Milliner is is rough shape

[VulturesRule]

Hard to find anybody that's played sports at the high end college level that hasn't had some medical proceedure or other along the way. Milliner's various surgeries don't seem to be as concerning as Hayden's major surgery. At the five position, I do hope the Lions don't feel a need to gamble with potential as much as achieve predictable value.

 

[tpaulus_2]

2013 NFL draft -- Dee Milliner has had five surgeries - ESPN

Milliner's surgeries include a right knee scope, sports hernia, right tibia stress fracture and both shoulders.

His most recent shoulder surgery, performed in March, will sideline him during the organized team activities of whichever team drafts him.
Milliner is not expected to be ready until training camp at the earliest.


I have been pulling for Milliner, but I am officially off that band wagon now.

That's too bad, because you completely fell for the pre-draft smear campaign. This stuff is not new info to teams, and he only missed one game because of any of this during his college career.

A knee scope and sports hernia are nothing- outpatient surgery, barely a blip on a team's radar. Stress fractures really aren't a big deal either, they heal to 100% without any lingering damage. The shoulders are a bit more serious, but not career-threatening.

So really it's 5 surgeries, but no serious ones. No knees, no concussions, no neck/spine injuries.

This stuff won't affect his draft stock at all, not even a little bit.

 

[tpaulus_2]

I think a lot of this is draft gamesmanship. Any negative news that comes out at this point on a prospect is likely due to someone wanting him without trading up for him.

Exactly. Just pre-draft smoke screens. I don't see him sliding out of the top ten tomorrow...

[/QUOTE] That said, I don't see the Lions spending a 1st or 2nd on a CB. I'm still thinking Fisher (Joeckel) or trade down. If forced to pick and Fisher is gone, I'd go with Ansah for his flexibility.[/QUOTE]
If Fisher and Joeckel are both gone we're likely to go either Ansah, Milliner or or Johnson, if we can't trade down.

A wise man I know from down south thinks we should trade with the Cardinals for their 3rd round pick, then trade way back with the Falcons for their 2nd and 3rd rounders this year and 1st next year.

Idk about you guys, but I'd move back to pick #30 if it meant an extra 2nd rounder and two 3rd rounders this year, plus a late 1st rounder next year...


As per the Lions not spending a 1st or 2nd rounder on a CB, I wouldn't bet much on that one. We're in a prime spot at the top of the 2nd round to snag a starting DE or CB that falls out of the 1st round. Lots of talent CBs that might still be there for the taking. If D.J. Hayden falls that far you can book it now that he'll be a Lion Friday night...

 

[tpaulus_2]

The only "they" I've read about is Mayock. I think he's usually spot on with assessments, but haven't seem anyone else say Hayden is the top rated CB

Agreed.

Obviously Hayden is moving way up the boards, but I don't think he passes Milliner. Maybe he's right there with Rhodes and Trufant, though.

He's got speed, quickness, good change of direction skills and fluid hips. He's also comfortable in a man-press or zone, which is nice, and reportedly is active and willing in run support. The only thing not to love is his size, at 5'10", but that's not a deal-breaker for a good CB. 6'0" is better, but we can't go making that a rule and passing on guys who are under that height. I think Chris Houston is 5'11" and he does just fine.

I really hope Hayden falls to pick #36 Friday. I don't see it happening, but he'd give us an instant-impact starter across from Houston, and allow last year's rookies to keep developing without having to count on them to fill a starting role just yet, with the exception of Bill Bentley, who would likely be our starting nickel back.

It would actually be a little ironic, in that scenario, that all three of our starters would be under 6'0" tall, what with the recent emphasis on bigger CBs, but it's also worth nothing that all three of our back-ups would be 6'0" +...

 

[themuzzer]

As per the Lions not spending a 1st or 2nd rounder on a CB, I wouldn't bet much on that one. We're in a prime spot at the top of the 2nd round to snag a starting DE or CB that falls out of the 1st round. Lots of talent CBs that might still be there for the taking. If D.J. Hayden falls that far you can book it now that he'll be a Lion Friday night...[/QUOTE]

Now TP you don't know that.....Make sure you include "IMO" otherwise your stating it as fact.

