Star Wars Episode 8: The Last Jedi (2017)

[Sparhawk]

They completely glossed over the death of Admiral Ackbar. They briefly mentioned it and I'm not saying they had to have a funeral scene but he was a top person in the rebellion and yet no one seemed to care he died. They pretty much treated him like he was a nameless grunt.

Also one of my biggest issues besides the first half of the movie being boring as shit is they didn't kill Princess Leia. Look we all know how good Carrie was in the role but she's dead and yet Leia is still alive. So instead of giving her a big sendoff farewell(maybe have her be the one to suicide hyper drive into TFO) they act like she's gonna be around in Episode 9 which is the absolute worst thing they could've done. Now she's either A) killed off-screen which is a big fuck you to all the fans or B) still "around" but she's conveniently on some mission we never see or just off screen the whole time and is still talked about like she's still there which is still a big fuck you to the fans.

It would be neat to have Ackbar's son involved, where maybe there's another 'It's a trap!' line to pay homage to the Admiral.

Also, where was Wedge Antilles?
He survived Episodes 4, 5, and 6, and was involved in major fights scenes in all three movies.
Did he train Poe?
It's those little nerd things that make the universe what it should be....

 

[Edonidd]

If it was aimed at me/us old men lifelong Star Wars fans I would rate it either poor or awful. If they were even trying to ake a good movie anymore it would get the same. As a popcorn movie to sell toys, look all the new toys they added in this version. Dreadnaughts, furry penguin things, red suited fighter guys, snokes flagship, new AT-AT walker thingies, a black evil BB-8, etc. It should probably get a solid rating. But since it doesn't exist in a vacuum, I have to accept that they don' care about me, and it's just a meh.

 

[OutlawImmortal]

It was Meh for me. Say what you will about the Force Awakens but it got the feel and pacing of Star Wars right while introducing some new and interesting characters and subplots. Last Jedi doesn't do any of that. Almost every subplot from the first film is either thrown out and not given a pay off. The story moves sideways instead of forward.

This film is not as bad as, but gets Star Wars just as wrong as the prequels. Puppet Yoda showing up and basically saying "History is useless, and books are boring" is indefensible. Luke attempting to kill his nephew is nonsense and completely out of character. This film often contradicts itself.

"so it is time for the jedi to end"
"i will not be the last jedi"

admiral holden sacrifices herself (even though she is completely out of fuel, a plot point that spanned over half the movie)
Rose saves Fin and says sacrifice is wrong

 

[chf]

Its just a little too political to be a kids movie, too.

Meh. Why is a 'republic' inherently superior to an 'empire?' The movie actually tries to put that conflict up on the screen, which is ALWAYS a good thing.

It's not like they spent a shit ton of time on it. Some kids working the track instead of going to school.

Oh the horror!

 

[chf]

Luke attempting to kill his nephew is nonsense and completely out of character.

How so? It's like the old ethical question - if you could go back in time and kill child Hitler, would you do it?

If it's an easy answer that doesn't make you think, then it's not much of an ethical quandary. If his nephew is going to be responsible for the deaths of ___________ people, why is pre-emptively killing him totally out of the question?

They spend a LOT of time talking about how the Jedi's effed up repeatedly by NOT taking enough direct action.

If Luke is withdrawn from the world, and thinks the Jedi need to end, WHY does he think that? It'd have to be something pretty big, no?

 

[chf]

If it was aimed at me/us old men lifelong Star Wars fans I would rate it either poor or awful. If they were even trying to ake a good movie anymore it would get the same. As a popcorn movie to sell toys, look all the new toys they added in this version. Dreadnaughts, furry penguin things, red suited fighter guys, snokes flagship, new AT-AT walker thingies, a black evil BB-8, etc. It should probably get a solid rating. But since it doesn't exist in a vacuum, I have to accept that they don' care about me, and it's just a meh.

Or else you're just a grumpy old fuck? I saw the original at 12, and think the new one was not as lofty as some of the critics are saying. But it was a good solid flick.

 

[OutlawImmortal]

How so? It's like the old ethical question - if you could go back in time and kill child Hitler, would you do it?

If it's an easy answer that doesn't make you think, then it's not much of an ethical quandary. If his nephew is going to be responsible for the deaths of ___________ people, why is pre-emptively killing him totally out of the question?

They spend a LOT of time talking about how the Jedi's effed up repeatedly by NOT taking enough direct action.

If Luke is withdrawn from the world, and thinks the Jedi need to end, WHY does he think that? It'd have to be something pretty big, no?

