Did Michael Jordan ruin basketball? Absolutely!

[Epoch1]

I came across this article today and it asked a question that I have been debating since the 1990's.

The writer says what I've been saying ever since the NBA started promoting ISO ball and highlighting players rather then teams.

The win by the Spurs this year brought appreciation for TEAM basketball back... if only for this year. The Spurs proved that a great TEAM will always beat a great player.

Anyone want to chime in?

 

[HammerDown]

Yeah, the Spurs will be the end of team basketball as we know and love it. I'm not sure MJ deserves to be mentioned in the same ISO sentence with LeBron, 'Melo or D-wade though. MJ was a killer, these guys are pussies.

 

[tlance]

It isn't Jordan, the culture of youth basketball is the problem.

Instead of developing fundamental skills, like they used to, players spend all spring/summer traveling around the country playing in glorified pick ups games (AAU). The focus of these AAU tournaments is more about exposure for the individual player than it is about team success.

For this reason, many of our most talented players don't really know how to play when they graduate high school. The AAU culture is more to blame than the NBA's marketing strategy, but that surely plays a part too.

 

[erckm510]

Don't have any clue what the hell the writer is talking about. There were other players before Jordan who played iso ball. The NBA has always highlighted its stars since the 70's. And it's not like Jordan won it by himself. He had a great team and a great coaching system(like the Spurs have and they also have 3 future HOF's). So when the Heat won they didn't win it as a team? Don't recall Lebron hogging the ball.

Bottom line you can't win in the NBA by yourself.

 

[Inimical]

I came across this article today and it asked a question that I have been debating since the 1990's.

The writer says what I've been saying ever since the NBA started promoting ISO ball and highlighting players rather then teams.

The win by the Spurs this year brought appreciation for TEAM basketball back... if only for this year. The Spurs proved that a great TEAM will always beat a great player.

Anyone want to chime in?

I couldnt read the article because the author immediately blamed Jordan. He then states before Jordan it was a team game. The bulls were a fucking team and a half!

If by ruin its meant that he gave the game global awareness, infused it into popular culture, grew the game farther then it had ever been before, became an modern Icon and Legend when there hadnt been one like that in quiet some time, solidified himself as one of the, if not the greatest ever. Then no, not at all.

If you are trying to say that the game revolves more on an individual now more then ever before, well thats not a Jordan issue, thats a perception issue. As far as Iso ball goes, this is nullified by great defenders. Recent examples in NBA finals that came after Jordan that come to mind are Tyron Lue/Allen Iverson, Bruce Bowen/Kobe Bryant, Lebron James/Kawhai Leonard. No one wins with ISO ball IMO.

I have to say that the Spurs have won 5 titles in 15 years like this. So i dont agree at all. I think the problem is the "Super Team Shit".

Not Jordan.

 

[RegentDenali]

Stern ruined it. Jordan was simply along for the ride.

 

[whywork2]

he ruined baseball

 

[Inimical]

Stern ruined it. Jordan was simply along for the ride.

Stern definitely pussified the league. You cant touch star players anymore. And this leads to star players being about to exploit their gifts more easily. Thus relying less on a team ball aspect, and more on a , "hey you can drive to the hole and get a foul everytime or they will just let you score." Bullshit!

 

[DoobeeDoobeeDoo]

Yeah, Jordan ruined basketball :rollseyes:

 

[Epoch1]

It isn't Jordan, the culture of youth basketball is the problem.

Instead of developing fundamental skills, like they used to, players spend all spring/summer traveling around the country playing in glorified pick ups games (AAU). The focus of these AAU tournaments is more about exposure for the individual player than it is about team success.

For this reason, many of our most talented players don't really know how to play when they graduate high school. The AAU culture is more to blame than the NBA's marketing strategy, but that surely plays a part too.

I certainly agree that youth basketball programs are to blame to a point. College and HS teams have started emulating the NBA image. The decline in players that have no fundamental skills is appalling.

