Well, nobody expected a win. But...

[Shenanihanigans]

What a catastrophic second half (post 21-7 lead, I mean).

Definitely the worst second half of the Shannys career in D.C.

RG3, who didn't look good in the first half, looked awful in the second half.

As did the wr's, the oline, the playcalling.

ohhhhh, the playcalling!

What the FUCK was that? Seriously. SERIOUSLY.

Morris is chewing 'em up, in the first half, and in the third quarter so you decided to..... ABANDON THE RUN?!?!?!

I think it's finally time we take a look at the benefits and drawbacks to not resigning the shanahans in a year.
Clearly, you can't NOT let them have a year with unrestricted free agency - they haven't had that yet.


On the one hand, they have infused the team with a lot of talent, mostly on offense - Reed, Garcon, Morris, RG3, Helu, Paulson (keeper), Darrell Young (awesome), Hankerson (3rd wr, not a second wr).

On the other hand, their offensive line is awful, and Kyle Shanahan has as many good-great playcalling games as he has spectacularly AWFUL playcalling games.

On the one hand, the defense has started out terrible, terrible, terrible for the past three years. The fact that they eventually start to gell, and can even - seven games in - not really be faulted for a loss to the best team in the AFC, is a testament to Haslett's eventual (if not in-game) ability to coach a defense.

On the other hand, they haven't been nearly as successful at drafting defensive players that might help besides Kerrigan (robinson, always injured, crawford, injured, Brandon Jenkins, who knows, Rambo, who knows, Thomas, injured,) etc.

Honestly, I don't know what to do.

 

[skinsdad62]

What a catastrophic second half (post 21-7 lead, I mean).

Definitely the worst second half of the Shannys career in D.C.

RG3, who didn't look good in the first half, looked awful in the second half.

As did the wr's, the oline, the playcalling.

ohhhhh, the playcalling!

What the FUCK was that? Seriously. SERIOUSLY.

Morris is chewing 'em up, in the first half, and in the third quarter so you decided to..... ABANDON THE RUN?!?!?!

I think it's finally time we take a look at the benefits and drawbacks to not resigning the shanahans in a year.
Clearly, you can't NOT let them have a year with unrestricted free agency - they haven't had that yet.


On the one hand, they have infused the team with a lot of talent, mostly on offense - Reed, Garcon, Morris, RG3, Helu, Paulson (keeper), Darrell Young (awesome), Hankerson (3rd wr, not a second wr).

On the other hand, their offensive line is awful, and Kyle Shanahan has as many good-great playcalling games as he has spectacularly AWFUL playcalling games.

On the one hand, the defense has started out terrible, terrible, terrible for the past three years. The fact that they eventually start to gell, and can even - seven games in - not really be faulted for a loss to the best team in the AFC, is a testament to Haslett's eventual (if not in-game) ability to coach a defense.

On the other hand, they haven't been nearly as successful at drafting defensive players that might help besides Kerrigan (robinson, always injured, crawford, injured, Brandon Jenkins, who knows, Rambo, who knows, Thomas, injured,) etc.

Honestly, I don't know what to do.

dont let the emotions of one game overwhelm you

the facts are we probably played over our heads last season and we are getting by with sub par o/line talent and the same in the secondary

next year will be key for the shanahan's if they cant salvage this one

 

[Shenanihanigans]

dont let the emotions of one game overwhelm you

the facts are we probably played over our heads last season and we are getting by with sub par o/line talent and the same in the secondary

next year will be key for the shanahan's if they cant salvage this one

It's not the emotions of one game.

As I wrote - you have to let Shanny finish out his contract, if for no other reason than you can see what he does with lots of room in free agency, our free agents, a full offseason (hopefully) with a healthy RG3, etc.

I don't think it's an absolute that both Shanahans deserve a contract extension however. Part of that is because of games like this - where Morris is running it down their throats, and then the run is completely abandoned in the second half.

That, to me, is ridiculous.

