Hoke's WR's

[jalopy]

2012
Jehu Chesson *** 6'3" 182lbs
Amara Darboh *** 6'2" 190lbs
2013
Jaron Dukes *** 6'4" 197lbs
Csont'e York *** 6'3" 185lbs
Da'mario Jones *** 6'2" lbs
2014
Maurice Ways *** 6'3" 192lbs
Drake Harris **** 6'4" 180lbs
TBD **** 5'10" 175lbs (Please!)

Above are the WR's Hoke & Co have attracted to AA over the last three recruiting classes. Of this group, do any project to have the talent to be an elite receiver at the college level?

After watching film on all of the above, I would say that the only one that has the speed, hands, and route running to do this is Jones. Harris has the speed but needs to develop size and route running (likely as he is still a high school junior).

I hate that Hoke is concentrating on size (tall, skinny) instead of talent. History has shown us that size is irrelevant for a WR, especially in college.

Anyway, just some more inane offseason ramblings.

 

[nonbcsfan]

oh I was just waiting for you to start a thread about this topic... here is my opinion...

best overall - Harris
fastest - Harris and Chesson
sleeper - Jones

I am expecting Darboh to be a solid contributor starting this year, while Dukes and York will probably end up being situations players. I am interested in seeing what will happen to the slot position once Gallon and Dileo graduate... I am hoping that Hayes and Norfleet will contribute there.

 

[jalopy]

Just seems to me they are trying to fit a profile instead of a position and I think recruits sense it. As for the slot, I think Artavis Scott would fit in perfect (realistically, zero chance). I get the sense that in a couple of years we will see Jones emerge as the most legitimate option. He doesn't have that sense of entitlement that Harris does.

I love the direction that Hoke has the program headed, I just don't like the style of football. As I've said before, we are looking like Wisconsin on steroids.

 

[nonbcsfan]

It is always tough to predict how they will end up, all I can do is looks at the tape and judge them by their highlights... I think that Jones is better than his generic 3 star ranking, but Harris looks like a borderline 5 star guy... Since I don't know these guys personally, I can't judge their character.

I see Michigan being similar to Carr's teams, hopefully the playcalling on offense will be a little more creative, and it seems as though that Hoke is far more aggressive than Carr was when it comes to going for it on the 4th down.

 

[Coyote57]

I hate that Hoke is concentrating on size (tall, skinny) instead of talent.

J,

I don't think the way this reads is the way you meant it. You seem to be saying that Hoke purposefully avoids talented receivers so he can spend the schollies on tall kids.

That he hasn't had a top 10 WR sign a LOI is not the same as saying he hasn't tried to bring in a WR talent. I seem to recall a lot of discussion on the old board about a certain WR who flirted w/ UM ... surely he's not the only talented kid Hoke has tried to bring in.

Perhaps someone with the time and resources can find a list of all the WR's recruited by Hoke and determine if he has purposefully avoided talented WRs?

I do believe that Ht is relevant in the college game, and - considering the talent level of college DBs compared to pro's - it might be even more relevant than in the pros. I'm thinking of all those college Tall guys in the red zone and 3rd down conversions - like the USC kid the Lions (MM) drafted a while back - that have those glittering TD stats. Not saying that shifty slot guys are not extremely important, here. Just thinking about what Ht brings to the table in the college game.

There is also the down-field blocking aspect to consider, too. I think this may be one of things the UM brain trust saw as missing in the Run-game... effective stalk-blocks. Is it possible that the emphasis on big WR's in these 1st couple classes is tied to lack of them on the roster when taking over... like the lack of OLine and LB talent? And an perhaps an intent to get more downfield passing (esp. Play-action) to the WR's into the game, w/ a bit less of the dink-n-dunk short game?

I'm also thinking w/ the TE talent coming in, there's an intent to up-grade and increase the emphasis on Big Guys controlling the middle of the field and the blocking the down field blocking they represent, rather relying on little guys trying to do the same.

Since its kinda slow on the board at the moment, perhaps there's a discussion in here worth considering?

 

[Coyote57]

hopefully the playcalling on offense will be a little more creative, and it seems as though that Hoke is far more aggressive than Carr

Bundini,

I get the sense that once Uncle Al (the player's pal?) is in his wheel-house, the only thing similar to Carr's offense will be the formations. And while I see both Carr and Hoke as meat-n-potatoes guys, I get the impression Hoke prefers his with Hot Sauce.

 

[RobBase]

2012
Jehu Chesson *** 6'3" 182lbs
Amara Darboh *** 6'2" 190lbs
2013
Jaron Dukes *** 6'4" 197lbs
Csont'e York *** 6'3" 185lbs
Da'mario Jones *** 6'2" lbs
2014
Maurice Ways *** 6'3" 192lbs
Drake Harris **** 6'4" 180lbs

Oh man, I love it. This looks like a MI WR corps from the 80's and 90's. FINALLY erasing the RR era and all those shrimps he was infatuated with.

 

[jalopy]

I don't think the way this reads is the way you meant it. You seem to be saying that Hoke purposefully avoids talented receivers so he can spend the schollies on tall kids.
It read the way I intended. Hoke is recruiting gets based on size first, talent second.

Oh man, I love it. This looks like a MI WR corps from the 80's and 90's. FINALLY erasing the RR era and all those shrimps he was infatuated with.
Oy vey! I have never read a sentence that can be wrong in so many ways. You might want to check the size of our Heisman winners and a guy named AC. As for piling on RR, please refer to previous threads.

