Game Thread: #10 Oklahoma State at #23 Texas (FOX)

[Hook'Em0608]

See ya

 

[ChrisperJ10]

Here's a good one for ya: texas football! Hilarious, right? That was a joke.

Here's a better one. Mizzou left because I bet they'd get skull fucked by OU, OSU, and Baylor. Would probably lose to Texas as well. So what do call a bitch who leaves earlier than usual?

 

[Wishbone]

Well I guess texas is who we thought they where. Should just be thankful they don't have 5 losses at this point.

 

[BenM]

Average coaches can win BCS championships. You surround yourself with talented asst. coaches. For example: Bob Stoops. You are kind of saying the same thing I am. "Below average game day coach and over all an average coach." I totally agree with you! Remember, I'm the one who has said this for 4 years. Yes CBS message board. We agree here!!! We disagree in some areas, bur overall we are splitting hairs.

"There is no doubt he is the #2 Longhorn HC. If not him, who?" You better go back and read my reply again. Again, I agree with you. I just think we should have better. I've always thought that. Just an opinion.

We disagree strongly on two things. One, I don't think he is a great recruiter. Good, but not great. I base that on always losing at least one game every year to someone we shouldn't just about every year, and only 4 BCS games. If you have great talent on the field from great recruiting, you do better then that over 16 years. Two, you calling plays that Texas should have run from your living room. Trust me, these coaches know the strengths and weaknesses of our players and more importantly Ok. st. players. They call plays that they think gives them the best odds at that moment in time. Is there some guessing involved, yes, but for the most part it's based on a strategy. It doesn't always work out, but I'll take their calls over a living room journalism student any day. If they called plays like Boise St, then it's because they thought it gave them the best chance to win. Again, maybe we just don't have the talent to pull it off. Back to that recruiting thing. Again, we disagree. Still think you just need to let it go.


P.S. Yes I'm the same Phantom. I never said I wasn't. I could careless that you know that. Why is that a big deal for you?

Average coaches can win BCS championships ? Of course they can, even less than average coaches can. Mack proved that in 2005. Saben's string of wins at 'bama has been remarkable,but with the best collection of collegiate athletes on the planet earth, even Mack could have won. Certainly, Saben is a very able coach in his own right, but it helps to have a capable staff and great players. Coaches like Briles at Baylor and Gundy at Ok St accomplish far more with less than many of the higher paid coaches at the larger schools.

 

[charlie42s]

You don't understand the concept of average. Study statistics at a college level and you'd understand you are wrong. Understand that college football consists of 120+ FBS, 50 or so FCS teams and you'll realize that average means an average coach doesn't coach at Texas. smh.

 

[BenM]

Oh my, the responses on this forum never cease to amaze me. I don't need statistics to know what an average means - I learned that some years ago in the 4th grade at PS No. 3 . Average in the context of the preceding discussions was not meant in any literal, numerical, or statistical sense, but simply as a descriptor for a run of the mill head coach. Do you understand now !

 

[charlie42s]

Your opinion is worthless, because you think a run-of-the-mill/below-average coach has the ability to win NCs.
I'm guessing you consider almost every HC in college football to be like that.

 

[Hornsstampede2.0]

Mack is a good coach.

It is asinine to judge his 30 year career (including good success at UNC) based on finishing 9-4 in 2012.

I am embarrassed to be a Texas fan when our whiny fans get so spoiled....

Good coaches have bad runs.

And frankly 8-5, 9-4, 8-5 is not even that god awful bad.

Bo never even won a national title while sucking in every bowl game.
Tom Osborne once lost 10 bowl games in a row.

Mack gave Texas one of the greatest runs of sustained success in the modern era.

I am starting to believe the Aggies.

We are in fact the single most spoiled and entitled fan base. It is embarrassing.

 

[charlie42s]

Naw, we just have some loud, dumb bandwagon fans.

 

[y2ktors]

Mack is a good coach.

It is asinine to judge his 30 year career (including good success at UNC) based on finishing 9-4 in 2012.

I am embarrassed to be a Texas fan when our whiny fans get so spoiled....

Good coaches have bad runs.

And frankly 8-5, 9-4, 8-5 is not even that god awful bad.