 

[deanpet21]

I agree. One of the worst called games I have ever seen. The defense is not the problem with this team. Its the offense. Who is responsible for the offense? The Shannys. This game should of been a lot closer. not a blowout in the 4th. Its harder and harder to think that we have a 2 time winning SB coach.

 

[j_y19]

Shenanhanegins, I think the only thing snyder can do is to let the season play out. See how the team responds to the Coaching staff. It would make no sense to make any change in the staff at this point in the season primarily because some of the talent you might want to look at for coaches are unavailable at this point in the season. But at the end of the day, the question is simple. Is the team better 4 years later than when he inherited it and can the current staff make them more consistently competitive going forward.

IMO, we are a better franchise because of Shanahan, but no necessarily a better team. Now maybe we can turn this season around and be a .500 team this year (I highly doubt this), but is that acceptable after 4 years? If I were Snyder, I would have a sit down with Mike and lay it out. I would want to see a very specific play of talent acquisition for this next year and any extension he would want. By this, I mean not only how (and on who) he will spend the FA dollars we will finally have this next year, but how and when does he see the replacement of our current talent. On top of that, I would also demand an evaluation of each asst under him. Then I, along with Allen, make an evaluation if Mike has a good plan and can pull it off.

The last thing I want to see is Danny get back involved in the day to day operations, but as an owner, he has every right to understand the managerial direction of the team and an assessment of the managerial staff.

 

[deanpet21]

True, but with the NFC east so bad this year is troubling to see the Redskins struggle this much. I think you can take the play calling duties away from Kyle. That can be done right away.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Shenanhanegins, I think the only thing snyder can do is to let the season play out. See how the team responds to the Coaching staff. It would make no sense to make any change in the staff at this point in the season primarily because some of the talent you might want to look at for coaches are unavailable at this point in the season. But at the end of the day, the question is simple. Is the team better 4 years later than when he inherited it and can the current staff make them more consistently competitive going forward.

IMO, we are a better franchise because of Shanahan, but no necessarily a better team. Now maybe we can turn this season around and be a .500 team this year (I highly doubt this), but is that acceptable after 4 years? If I were Snyder, I would have a sit down with Mike and lay it out. I would want to see a very specific play of talent acquisition for this next year and any extension he would want. By this, I mean not only how (and on who) he will spend the FA dollars we will finally have this next year, but how and when does he see the replacement of our current talent. On top of that, I would also demand an evaluation of each asst under him. Then I, along with Allen, make an evaluation if Mike has a good plan and can pull it off.

The last thing I want to see is Danny get back involved in the day to day operations, but as an owner, he has every right to understand the managerial direction of the team and an assessment of the managerial staff.

As I have mentioned in some other threads - whenever they move forward I would avoid the high profile coach & go with an experienced up-and-coming assistant. I would hire a separate personnel type person so as to separate coach & GM type responsibilities (on the assumption that Allen is more of a numbers & non-personnel type guy). Carrying all of these responsibilities just doesn't appear to work well (never thought I would say that, but there is obviously something off with this team now).

Agree that Snyder needs to be kept out of most things personnel wise, and I would like to believe that he has learned his lesson in this area.

 

[JDM]

The only reason I consider keeping him around is because Snyder hasn't shown the ability to attract better.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

I agree. One of the worst called games I have ever seen. The defense is not the problem with this team. Its the offense. Who is responsible for the offense? The Shannys. This game should of been a lot closer. not a blowout in the 4th. Its harder and harder to think that we have a 2 time winning SB coach.

Not really. As someone pointed out on ES last week - a lot of SB winning coaches fail to a certain extent in their second go-around - Seifert, Ditka, Jimmy Johnson & even Gibbs II to an extent (for any number of reasons). If (let's hope not) things continue to go downhill for Shanahan - from the outside looking in - it really should not be that surprising.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

The only reason I consider keeping him around is because Snyder hasn't shown the ability to attract better.

Actually - there are other factors including trying to maintain some type of continuity within the organization (although 4 years is a fairly long time) & trying to not provide the public perception and/or the temptation for Snyder to get involved in personnel matters again.

