Trip Down Memory Lane

[Sportster 72]

From model franchise to scandals and ineptitude: Inside the fall of Dan Snyder's NFL run in Washington

 

[kbso83432]

From model franchise to scandals and ineptitude: Inside the fall of Dan Snyder's NFL run in Washington

That's gonna be a good read when I get home

 

[Stymietee]

Apparently none of this matters, it's the players' fault!

 

[gkekoa]

Apparently none of this matters, it's the players' fault!

Individual players playing poorly is the players fault.

Management screw ups are the individual manager’s fault.

People are responsible for their own actions and inactions.

 

[Stymietee]

Individual players playing poorly is the players fault.

Management screw ups are the individual manager’s fault.

People are responsible for their own actions and inactions.

Well, they say that it's possible to learn something new every day and I thank you for a sneak peek into a world where the organization is separate from the product, and individuals are separate from the team.

This is a really interesting place and it shows...

Individual players playing poorly is the player's fault and is unaffected by poor coaching or breakdowns by other players.

Management screw-ups are the individual manager’s fault, and the resulting product isn't directly affected by the same.

People are responsible for their own actions and inactions, which is generally true but ONLY to the extent that no one else is affected by those actions and inactions. Ex: A wide receiver, breaks completely uncovered, and slips to the ground at the moment that his QB releases the ball on time and on target, the ball is intercepted and returned for a touchdown... who gets credited with that pick-six?

 

[gkekoa]

Well, they say that it's possible to learn something new every day and I thank you for a sneak peek into a world where the organization is separate from the product, and individuals are separate from the team.

This is a really interesting place and it shows...

Individual players playing poorly is the player's fault and is unaffected by poor coaching or breakdowns by other players.

Management screw-ups are the individual manager’s fault, and the resulting product isn't directly affected by the same.

People are responsible for their own actions and inactions, which is generally true but ONLY to the extent that no one else is affected by those actions and inactions. Ex: A wide receiver, breaks completely uncovered, and slips to the ground at the moment that his QB releases the ball on time and on target, the ball is intercepted and returned for a touchdown... who gets credited with that pick-six?

Again, you are misconstruing what I said.

I never said poor coaching doesn’t have an effect nor breakdowns by other players. An individual is responsible for their own actions though. By all accounts, Haskins did not put in the work required. He was outplayed by Case Keenum and a broken Alex Smith.

The resulting team product is affected by poor management. An individual’s behavior is not.

Of course the QB is credited but it isn’t anybody’s fault when they slip. That is not what happened to Dwayne Haskins.

 

[Stymietee]

Again, you are misconstruing what I said.

I never said poor coaching doesn’t have an effect nor breakdowns by other players. An individual is responsible for their own actions though. By all accounts, Haskins did not put in the work required. He was outplayed by Case Keenum and a broken Alex Smith.

The resulting team product is affected by poor management. An individual’s behavior is not.

Of course the QB is credited but it isn’t anybody’s fault when they slip. That is not what happened to Dwayne Haskins.

No, what's happening here is your ardent stance in favor of the organization/business. That said, here's what you've just written and my response to each in bold.

I never said poor coaching doesn’t have an effect nor breakdowns by other players. An individual is responsible for their own actions though. By all accounts, Haskins did not put in the work required. He was outplayed by Case Keenum and a broken Alex Smith.

Indeed you did, your point was that it was the individual without a qualifier. I suspect that you now will amend your original statement since it's clear that the game of football is one of interdependence. It's also clear that you want to use "broken down" as some sort of extra nudge without giving any credence to "rookie" ( albeit knucklehead)

The resulting team product is affected by poor management. An individual’s behavior is not.

An individual's behavior within that management system is indeed affected by it. Your example with your son is my evidence here. Did you find or not find his behavior within your parental styling acceptable? Why or why not?

Of course the QB is credited but it isn’t anybody’s fault when they slip. That is not what happened to Dwayne Haskins.

Nobody said that this is what happened to Haskins, it's a diversion and you know it. Your point about the individual wasn't Dwayne specific but a general statement about individual responsibility. Here's your posted quote... "People are responsible for their own actions and inactions." and the opening portion of my response... "People are responsible for their own actions and inactions, which is generally true but ONLY to the extent that no one else is affected by those actions and inactions."

So since the QB is credited but it isn't anyone's fault, show where there are statistics that carry some notation indicating that no one is at fault. A generic QB at the end of season finishes with 26TDs and 13 ints (yeah not the best example) which of those 13 ints aren't credited to him because they weren't anyone's fault?

 

[gkekoa]

No, what's happening here is your ardent stance in favor of the organization/business. That said, here's what you've just written and my response to each in bold.

I never said poor coaching doesn’t have an effect nor breakdowns by other players. An individual is responsible for their own actions though. By all accounts, Haskins did not put in the work required. He was outplayed by Case Keenum and a broken Alex Smith.

Indeed you did, your point was that it was the individual without a qualifier. I suspect that you now will amend your original statement since it's clear that the game of football is one of interdependence. It's also clear that you want to use "broken down" as some sort of extra nudge without giving any credence to "rookie" ( albeit knucklehead)

The resulting team product is affected by poor management. An individual’s behavior is not.

An individual's behavior within that management system is indeed affected by it. Your example with your son is my evidence here. Did you find or not find his behavior within your parental styling acceptable? Why or why not?

Of course the QB is credited but it isn’t anybody’s fault when they slip. That is not what happened to Dwayne Haskins.

Nobody said that this is what happened to Haskins, it's a diversion and you know it. Your point about the individual wasn't Dwayne specific but a general statement about individual responsibility. Here's your posted quote... "People are responsible for their own actions and inactions." and the opening portion of my response... "People are responsible for their own actions and inactions, which is generally true but ONLY to the extent that no one else is affected by those actions and inactions."

So since the QB is credited but it isn't anyone's fault, show where there are statistics that carry some notation indicating that no one is at fault. A generic QB at the end of season finishes with 26TDs and 13 ints (yeah not the best example) which of those 13 ints aren't credited to him because they weren't anyone's fault?

Nope. My support is for each individual to do their part. I am not in favor of the organization nor the player.

My point has always been every individual is responsible for their own actions and job. If the offensive design was a problem in the layer’s development, then that would be on the designer. That in turn puts some onus onto the GM who should have selected a player more suited for the offense or a designer more suited to the player.

Of course my son’s behavior was acceptable, albeit imperfect. Just because the management accepts poor behavior doesn’t behavior correct. The individual is still responsible for their behavior.

You used an example of a slipping receiver. Well, that individual play would be nobody’s fault. When you look at the general statistics of players in comparison, there is an assumption that flukiest things such as a slipping WR would be a wash. When you compare Haskins to Keenum and he is outplayed severely, that is not good. When you compare a year 2 Haskins to a broken Alex Smith (I use broken because he wasn’t the same guy after the near leg amputating injury) and Haskins is still outplayed, that isn’t good. When Haskins is cut after two seasons when being a first round pick, that is damning.

 

[skinsdad62]

the organization has been corrupt for nearly 30 yrs of snyder ownership . however there are plenty of players that have come through this organization and have reached their potential . and each one had good morals and work ethic . and that is on them .