I see Michigan being similar to Carr's teams, hopefully the playcalling on offense will be a little more creative, and it seems as though that Hoke is far more aggressive than Carr was when it comes to going for it on the 4th down.
Hoke appears more similar to Bo than Lloyd. WR's are to be used only when absolutely necessary. It's not like I am looking for Michigan's offense to mirror Oregon (OK, I am) but joining the 21st century (or even the 20th) would be a start.

 

[jalopy]

There is also the down-field blocking aspect to consider, too. I think this may be one of things the UM brain trust saw as missing in the Run-game..
I specifically included the weights to dissuade this contention. Maybe the problem with our running game is our running backs suck. Or we have lacked an effective gameplan to make the defense respect our, dare I say it, passing game.

 

[RobBase]

Oh man, I love it. This looks like a MI WR corps from the 80's and 90's. FINALLY erasing the RR era and all those shrimps he was infatuated with.
Oy vey! I have never read a sentence that can be wrong in so many ways. You might want to check the size of our Heisman winners and a guy named AC.

What are you some kind of MI history front runner? Just get into MI this year and only memorized the top of the bandwagon?

Desmond Howard and Anthony Carter are only two guys, and neither of them were 5' 6" shrimps like RR loved so much. Both of them were almost 6' (5' 10" and 5' 11" respectively).

Some others names you should look up in your Welcome to Campus handbook:

Mario Manningham 6'
Marquise Walker - 6' 2"
David Terrell - 6' 2"
Amani Toomer - 6' 3"
Derrick Alexander - 6' 3"
Braylon Edwards - 6' 3"

 

[Sox33OSU]

Part of the reason you aren't getting top flight WRs has to do with the fact that you haven't had a WR drafted any higher than the 3rd round in 9 years. Maybe if you start developing these kids properly you'll attract more top-flight kids. Can't put the cart before the horse.

 

[jalopy]

Thank you for proving my point for me. Michigan's leading receivers relied on talent, rather than size. Notice that my point relied on talent being the determining factor for success, not size. Your examples show an almost perfect spread along a bell curve.There is zero chance Desmond could be stretched to reach 5'9" and AC at 5'11" would have to be on stilts.

What are you some kind of MI history front runner? Just get into MI this year and only memorized the top of the bandwagon?
You might not realize the error your judgement produced here, but others will. Hope you can do better in the future.

 

[RobBase]

Notice that my point relied on talent being the determining factor for success, not size.

I notice your point relies on only your opinion of who is or isn't talented, and nothing else. Your ego is out of control buddy.

 

[jalopy]

I notice your point relies on only your opinion of who is or isn't talented, and nothing else. Your ego is out of control buddy.
Ego is overrated when you know you are always right.

 

[RobBase]

Ego is overrated when you know you are always right.

 

[jalopy]

C'mon, this is a Michigan board, you must be able to do better than that or people might begin to suspect you lack an actual degree.

 

[jalopy]

2012
Marquise Lee- 5'11"
Terrance Williams 6'1"
2011
Justin Blackmon 6"1"
Robert Woods 6'0"
2010
Ryan Broyles 5'10"
2009
Golden Tate 5'11"
Jordan Shipley 6'0"
2008
Michael Crabtree 6'1"
Dez Bryant 6'1"

Above is a list of First Team all-America WR's (AP) since 2008. What do all of them have in common? They are all shorter than Hoke's shortest WR recruit.

 

[Chief]

I don't know Hoke's history targeting WR's at Michigan. Though I'd have to say he has went after a few talented WR's.

There are only so many to go around and we can't get them all. Seriously, why wouldn't a top flight WR want to go to a school that throws the ball? Something we haven't done very well in 5 years.

At this point, I simply think J wouldn't be happy unless every recruit was 5 Star. Anything less is a fail in his book. Really starting to see Windy's perspective about you not really being a Michigan fan.

 

[jalopy]

At this point, I simply think J wouldn't be happy unless every recruit was 5 Star. Anything less is a fail in his book. Really starting to see Windy's perspective about you not really being a Michigan fan.
Chief, good points. The thing is, I judge the progress differently than most. 99% of you will tell me that W's and L's will be the judge. I wholeheartedly disagree. While not irrelevant, they are far from the litmus test I use.
In my professional world, if I am not on the leading edge of progress, I fail. Hoke is using a gameplan that is tried and proven to be successful. His failing is not seeing that blueprint was for another era. College football has moved on. If Hoke accomplishes his goals, Michigan Football will indeed return to prominence and be a big fish in a small pond (B1G). Do you want the program to compete for the Rose Bowl (if it even still exists) every year, or do you want Michigan's name etched on a national championship trophy?
As for me not being a Michigan fanatic, you are partially correct. I am a fan and supporter of the University of Michigan and want the football program to be more than a fiduciary benefit. It used to be an inspiration. It no longer is.
By the way, I wish you and yours a happy Memorial Day Weekend. Many, including me, are thankful for the service of you and those like you.

 

[nonbcsfan]

I see Michigan being similar to Carr's teams, hopefully the playcalling on offense will be a little more creative, and it seems as though that Hoke is far more aggressive than Carr was when it comes to going for it on the 4th down.
Hoke appears more similar to Bo than Lloyd. WR's are to be used only when absolutely necessary. It's not like I am looking for Michigan's offense to mirror Oregon (OK, I am) but joining the 21st century (or even the 20th) would be a start.

well I see you've met a whole bunch of new friends J... I am not sure I agree that Hoke would only use the WRs only when it is necessary, after all Gallon came alive when Gardner became the QB... imagine the damage that the play action would cause if Michigan could actually establish a running game through the RB instead of Denard or Gardner running for their lives? The nature of the "west coast" offense is to establish the run first and thus make the vertical passing game more effective on play action, if you consider that to be 20th century, then you'll just have to learn to enjoy the past like the rest of the fan base...