Given Luke's past, I'd say it's pretty easy to predict which choice he would make. He refused to kill Darth Vader despite facing death because he believed he could be redeemed and because he was his father. Now he believes his own nephew should die, even for a split second, before he's even done anything? A better story that stays true to Luke's character would be to have him see the future darkness in Kylo but continue to try to save him. His major character flaw was always his naivety. He fails to save Kylo and loses faith in the jedi, as there will always be more light side and dark side users who will rise and fall.

I get what they were going for, I really do understand most of the points the movie tries to make. I just don't think it was executed properly or as appropriately as it could of been.

 

[chf]

Given Luke's past, I'd say it's pretty easy to predict which choice he would make. He refused to kill Darth Vader despite facing death because he believed he could be redeemed and because he was his father. Now he believes his own nephew should die, even for a split second, before he's even done anything? A better story that stays true to Luke's character would be to have him see the future darkness in Kylo but continue to try to save him. His major character flaw was always his naivety. He fails to save Kylo and loses faith in the jedi, as there will always be more light side and dark side users who will rise and fall.

I get what they were going for, I really do understand most of the points the movie tries to make. I just don't think it was executed properly or as appropriately as it could of been.

And given where he is now, I don't think it's out of the question that he's have a 'moment' of indecision about doing something ethically questionable for the right outcome.

I actually really liked that part of the movie, where you see the same incident from the two different viewpoints. It's pretty good at illustrating how people can see the same thing and come out of it with two different memories of the same event.

YRMV.

 

[Clayton]

Meh. Why is a 'republic' inherently superior to an 'empire?' The movie actually tries to put that conflict up on the screen, which is ALWAYS a good thing.

It's not like they spent a shit ton of time on it. Some kids working the track instead of going to school.

Oh the horror!

Its a bit clunky for a kids movie just due to the size, weight and scope of the movie. "We are going to win by saving the ones we love instead of destroying those we hate" is a good line for a kids movie. Timing that line right when the Rebellion looks like its about ready to get massacred seems pretty bold. Luke dying also really confuses that overall theme. Merely one person dying as a martyr instead of another.

Having conventional aggression would be an easier movie for kids. Maybe thats just me.

 

[Edonidd]

Or else you're just a grumpy old fuck? I saw the original at 12, and think the new one was not as lofty as some of the critics are saying. But it was a good solid flick.

I'm definitely a grumpy old fuck. And we have a LONG history of disagreeing with each other over this stuff. Honestly I think my biggest problem with 1, 2, and 3 and now 8 and to a much lesser extent 7 is that they are called 1, 2, 3, 7, and 8. If this was 'just' episode 2 of the newest trilogy it would be one thing. But this is episode 8. That conveys a different meaning. And like I said in the other thread about the movie, I felt Luke deserved better. He was like my generations Harry Potter.

 

[chf]

It ain't a Mary Poppins kids viewing world anymore though. I see your point, I just think you're not giving enough credit to how sophisticated kids are these days.

 

[chf]

I'm definitely a grumpy old fuck. And we have a LONG history of disagreeing with each other over this stuff. Honestly I think my biggest problem with 1, 2, and 3 and now 8 and to a much lesser extent 7 is that they are called 1, 2, 3, 7, and 8. If this was 'just' episode 2 of the newest trilogy it would be one thing. But this is episode 8. That conveys a different meaning. And like I said in the other thread about the movie, I felt Luke deserved better. He was like my generations Harry Potter.

He went out the same way Ben Kenobi did.

He went out the same way Alec fucking Guinness did.

I think you'd made up your mind more than halfway before you darkened the theater door.

 

[chf]

And we have a LONG history of disagreeing with each other over this stuff.

And to be clear, the above is why I uncorked the G.O.F. line.

Luvs ya' Ed.

 

[Edonidd]

He went out the same way Ben Kenobi did.

He went out the same way Alec fucking Guinness did.

I think you'd made up your mind more than halfway before you darkened the theater door.

But he didn't. "Strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine." If you view it as simple and literally just buying time so the others can escape, then yes, he did the same thing as Obi-Wan Kenobi. But it was more than that. It wsss ultimately the foreshadowing of how the good guys could win. Instead they had Luke play a trick. And he lived. But then died?

The reality was they wanted Luke out of the way so Rey could be the hero. And that's fine. But he has earned at least a meaningful death. What they gave him was just a throw away scene.

