My take on the impending 2018 free agency of Paul George and Demarcus Cousins

[shopson67]

He can protect the rim though, and he's beaten LeBron once in the playoffs before. He also posted the highest rebounding rate in any season of his career last year.

The one major downside is that he and Millsap rarely had big games at the same time. And if he's not being force-fed on offense, he can be a non-factor at that end of the floor at times.

I won't hide my obvious hatred for Clown Shoes Howard, but any team that invests in him is going to be disappointed. His major advantage for many years was strength and athleticism, and that seams to be leaving him. He never really improved as far as knowledge of the game or how to adjust to that fading athleticism. For a muscle-bound guy, he's awfully soft. If he doesn't get those offensive touches, he'll pout on defense as well.

 

[HurricaneDij39]

I won't hide my obvious hatred for Clown Shoes Howard, but any team that invests in him is going to be disappointed. His major advantage for many years was strength and athleticism, and that seams to be leaving him. He never really improved as far as knowledge of the game or how to adjust to that fading athleticism. For a muscle-bound guy, he's awfully soft. If he doesn't get those offensive touches, he'll pout on defense as well.

I don't disagree, but I do think he still may have some untapped potential left in Atlanta.

 

[CitySushi]

Howard was a brain dead signing. He might be the least suited center in the league to The Hawks/San Antonio motion offense. You need shooters and passers at every position, he can't do either.
I always ask if a player can be a contributor to a championship team, if he can't be, what's the fucking point ? Howard is a dead end in every way.

Well rumors are that the Hawks are on the cusp of making a deal with Travis Schlenk to be their new GM. He's the current assistant GM for the Warriors. I think Schlenk would come in and clean house, starting with Howard if they were able to move him.

 

[CitySushi]

I don't disagree, but I do think he still may have some untapped potential left in Atlanta.

I thought Howard was a fantastic signing for the Hawks and thought he would thrive there. It just hasn't been the case. The problem with Howard has and will always be that he believes his talent at this point of his career to be that of a superstar instead of a dominant defensive center. He still wants to be the guy to average 24 and 12. He's not happy with a 14 and 12 role. When he's not being fed the ball, he looks disinterested and disengaged from the offense. In a motion offense, he's going to get less touches around the basket with him just being able to go to work. In the motion offense, you have more high screens, and off ball movement, to which does not suit Howard's game at all. I thought he would be content to be that 14 and 12 guy and could thrive, but he still doesn't look like a guy who wants to accept that. For that reason, I believe his upside with Atlanta is limited at best.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Well rumors are that the Hawks are on the cusp of making a deal with Travis Schlenk to be their new GM. He's the current assistant GM for the Warriors. I think Schlenk would come in and clean house, starting with Howard if they were able to move him.

ya think?

arent the Warriors the same front office that amnestied charlie bell to open up max room for DeAndre Jordan?

 

[CitySushi]

ya think?

arent the Warriors the same front office that amnestied charlie bell to open up max room for DeAndre Jordan?

Yup. That happened in 2011.

Since then, that same front office has drafted Klay Thompson, Draymond Green, Harrison Barnes and traded for Andrew Bogut, Andre Iguodala, and signed Kevin Durant, Marresse Speights, Shaun Livingston, David West, Carl Landry, Jarrett Jack. Found Kent Bazemore and Ian Clark in the d-league. They also hired Mark Jackson who turned the team around with no experience as a HC and then brought on Steve Kerr who had no HC experience to lead the team to a championship and has been in the NBA finals for 3 straight years. The same front office that is universally considered in the top 3 of the NBA right now.

But good call, probably a horrible move for the Hawks if true. The Warriors front office is obviously run by incompetent people.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Yup. That happened in 2011.

Since then, that same front office has drafted Klay Thompson, Draymond Green, Harrison Barnes and traded for Andrew Bogut, Andre Iguodala, and signed Kevin Durant, Marresse Speights, Shaun Livingston, David West, Carl Landry, Jarrett Jack. Found Kent Bazemore and Ian Clark in the d-league. They also hired Mark Jackson who turned the team around with no experience as a HC and then brought on Steve Kerr who had no HC experience to lead the team to a championship and has been in the NBA finals for 3 straight years. The same front office that is universally considered in the top 3 of the NBA right now.

But good call, probably a horrible move for the Hawks if true. The Warriors front office is obviously run by incompetent people.

didnt the Warriors try and get Dwight too?

 

[HurricaneDij39]

I thought Howard was a fantastic signing for the Hawks and thought he would thrive there. It just hasn't been the case. The problem with Howard has and will always be that he believes his talent at this point of his career to be that of a superstar instead of a dominant defensive center. He still wants to be the guy to average 24 and 12. He's not happy with a 14 and 12 role. When he's not being fed the ball, he looks disinterested and disengaged from the offense. In a motion offense, he's going to get less touches around the basket with him just being able to go to work. In the motion offense, you have more high screens, and off ball movement, to which does not suit Howard's game at all. I thought he would be content to be that 14 and 12 guy and could thrive, but he still doesn't look like a guy who wants to accept that. For that reason, I believe his upside with Atlanta is limited at best.

Well if Millsap leaves for greener pastures and Schroder is given the keys to the franchise, Howard will have the post to himself once again. Schroder and Howard have a good rap with one another and if this happens, averages of 16 and 13 isn't out of the question for next season.

