The Walking Dead

[gkekoa]

So correct me if I am wrong, but I have been told from a few people that it will be an original cast member from S1. The only people from S1 I can think of are: Rick, Carl, Carol, Glenn, Morgan.

What if it is Carl, I mean that would totally send Rick off the deep end. Hell it might even bring Morgan back to killing again....The cast has said this was a hard one to take...can't think of anything worse than Carl getting his head smashed in....

It can't be Carl. He is far too important in the future.

I am hoping they kill Morgan...he deserves it for messing up the best character in the show, Carol.

Please don't be Darryl.

If they go away from Glenn, it may be Abraham. Maybe that is why they killed Denise instead beauce that was Abrahm's death in the comic.

 

[gkekoa]

A couple of possible theories from me...

1- Carol leaves and is taken by the saviors only to fuck them up later.

2- Abraham replaces Glenn as Lucille's victim because Denise replaced Abraham as the arrow recipient. This would also play to Negan's PC rant before picking his victim.

 

[SFGRTB]

Am I the only one who never read the comics but reads the spoilers anyway? Just curious.

I used to do that, so then I just ended up reading the comics.

 

[SFGRTB]

Spoiler

But Denise was still alive in the books when Maggie and Sophia left for the Hilltop. IIRC, she wanted a change of scenery and felt that the Hilltop was safer because of the wall. I may be off on the reasons, though. It has been a while since I read it.

Yeah in the comics it has nothing to do with her, but I'm just saying on the show, that's what will lead them there to start that storyline.

 

[SFGRTB]

I think she is afraid she is losing her humanity in a fucked up world. Gotta become a monster to beat the monsters.

I guess that's an expected reaction, but I thought we were kinda past that with Tyreese and Morgan. Plus, at this point, most survivors seem to have the "Kill or be killed " mentality so unless she goes rogue I don't think she'll find the salvation she desires.

I'm hoping they tie this into something cool down the road and not just use it like they did last time when Carol saved the day (not that that wasn't cool, but we don't need to see it again).

 

[Chef99]

I guess that's an expected reaction, but I thought we were kinda past that with Tyreese and Morgan. Plus, at this point, most survivors seem to have the "Kill or be killed " mentality so unless she goes rogue I don't think she'll find the salvation she desires.

I'm hoping they tie this into something cool down the road and not just use it like they did last time when Carol saved the day (not that that wasn't cool, but we don't need to see it again).

I just see the tie-in's already with her: she told the kid Sam about the monsters and he died; she ends up putting cookies on his grave. When she gets kidnapped, she sees herself in the kidnapper (her name escapes me at the moment) as how she will end up if she doesn't change.

The more I think about it, I agree with everyone who says she's gonna give herself up to save someone. I see a sacrifice coming.

Those damn rosary beads!

 

[beardown07]

At this point, I think it'll be ghey af if it's anyone but Glenn.



There...I said it.

 

[Chef99]

At this point, I think it'll be ghey af if it's anyone but Glenn.



There...I said it.

So if Carol jumps in front of Glenn, you ain't gonna be happy.

I blame the rosary beads.

 

[calsnowskier]

So if Carol jumps in front of Glenn, you ain't gonna be happy.

I blame the rosary beads.

The death HAS to be Negan's choice. This HAS to be a no-questions asked loss for the survivors. They have to be completely bitch-slapped here.

If they get even the tiniest sliver of a moral victory, it completely removes Negan's bad-assery.

 

[beardown07]

I honestly have no clue where the Carol arc is going. Her transition into a moral compass seemed to happen overnight? I don't remember if it ever really showed much of Carol's first departure from the clan??


Not sure how I feel about what they've done to her character. She was a Final 4 member for me for some time now...maybe not so much now? It's too bad, cuz where they WERE going with her was pretty great.

 

[chf]

I honestly have no clue where the Carol arc is going. Her transition into a moral compass seemed to happen overnight? I don't remember if it ever really showed much of Carol's first departure from the clan??


Not sure how I feel about what they've done to her character. She was a Final 4 member for me for some time now...maybe not so much now? It's too bad, cuz where they WERE going with her was pretty great.

Where is it written that she can't get back to being kick ass and take names Carol?

 

[beardown07]

Where is it written that she can't get back to being kick ass and take names Carol?

Well, at what point do we start to ask if she's Sybil en sech? I dunno...I just think this last little change of heart, after everything she's been through is just weird? I mean, there is now a number-count of death as to when your humanity disappears? Just strange to me...that's all. I'm sure they'll tie it all in en sech, but it just seemed her transformation was rather quick.