 

[tabascojet]

this movie was meh at best.....some interesting visuals and no jar jar or darth "yipee" vader moment thank god.but its still bad. as someone mentioned before the whole movie was basically bad guys chasing good guys in space until they run out of gas. and why wouldnt the bad guys just hyper jump closer so they were in range and had the fuel to do it??

face it 7 was basically just a remake of 4 but still left the viewers with a lot of interesting questions that the new director just shit on and said fuck that. who is snoke and where did he come from.....nope kill him. who were reys parents......nobodies doesnt matter. who is captain phasma....nope kill her too maybe. find luke to show us the way.....nope he dont care(throwing his laser sword away and then commit suicide for what exactly??)

some asian pipe cleaner suddenly gets a seat in one of the last miserable ships in the big battle to save the rebellion. dumb. whole arc to get a hacker in casino world that fails and ultimately makes no difference anyway. dumb. leah superman survival and on to the next film when actress is dead. dumb. 2 1/2 hours long and long stretches of boring. dumb. 2 years for this stinker. dumb. etc etc etc.

 

[DarthVedder]

I don't understand the universal acclaim from "professional critics". Even if you liked the movie, it's fair to say that it is very polarizing, and some parts of it are just insultingly dumb or don't work in any way. Are critics afraid to be overly critical of a Star Wars movie? Are they afraid to be critical of a movie starring a woman and a diverse cast?

 

[OutlawImmortal]

And given where he is now, I don't think it's out of the question that he's have a 'moment' of indecision about doing something ethically questionable for the right outcome.

I actually really liked that part of the movie, where you see the same incident from the two different viewpoints. It's pretty good at illustrating how people can see the same thing and come out of it with two different memories of the same event.

YRMV.

That was pretty creative. I suppose Obi Wan lied to Luke as well, although the circumstances make this a bit different. Obi Wan lied to protect Luke, Luke lied to protect himself. It's not like I thought the movie was horrible, there were some things I liked about it.

 

[Mike A. S.]

I watched it a second time last night. A few thoughts from that:

1) The Leia "Mary Poppins" scene is just as bad the second time.
2) Although JJ Abrams could still easily change course and call it a lie, I think Rian Johnson really meant it to be the truth that Rey's parents were nobodies.
3) I still think Phasma should've lived since Snoke died as well, but the way she died was a little more believable than I remembered the first time. At first I was thinking Finn simply defeated her more than he really did.
4) Although I think it was painfully obvious for most people, I didn't catch the first time that the boy that uses the force at the end to get the broom was the same boy that Finn & Rose met earlier.
5) The scene when Luke projects himself on Crait is even more fun to watch when you look for the clues that show he isn't really there. Like the salt not turning red when he steps, the fact that he's much younger and that he has the destroyed blue light saber.


All-in-all a very good movie though, that I really enjoyed!

 

[Sparhawk]

I watched it a second time last night. A few thoughts from that:

1) The Leia "Mary Poppins" scene is just as bad the second time.
2) Although JJ Abrams could still easily change course and call it a lie, I think Rian Johnson really meant it to be the truth that Rey's parents were nobodies.
3) I still think Phasma should've lived since Snoke died as well, but the way she died was a little more believable than I remembered the first time. At first I was thinking Finn simply defeated her more than he really did.
4) Although I think it was painfully obvious for most people, I didn't catch the first time that the boy that uses the force at the end to get the broom was the same boy that Finn & Rose met earlier.
5) The scene when Luke projects himself on Crait is even more fun to watch when you look for the clues that show he isn't really there. Like the salt not turning red when he steps, the fact that he's much younger and that he has the destroyed blue light saber.


All-in-all a very good movie though, that I really enjoyed!

Saw it a second time myself.

Agree with 1 and 2.
Phasma needed a better death or a longer battle to be a part of.

#5 was really well done. They made a distinct effort to show Kylo Ren move his foot on the salt, almost like a samurai warrior sliding his foot for balance, leaving the red mark. Then, moments later, Luke moves his foot and nary a speck of red wherever he stepped. Also, their sabers never touch during the sequence. And when Luke slides under the lightsaber and twirls into a balanced stance, again, no red from those movements.

Also noticed that Luke mentions that Kylo left with several other trainees? Are these the Knights of Ren? Odd that we see them in Rey's visions when she first touches Luke's lightsaber in TFA and nowhere else.

 

[Mike A. S.]

Saw it a second time myself.

Agree with 1 and 2.
Phasma needed a better death or a longer battle to be a part of.

#5 was really well done. They made a distinct effort to show Kylo Ren move his foot on the salt, almost like a samurai warrior sliding his foot for balance, leaving the red mark. Then, moments later, Luke moves his foot and nary a speck of red wherever he stepped. Also, their sabers never touch during the sequence. And when Luke slides under the lightsaber and twirls into a balanced stance, again, no red from those movements.

Also noticed that Luke mentions that Kylo left with several other trainees? Are these the Knights of Ren? Odd that we see them in Rey's visions when she first touches Luke's lightsaber in TFA and nowhere else.

I agree about Phasma. And yeah, I bet we see something with those trainees in episode IX and I would guess they are the Knights of Ren.