Bo never even won a national title while sucking in every bowl game.
Tom Osborne once lost 10 bowl games in a row.

Mack gave Texas one of the greatest runs of sustained success in the modern era.

I am starting to believe the Aggies.

We are in fact the single most spoiled and entitled fan base. It is embarrassing.

It's not about being spoiled in a lot of cases. It's about having an elitist and arrogant mentality. It trickles down to the fanbase. It comes from the university and its alumni. I grew up in Texas. I live in Austin. I love Austin. I HATE the Longhorns. Never have I known a school to put themselves on such a pedestal without having the championships to back their talk up. One national championship post-DKR as the "big dog" of the most talent-rich state in the country football wise is nothing to be behaving all arrogant about.

 

[y2ktors]

Your opinion is worthless, because you think a run-of-the-mill/below-average coach has the ability to win NCs.
I'm guessing you consider almost every HC in college football to be like that.

Gene chizik anyone?

 

[charlie42s]

Chizik is an excellent defensive HC. The problem is he was unable to keep the big backers happy.

A College Football HC has many attributes. The ability to understand defensive and offensive schemes. As well as special teams. It helps to a game day coach who recognizes the need to change those schemes when the plans doesn't work.

The ability to recruit athletes and donors is just as important. To succeed he must have ethics, both personal and business.

 

[TexasExes98]

I've been out of state for business all weekend and didn't get to see the game - luckily.

Looks like we won total yards and time of possession. Appears we ran a bunch of the old dink and dunk and sideline screen shit that has sucked for years. Also looks like 3 ints were the major factor?

Yes? No? Were the ints all Case fault?

Put it this way Hizzle, Major Applewhite should have been fired after the game. I've been saying all year long he should have been shown the door along with Diaz.

 

[occupant]

Naw, we just have some loud, dumb bandwagon fans.

It's a pandemic I'm afraid....and it in no way is limited to the boundaries of texas proper.

 

[y2ktors]

Chizik is an excellent defensive HC. The problem is he was unable to keep the big backers happy.

A College Football HC has many attributes. The ability to understand defensive and offensive schemes. As well as special teams. It helps to a game day coach who recognizes the need to change those schemes when the plans doesn't work.

The ability to recruit athletes and donors is just as important. To succeed he must have ethics, both personal and business.

Dude that's nothing but a bunch of BS. Outside of one Cam Newton season, his record as a HC is 24-38.

Him having some success as a DC doesn't make him a formidable head coach.

 

[charlie42s]

Dude that's nothing but a bunch of BS. Outside of one Cam Newton season, his record as a HC is 24-38.

Him having some success as a DC doesn't make him a formidable head coach.

I never wrote that he was 'a formidable head coach'. You're the one pushing BS. I wrote only one thing about Chizik and that was he was an excellent DC.

 

[Codaxx]

It's a pandemic I'm afraid....and it in no way is limited to the boundaries of texas proper.

It is a fact of modern College Football. You no longer can have 3-4 down yrs and survive. Recruiting game has gone national. DKR coudl have bad seasons. Bama, ND, and Oregon were not visiting Texas recruits. You have a few down yrs and now it affects recruiting and turns 2-3 yr cycle into a 5-7 yr cycle. Not to mention you can not have down period when you are in your 60s and are 5 yrs removed from proclaiming a Coach in Waiting. Once you establish that you are not going to coach forever, people put you on retirement watch. That was an amazing strategic gaffe.

 

[Phantom]

Mack is a good coach.

It is asinine to judge his 30 year career (including good success at UNC) based on finishing 9-4 in 2012.

I am embarrassed to be a Texas fan when our whiny fans get so spoiled....

Good coaches have bad runs.

And frankly 8-5, 9-4, 8-5 is not even that god awful bad.

Bo never even won a national title while sucking in every bowl game.
Tom Osborne once lost 10 bowl games in a row.

Mack gave Texas one of the greatest runs of sustained success in the modern era.

I am starting to believe the Aggies.

We are in fact the single most spoiled and entitled fan base. It is embarrassing.

You make some good points. I admit that I have gotten totally emotional over Mack Brown. I'm so mad and frustrated. I admit it. With that said, I do think there is a big difference between a 12-0, 11-1, and 10-2 seasons and 9-3, 8-4, 7-5 seasons. A big big difference.