I guess we can agree that focusing on an individual rather than team play is responsible for the decline in basketball as a team sport.

 

[Epoch1]

Don't have any clue what the hell the writer is talking about. There were other players before Jordan who played iso ball. The NBA has always highlighted its stars since the 70's. And it's not like Jordan won it by himself. He had a great team and a great coaching system(like the Spurs have and they also have 3 future HOF's). So when the Heat won they didn't win it as a team? Don't recall Lebron hogging the ball.

Bottom line you can't win in the NBA by yourself.

I recall ISO ball as a product of the 1990's and Stern's marketing practices. Kids today worship a player... rarely are they team fans.

Other the Dominique Wilkins, the One-Man-Wonder-Why-He-Never-Won-One superstar I can't think of anyone that would be considered an ISO star.

 

[podsox]

Stern definitely pussified the league. You cant touch star players anymore. And this leads to star players being about to exploit their gifts more easily. Thus relying less on a team ball aspect, and more on a , "hey you can drive to the hole and get a foul everytime or they will just let you score." Bullshit!

kemba walker won a ncaa title doing this

 

[Epoch1]

Stern ruined it. Jordan was simply along for the ride.

Stern had a lot to do with it for sure. A LOT!

 

[Epoch1]

Stern definitely pussified the league. You cant touch star players anymore. And this leads to star players being about to exploit their gifts more easily. Thus relying less on a team ball aspect, and more on a , "hey you can drive to the hole and get a foul everytime or they will just let you score." Bullshit!

This, along with the corrupt refereeing that is clearly targeted at protecting stars like James and shackling any real attempt at defending him, have turned a great team game into a superstar beauty contest.

If the refs called James for an offensive foul every time he basically just ran into a defender and was then rewarded with a trip to the FT line, he would foul out a game a week.

 

[podsox]

hopefully the super teams are dead for awhile after bron and melo decisions

 

[tlance]

Stern definitely pussified the league. You cant touch star players anymore. And this leads to star players being about to exploit their gifts more easily. Thus relying less on a team ball aspect, and more on a , "hey you can drive to the hole and get a foul everytime or they will just let you score." Bullshit!

The game is actually more physical today than ever before in terms of the contact that is allowed during the flow of the game.

What they have done away with are the flagrant fouls and the non-basketball plays where the defender tries to take the player out with no attempt to make a play on the ball. There is no place for the Bill Laimbeer flagrant fouls in the game of basketball, so the league has got this one right.

 

[podsox]

The game is actually more physical today than ever before in terms of the contact that is allowed during the flow of the game.

What they have done away with are the flagrant fouls and the non-basketball plays where the defender tries to take the player out with no attempt to make a play on the ball. There is no place for the Bill Laimbeer flagrant fouls in the game of basketball, so the league has got this one right.

they have taken away basketball plays too. any contact above the shoulders is basically a flagrant now

 

[tlance]

they have taken away basketball plays too. any contact above the shoulders is basically a flagrant now

But as far as body contact on drives, there is more allowed now than ever before.

The game is physical in a different way.

 

[tlance]

they have taken away basketball plays too. any contact above the shoulders is basically a flagrant now

It depends.

If I am trying to block your shot and I hit you upside the head on the follow through, that won't be called flagrant. In fact, it will be a no call if I get the ball first. That example would have been a foul back when I played.

 

[Jims_Doors]

Free agency (which didn't happen till the summer of 1988) and expansion / adding new teams killed the team aspect. It's gotten to the point where you would have one very good to great player playing with nothing but role players. The superstar had to play ISO ball for his team to compete.

The majority of the 80's you played with the same teammates just about every year. The only way you didn't is if they were traded. Why fix it if it aint broke?

Plus it's funny the dude who wrote that article called James a quitter and that's why he'll never be Jordan. No chance that Miami was coming back from an 18pt deficit when Lebron left the game.