 

[gkekoa]

We shouldn't worry about the coaching staff at this point. We are only two games back in a terrible division. Let the year play out and see what RG3 can do. As much as many would like to blame the coaches, you have to blame RG3 as well. QBs can be coach killers.

 

[deanpet21]

Agreed. Rg3 has been awful this year. But the play-callin has been bad too.

 

[JDM]

Actually - there are other factors including trying to maintain some type of continuity within the organization (although 4 years is a fairly long time) & trying to not provide the public perception and/or the temptation for Snyder to get involved in personnel matters again.

I am less positive on Shanahan as a coach than many, but continuity isn't always a good thing. When the continuity is continuous losing, you need to shake things up. The argument of keeping Snyder out of personnel decisions is a good one, but hiring a legitimate GM can do that just as effectively. Spend the big bucks on quality management instead of guys like Albert haynesworth.

 

[raptorlife4]

******ed

 

[SoCalWizFan]

I am less positive on Shanahan as a coach than many, but continuity isn't always a good thing. When the continuity is continuous losing, you need to shake things up. The argument of keeping Snyder out of personnel decisions is a good one, but hiring a legitimate GM can do that just as effectively. Spend the big bucks on quality management instead of guys like Albert haynesworth.

Spending money on areas other than players is not an issue since it is not subject to the cap. Trust me- Snyder would spend a fortune on this area if needed. Also - the Haynesworth signing is a non-issue that is part of a regime long gone - not sure why you even brought it up.

Also - the continuity is not continuing losing since the won the division last season & appeared to making major progress. That is what makes this kind of tricky. If (very likely) they encountered a mixed bag during the rest of the season (win some - lose some) then these decisions become tricky since it is almost like "one step forward - two steps back"

I am honestly at a loss which makes watching this team become increasingly more frustrating to watch. Oh well.

 

[JDM]

If spending money not on players isn't an issue, why has he had such jokes at coaching recently that Shanahan is a massive upgrade? He's average at best.

Haynesworth just happened to be one that came to mind as typical of Snyder having a say. An actual GM has to do better.

 

[skinsdad62]

If spending money not on players isn't an issue, why has he had such jokes at coaching recently that Shanahan is a massive upgrade? He's average at best.

Haynesworth just happened to be one that came to mind as typical of Snyder having a say. An actual GM has to do better.

snyder hasnt been involved with day to day team operations since he hired shanahan . stop living in the past . when free agency comes we will target young guys below age 28 and spend wisely as we have mostly in the shanahan era (yes there are exceptions )

 

[SoCalWizFan]

If spending money not on players isn't an issue, why has he had such jokes at coaching recently that Shanahan is a massive upgrade? He's average at best.

Haynesworth just happened to be one that came to mind as typical of Snyder having a say. An actual GM has to do better.

Incorrect. Most of the coaches before Shanahan were not cheap - just ineffective. He paid a ton of money for Gibbs, Spurrier, etc. Even Zorn I believe was making like $3 million/yr which - while not the highest - isn't the lowest either. It is not a question of money - Snyder has spent more than the majority of owners in many areas. The problem is that Snyder should never be involved in personnel decisions & he has not for several years.

 

[JDM]

snyder hasnt been involved with day to day team operations since he hired shanahan . stop living in the past . when free agency comes we will target young guys below age 28 and spend wisely as we have mostly in the shanahan era (yes there are exceptions )

Follow the discussion. It was about whether replacing Shanahan would result in Snyder going back to Jerry jones status.

 

[JDM]

Incorrect. Most of the coaches before Shanahan were not cheap - just ineffective. He paid a ton of money for Gibbs, Spurrier, etc. Even Zorn I believe was making like $3 million/yr which - while not the highest - isn't the lowest either. It is not a question of money - Snyder has spent more than the majority of owners in many areas. The problem is that Snyder should never be involved in personnel decisions & he has not for several years.

Then Snyder must just be massively football retarded and unable to judge any talent related to the sport, on or off the field.