory failed. I thought Pistons won in previous season.

No worries. By 2007 they no longer had Ben Wallace or their coach and Rasheed was using a walker.

 

[dtgold88]

You talking about Tyrese Haliburton who is shooting 48% with 5 assists a game? Sexton is doing well. I just don't think it is quite the achievement you think it is.



Most players don't become all-stars. Even among the young guards which ones would you take? Ball, Sexton, or Young? I don't think Sexton was a bad pick. I said that choose Garland was not a great decision mostly because it is really hard to succeed with 2 small point guards.



No worries. By 2007 they no longer had Ben Wallace or their coach and Rasheed was using a walker.

Not sure what you think I think his achievement is. I think he's having a really nice start to his career and few in the league have done what he has done at his age. Haliburton looks really good IMO. Doesn't make Sexton a lesser talent than he is.

I do think Ball will be better and probably Young. Not sure I called Sexton elite....in fact I've said a number of times he's not. Elite not expected with the 8th pick (or even 5th). I mean, I wish we picked higher than 8, 5 and 5 and got better players.

Did you say who they should have taken instead of Garland even with benefit of hindsight? We seem on same page that NBA FO guys pretty much all think alike and mostly follow the mocks. Should they have taken a lesser player who was taller?

 

[flyerhawk]

Not sure what you think I think his achievement is. I think he's having a really nice start to his career and few in the league have done what he has done at his age. Haliburton looks really good IMO. Doesn't make Sexton a lesser talent than he is.

He's having a nice start. Not sure I would consider it rare especially in the high scoring NBA of today.

I do think Ball will be better and probably Young. Not sure I called Sexton elite....in fact I've said a number of times he's not. Elite not expected with the 8th pick (or even 5th). I mean, I wish we picked higher than 8, 5 and 5 and got better players.

I didn't say you called him elite. You seem really obsessed with your draft slots. I guess you think you guys should get the 1st pick everytime?

Did you say who they should have taken instead of Garland even with benefit of hindsight? We seem on same page that NBA FO guys pretty much all think alike and mostly follow the mocks. Should they have taken a lesser player who was taller?

Still not getting it, huh? I think that FOs do generally see things the same way. But that doesn't mean they all prioritize the same things.

I think that White, Hachimura or Hayes would have all been better fits on the team.

 

[broncosmitty]

He's been a nice surprise for the Pistons.

I was listening to Ryen Russillo and Bill Simmons a few days and they were talking about how many players could score 20+ points a game in the right situation. They started off with a pretty low number like 50 but quickly put it well over a 100.

I’m sure it’s higher than 100. If you have length or quickness, so you can make your own shot.

The only thing Grant is doing significantly better at is shooting from the line. The other increases are volume for the most part. But I do think he’s established himself as a guy that can be looked to for more scoring, moving forward with his career.

 

[dtgold88]

He's having a nice start. Not sure I would consider it rare especially in the high scoring NBA of today.



I didn't say you called him elite. You seem really obsessed with your draft slots. I guess you think you guys should get the 1st pick everytime?



Still not getting it, huh? I think that FOs do generally see things the same way. But that doesn't mean they all prioritize the same things.

I think that White, Hachimura or Hayes would have all been better fits on the team.

Tell me all the young guards going for 24 on 48% shooting and 4+ apg as a SG please.

Not so much obsessed as pointing out guys picked 8th, 5th and 5th not expected to be elite. Not like we picked 1st, 1st and 3rd and still took 6 years to get to the playoffs or something.

I get it fine. You have nothing but baseless opinions to go on. You also move the goal posts to suit your needs. Hachimura is playing with elite guards and his team isn't really doing much are they? Hayes would be better than Allen? I could buy White, but his team is one year ahead of Cavs in rebuild and nothing special. His overall shooting and 3 point shooting are way worse than Garland, as is his scoring. But he's taller, at least?

 

[WiggyRuss]

Really?! You think I should root for the Pistons to win? I'll take any infatesimal percentage of them getting a better lottery pick because there ain't a chance in hell they make even the expanded version of this year's playoffs. They only win by losing.

Sure, some players may build skills, but not enough in the season remaining to make up for even one place higher in the lottery. Better for them to move up and work hard in the offseason.

Lose Pistons Lose! (As if they need me cheering to do that)

exactly

the NBA has set it up this way. And while there might not be a huge difference in one or two spots- the difference between 3 or 4 spots can make a huge difference- and there are a lot of teams bunched up.

Winning 6-7 out of 10 could take you from being in line for the 4th best lotto odds to 8th or 9th.

 

[flyerhawk]

Tell me all the young guards going for 24 on 48% shooting and 4+ apg as a SG please.

Not so much obsessed as pointing out guys picked 8th, 5th and 5th not expected to be elite. Not like we picked 1st, 1st and 3rd and still took 6 years to get to the playoffs or something.

I get it fine. You have nothing but baseless opinions to go on. You also move the goal posts to suit your needs. Hachimura is playing with elite guards and his team isn't really doing much are they? Hayes would be better than Allen? I could buy White, but his team is one year ahead of Cavs in rebuild and nothing special. His overall shooting and 3 point shooting are way worse than Garland, as is his scoring. But he's taller, at least?

Jesus you are thin skinned. Not sure why you are so obsessed with the Sixers either. Yeah they wound up with a 1st and 2 3rds and wound up trading up from the 3rd spot to first to get 2 1sts. It's downright weird that you constantly bring this up while ignoring that your team had 3 No. 1 overall picks in the space of 5 years and have shit to show for it.

What were all the top 5 picks the Warriors had? Or the Spurs? Or the Bucks?

Talk about moving the goal posts. Are you seriously arguing that Garland was the better pick over Hayes because they wound up getting Allen? If you're happy with the Cavs and where they are, bully for you. I was trying to have a reasonable discussion with you but as usual it devolves into you being bitchy and defensive.

 

[WiggyRuss]

white haichimura or hayes?

you have got to be fucking kidding me. geezus.