 

[calsnowskier]

Well, at what point do we start to ask if she's Sybil en sech? I dunno...I just think this last little change of heart, after everything she's been through is just weird? I mean, there is now a number-count of death as to when your humanity disappears? Just strange to me...that's all. I'm sure they'll tie it all in en sech, but it just seemed her transformation was rather quick.

I dont see her snap as so hokey at all.

Carol is BASICALLY a good person. For years, she endured the abuse of Ed so that Sophia would have a roof over her head, and so Ed would not turn his ire on her.

Once the ZA came, and she lost Ed and Sophia, she began to look out for herself and became the mother to the rest of the Survivors. She did not mother the Survivors in the same way she did for Sophia though. She realized that was a losing game. She even went so far as to declare her mourning for Sophia over, because that Carol was dead. In order to protect her new family, she had to completely disassociate from herself. She constantly put on a new face (Rambo-Carol, Suzie Homemaker Carol, Bible Thumper-Carol, etc). Losing herself that many times, and to the extremes that these personas reached caused MAJOR strain on her sanity. Add to that Morgan's philosphy, that is CLEARLY wrong for the new world, and the fact that she witnessed a glimmer of humanity that came out of his clearly-wrong philosophy (the Wolf saving Denise) and nothing makes sense to her any more. While the Bible-Thumper was just a persona she adopted to get through that crisis, it was also a final break for her. She cannot handle being a chameleon any longer.

Add to this her discussion with 'Chelle. 'Chelle and Carol are very similar people. They were both wall-flowers pre-ZA and they both became super-bad-asses in the new world. 'Chelle, however, "clocked out" at about her 10th kill. Carol was at 18 pre-kidnap (24 post) and was still trying to hold on by a thread. Seeing her other self already over the edge was the final piece that drove Carol to put her foot down and force some drastic action.

 

[chf]

Well, at what point do we start to ask if she's Sybil en sech? I dunno...I just think this last little change of heart, after everything she's been through is just weird? I mean, there is now a number-count of death as to when your humanity disappears? Just strange to me...that's all. I'm sure they'll tie it all in en sech, but it just seemed her transformation was rather quick.

I don't think it happened too quick exactly, since they've been going back and forth with her and Morgan all season.

I get where people might think it's weird that she'd reverse field, but after watching the show and reading the grahpic novels (at least the first bunch), they touch on that a LOT, that people just get ground down eventually, and react in bugfvck ways.

Rick is the Alpha male, who is everyone's rock, but basically he was committing suicide by zombie after Carl took the arrow to the eye. He only lives because he gets bailed out by others. Next day he's back to being regular Rick again.

My take on Carol's latest development was that interacting directly with the red-head leading the other group, she realized that she wasn't any 'better' or more moral than they were. She's a stone-cold killer basically.

The only way she can not be that person is to go off by herself (kinda ironically basically become Morgan early in the show).

 

[Chef99]

My take on Carol's latest development was that interacting directly with the red-head leading the other group, she realized that she wasn't any 'better' or more moral than they were. She's a stone-cold killer basically.

This is a bingo, imo. But she also realizes she is horrified at the person she has become. Hence the buh-bye.

That's my little analysis, anyway.

 

[Chef99]

Oh yeah, you said that at the end, didn't ya?

 

[OutlawImmortal]

The group is full of stone-cold killers at this point, but they are a little better than groups like the Wolves and Saviors. They don't go out looking for people to kill and rob for supplies, they only kill in self-defense or recently, to avoid having to defend themselves in the future. They're even different from the Governor, as he would kill anyone and everyone who wasn't in his community, the main group only kill people they view as threats or potential threats. Sparing Jesus is one example of this.

So I don't fully agree with the notion that Rick's group is no better than any other.

 

[chf]

they only kill in self-defense or recently, to avoid having to defend themselves in the future.

That last part allows you to justify pretty much anything. Anyone could potentially be a future threat. So pro-actively eliminate anyone you want.

 

[chf]

And sure, I don't agree that they're equivalent with other groups either. But they crossed a line when they decided to wipe out another group that they didn't know anything about, to achieve their own ends. That's when they start becoming like those other groups. Thus the internal tension in the group, and within people like Carol.

I think they cover it better in the books, but the sanity of these people would be precarious at best. In effect, they're all suffering from PTSD, and it never really lets up.

They've kinda' white-washed some of the darker elements of 'retaining your humanity' in the TV show, because, well it's a network TV show.

 

[jeffro151]

http://www.maxim.com/entertainment/walking-dead-negan-photos-2016-03
Contains a international clip for the season finale. Doesn't spoil anything that we don't already know.