For me it's about expectations. I just think we should have and could have done much better. That's the bottom line for me. I don't think we are more spoiled or entitled than any other major college fan base.

This is just my opinion, but I think our expectations have been too low. We've put up with losing games that we shouldn't lost just about every year and only 4 BCS appearances in 16 years because Mack is such a nice guy and he turned things around in the late 90's. Just about any decent coach could have with our resources and our position of being at rock bottom at the time. Remember the two previous hires were decisions to bring back one of our own who was never proven to be ready, and a guy that should have never been a college football coach in the first place. The truth is that I was never a big Mack Brown fan. He wouldn't have been my first choice at the time. The reason is he is not a football coach. He is a public relations coach. It took him way too long that he needed to surround himself with good asst coaches. Main reason we struggled with losing games to teams we shouldn't have. A few years ago after the second lost in a row to ATM when we had way more talent both years, Dodds had a "come to Jesus" meeting with him and pretty much told him that we will go after and hire some top names in country for asst. coach positions. (Muschamp hire) The one thing about Bob Stoops is that he understood that very well. He's no genius when it comes to X's and O's either, but he knew he better hire some.

Another thing, do you really think our recruiting has been as good as we have been lead to believe? I go back and look and I don't see a lot of 5 start players. Some, but not many. Not all 5 star players turn out to be great, but if you throw enough mud on the wall, some of it is going to stick. How many qb's have we missed out on in the last few years that have gone on to be really good qb's in college. I'm struggling with Ash and McCoy being the best we can get. Go back a few years and how long did we go without a good rb? How about our offensive line a few years ago? They couldn't run block to save their lives. Talent or coaches? I have no idea, but we have missed on some big levels. I understand nothing is perfect and you are going to have some problems along the way, but it just seems to me we have had more than our share and unfortunately it falls on Mack.

Mack is hard headed and doesn't except change very well. I guess we all get that way when we get older, but the business is changing. He struggled with that. I could go on, but what's the point. He's done and I'm very thankful. The writing has been on the wall for some time. It just took us several years too long to pull the trigger. Now we are several years behind where we should be at this point.

Overall, you are right. I guess he has been a good coach. He certainly has his strengths, but he has weaknesses as well. Just like all of us.

 

[charlie42s]

It is a fact of modern College Football. You no longer can have 3-4 down yrs and survive. Recruiting game has gone national. DKR coudl have bad seasons. Bama, ND, and Oregon were not visiting Texas recruits. You have a few down yrs and now it affects recruiting and turns 2-3 yr cycle into a 5-7 yr cycle. Not to mention you can not have down period when you are in your 60s and are 5 yrs removed from proclaiming a Coach in Waiting. Once you establish that you are not going to coach forever, people put you on retirement watch. That was an amazing strategic gaffe.

DKR won 5 SWC Titles and tied for 4 others in 20 seasons, but after his first non-losing season he retired.
Fred Akers won 2 SWC Titles in 10 seasons. After his first losing season he was fired.
McWilliams won 1 SWC Title in 5 seasons. His 2nd losing got him fired.
Mackovic won 1 SWC Title, tied for another and was #2(SWC) for 2 seasons, he also won 1 B12 Title in 6 seasons. He was fired after his first losing season, but sucked going 6-5, 5-5-1, 8-4, 10-2-1, 8-5, and 4-7.

Mack isn't a great coach, but he did more to improve Texas than any HC since DKR. Competition in the Big12 may be fierce, but it's time for Mack to retire.

 

[Codaxx]

I dont think recruiting rankings are necessarily wrong. They are limited. They simply measure potential. They have been proven to be reasonably accurate, when you look at All-Americans and draft picks. Another issue is they do not measure your roster management. You could theoretically have a #1 class consisting of 4 5 star QBs, 4 5 star RBs, 4 5 star DBs, and a bunch of 2-3 star kids to round it out. 3 yrs from signing 2-3 QBs and RBs will be gone. The ones that stay will under perform, because the OL is subpar. DBs will be ridiculed, because there is no pass rush and you can not stop the run with a weak front 7. All that said, Texas has not been doing a great job developing players the past 5 yrs. Fact that Texas has had 3 different offense the last 4 yrs is not helping in that regard either.