 

[tpaulus_2]

No, but those listed aren't exactly major surgeries and the timing of their revelation is suspect.

Agreed.

I listed them out above, and I did say no knee issues, but obviously there was the scope. So, technically, he did have knee surgery, but a scope is about as routine as it gets- just cleaning up some loose cartilage to knock down inflammation.

I got my left knee scoped during basketball season of my junior year of HS, and I only missed two games. Basically just had to let the incision (which is tiny) heal and the swelling go down and I was ready to play.

So yes, he had 5 surgeries, but none have any lasting consequences or cumulative effect. The shoulders, maybe, with the associated cartilage damage, but that's pretty minimal stuff for a CB. He could have went without the surgery for that had he wanted to, but getting it cleaned up gives him a full range of motion, which is essential for a CB...

 

[tpaulus_2]

Now TP you don't know that.....Make sure you include "IMO" otherwise your stating it as fact.[/QUOTE]

I do, in fact, know that.

I didn't say "we will take a CB or DE with pick 36", I simply pointed out the obvious that we will be in prime position to scoop up one of the projected late 1st/early 2nd round DEs or CBs. Where they stack up on the boards meshes perfectly with our 2nd round pick.

Maybe we take a WR or TE or safety, who knows. All I was stating is that I wouldn't say, as someone else did, that we won't draft a CB in the 1st or 2nd. Between Miliner in the 1st and Slay/Hayden/Taylor/Banks/Alford in the 2nd I think there's a good chance we could wind up with one...

 

[black_magic]

At the end of the day, i'd take a Milliner, who's had 5 surgeries, over a healthy Lane Johnson at 5. God, i know i put too much faith in mock drafts, but almost all mock drafts have us taking Lane Johnson now. Id rather have Ziggy, Dion Jordan, Cooper, and Warmack over Johnson.

 

[tpaulus_2]

Hayden is a guy that is off alot of teams draft boards. He suffered an injury that 95% of the people die from and it happened after taking a hit. I don't know how many GM's are going to be on board with drafting this guy.

I think he will be around into the 3rd round before someone takes a chance on him, unless doctor's give him a 100% clean bill of healthy. He is a great talent though.

He's already gotten a 100% clean bill of health. I doubt he's off of anyone's board because of that injury. It's not something that's any more likely to re-occur now because of the initial injury.

Pretty much a freak, one-in-a-million, thing on the field. It'd be like removing a player from your board because he got hit by lightning: it happened, he almost died but is fine now, and the odds of it happening again are astronomical...

 

[tpaulus_2]

If D.J. Hayden falls that far you can book it now that he'll be a Lion Friday night...

Now TP you don't know that.....Make sure you include "IMO" otherwise your stating it as fact.[/QUOTE]

Although that sentence needs an "imo" at the end for sure... That's totally conjecture on my part. I'll put my name on that statement, though, because I don't see him slipping past us at #36. Who really knows though, right?

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

He's already gotten a 100% clean bill of health. I doubt he's off of anyone's board because of that injury. It's not something that's any more likely to re-occur now because of the initial injury.

Pretty much a freak, one-in-a-million, thing on the field. It'd be like removing a player from your board because he got hit by lightning: it happened, he almost died but is fine now, and the odds of it happening again are astronomical...

they don't have anything to look back on for this type of injury, as it was more a freak accident, and 95% of people who suffer that injury die. so they really won't know until he plays. i also read -- no doctor is willing to go on record and say there isn't a risk of it happening again, as his case is so unique.

IMO, and i could definitely be wrong, but that could scare away quite a few teams from drafting him, along with the fact he still can't participate in any type of drills or practice as he is still healing.

the upside is -- it is the only time he has ever been injured in his career, but wow, that is a doozy.

 

[tpaulus_2]

I guess they don't have any other athletes to compare it to, but veins regenerate damaged tissue, unlike a soft tissue (tendons, ligaments and cartilage) injury, so the theory is that it should heal 100%. The repaired spot in the vein shouldn't be a weak spot at all...