Atlanta should probably pony up their funds to keep the younger Hardaway as opposed to Millsap, it will create new vibes the city hadn't seen even though they'll probably never win the championship.

 

[CitySushi]

didnt the Warriors try and get Dwight too?

Yup they did. Lucked out that he passed on them. The Warriors at the time were not very good. They were trying to just get into conversations to get free agents like Dwight Howard to even consider them. They weren't in a position of power that they are in now.

Each team has hits and misses. Not sure what you're really getting at. Are you trying to imply the Warriors front office isn't any good?

 

[CitySushi]

Well if Millsap leaves for greener pastures and Schroder is given the keys to the franchise, Howard will have the post to himself once again. Schroder and Howard have a good rap with one another and if this happens, averages of 16 and 13 isn't out of the question for next season.

Atlanta should probably pony up their funds to keep the younger Hardaway as opposed to Millsap, it will create new vibes the city hadn't seen even though they'll probably never win the championship.

Millsap doesn't generally dominate the paint area anyways, so I don't think it would be a huge shift. The only way Howard's role increases is if there is a fundamental shift in philosophy on the offense. I don't see a Pop disciple just going away from his roots and changing his vision of the team just to suit Howard getting a few more touches a game.

 

[HurricaneDij39]

Player Review 2017: Paul George | Indiana Pacers

 

[HurricaneDij39]

Millsap doesn't generally dominate the paint area anyways, so I don't think it would be a huge shift. The only way Howard's role increases is if there is a fundamental shift in philosophy on the offense. I don't see a Pop disciple just going away from his roots and changing his vision of the team just to suit Howard getting a few more touches a game.

Well he definitely seemed to have a problem playing Millsap and Howard at the same time against the run-and-gone, jack-it-up Wizards, a move in my opinion that backfired. Shouldn't be an issue next year if Millsap leaves.

 

[BallsOfFurry]

He can protect the rim though, and he's beaten LeBron once in the playoffs before. He also posted the highest rebounding rate in any season of his career last year.

The one major downside is that he and Millsap rarely had big games at the same time. And if he's not being force-fed on offense, he can be a non-factor at that end of the floor at times.

He is terrible for the motion offense. It's not about rebound rate or blocks anymore. If a player can't integrate into the flow of an offense, he's a net negative. You can't force feed a player in a motion offense, the ball has to go to the open spot. When The Hawks won 37 straight, or whatever it was 2 years ago it was 100% moving the ball through all 5 players till the best shot came open.

 

[BallsOfFurry]

Well he definitely seemed to have a problem playing Millsap and Howard at the same time against the run-and-gone, jack-it-up Wizards, a move in my opinion that backfired. Shouldn't be an issue next year if Millsap leaves.

If Millsap leaves and The team becomes Howard's, it will lose big time.

 

[BallsOfFurry]

Well if Millsap leaves for greener pastures and Schroder is given the keys to the franchise, Howard will have the post to himself once again. Schroder and Howard have a good rap with one another and if this happens, averages of 16 and 13 isn't out of the question for next season.

Atlanta should probably pony up their funds to keep the younger Hardaway as opposed to Millsap, it will create new vibes the city hadn't seen even though they'll probably never win the championship.

Schroder and Howard damn near fought during a game in March because Howard wouldn't try to play within the offense.
Basketball is a lot more than one player getting stats. Howard is a damn offense killer, he is poison.

 

[BallsOfFurry]

I thought Howard was a fantastic signing for the Hawks and thought he would thrive there. It just hasn't been the case. The problem with Howard has and will always be that he believes his talent at this point of his career to be that of a superstar instead of a dominant defensive center. He still wants to be the guy to average 24 and 12. He's not happy with a 14 and 12 role. When he's not being fed the ball, he looks disinterested and disengaged from the offense. In a motion offense, he's going to get less touches around the basket with him just being able to go to work. In the motion offense, you have more high screens, and off ball movement, to which does not suit Howard's game at all. I thought he would be content to be that 14 and 12 guy and could thrive, but he still doesn't look like a guy who wants to accept that. For that reason, I believe his upside with Atlanta is limited at best.

I thought at the time Howard was signed management had lost it's fucking collective mind.

 

[BallsOfFurry]

Well rumors are that the Hawks are on the cusp of making a deal with Travis Schlenk to be their new GM. He's the current assistant GM for the Warriors. I think Schlenk would come in and clean house, starting with Howard if they were able to move him.

The Hawks are Howard's 3rd straight failure. They'll have to eat the bulk of the 2 years left on his contract if they have any shot at unloading him.

 

[tlance]

#2 and Randle is just too much. #28 and Randle is more acceptable if they're willing to take Deng or Mosgov as part of the deal too, to make the salaries match.

I really hope you are joking.

Randle, pick 28 and a bad contract for George?

Randle is the price to get rid of Mozgov. The contract is that bad. Randle +2 is a fair price for George. Not one I would want to pay, but they are not getting him for much less.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

I really hope you are joking.

Randle, pick 28 and a bad contract for George?

Randle is the price to get rid of Mozgov. The contract is that bad. Randle +2 is a fair price for George. Not one I would want to pay, but they are not getting him for much less.

Yes they are. They're getting him for free in 12 months time. So why offer more?

 

[tlance]

Yes they are. They're getting him for free in 12 months time. So why offer more?

I agree with what you are saying, but the Pacers are not trading him for less.