Heat vs Pacers ECF

[BOTSLAYER]

Also, as great a player as KD is, he is not quite at the Lebron, Kobe, etc. level, so he doesn't get the criticism that they do.

If this is the case then Lebron is miles ahead of his current competition.

Lebron has his team intact, is the reigning MVP and the Heat are the reigning champs!!

his championship team is not in tact, it is better, and they are failing. #over dramtic?.

I may dislike Kobe as a player but one thing that dude does not do is choke. If anything he is over confident.

how do we define choking? is it failure to produce or failure to rise to the occasion? If the prior then Kobe chokes a shit ton, if the latter then Kobe is clutch like whoa.


Do we base clutch on results or heart? Is clutch not the opposite of choke? It seems that our definition of choke and clutch differ greatly depending on results?

 

[trojanfan12]

how do we define choking? is it failure to produce or failure to rise to the occasion? If the prior then Kobe chokes a shit ton, if the latter then Kobe is clutch like whoa.


Do we base clutch on results or heart? Is clutch not the opposite of choke? It seems that our definition of choke and clutch differ greatly depending on results?

In my opinion, if the player fails in a clutch moments then they choked. It's not necessarily a bad thing because at least they were willing to step up and take that responsibility.

I think that being clutch is about having the heart/courage to step up with the game on the line, knowing that it's up to them and if they fail the team loses. Many players want no part of that, the great one's live for it.

Earlier in Lebron's career, a legit argument could be made that he did not have that kind of heart. I think he put that one to bed, at least for me, last season.

 

[wildturkey]

This is a stupid debate. Let's clear things up. What Lebron did was not choking. It was two deflected turnovers by Indy playing good defense. Want an example of choking? Go back and watch Lance Stephenson do his best to derp the game away for Indy in the 4th quarter. THAT is a player choking; someone taking charge of the moment but throwing up all over themselves in embarrassing fashion.

 

[shitsho]

how do we define choking? is it failure to produce or failure to rise to the occasion? If the prior then Kobe chokes a shit ton, if the latter then Kobe is clutch like whoa.


Do we base clutch on results or heart? Is clutch not the opposite of choke? It seems that our definition of choke and clutch differ greatly depending on results?

As I have always said choking is defined IMO by making bad plays based on fear. Just because you are not afraid doesn't make you clutch. Hitting the shot in the big moment is clutch. Only results can define being clutch.

 

[bone3421]

man the pacers are one defensive lapse away from being up 2-0

heat better figure something out or all the lechoke jokes will be back in full force

 

[bksballer89]

man the pacers are one defensive lapse away from being up 2-0

heat better figure something out or all the lechoke jokes will be back in full force

Both teams could easily be up 2-0.

There's nothing to figure out for Miami as it is all about playing better. If Miami plays a little better perimeter defense and their role players step up they can easily win both games in Indy. To be quite honest with you Miami played like shit in both games offensively and played like shit tonight defensively....Indiana on the other hand, they can't play much better offensively than they did tonight.

Chalmers had a wide open 3 with the game tied at 91....If he hits that shot Miami probably win tonight and go up 2-0.

 

[PPhan]

man the pacers are one defensive lapse away from being up 2-0

These types of posts are kinda stupid. Had the Pacers won game 1, Miami would be playing a little more desperately. They would treat this game as their last.

 

[PPhan]

Fear is really the only factor in a choke. You can call it by any name you wish. The base factor is fear.

Well put. A player missing the last shot of a game is not a choke. A player turning the ball over in the last seconds of the game is not a choke either, as long as them hesitating and sweating isn't the cause of the TO.

All that means is the player wasn't very clutch.

 

[bone3421]

These types of posts are kinda stupid. Had the Pacers won game 1, Miami would be playing a little more desperately. They would treat this game as their last.

maybe,why wouldnt they play just as hard to go up 2-0......but i havent followed basketball much this year and the point i was making was referring to their clutch convo.....if lebron loses all the jokes will start up again and the pacers seem like they could pull the upset pretty easily after the what i have seen from the bits i watched

thats all i was saying......dont care for any of the four teams left and havent sat down and watched a whole game

 

[BOTSLAYER]

There's nothing to figure out for Miami as it is all about playing better.

Exactly but my problem is when is the last time we saw them play well? Nobody is in a rhythm, maybe they need this to go 6 so they can stay in a rhythm.

Get rid of LBJ and CB and the Heat shot 2 of 10 from 3 point land.


I also want to credit the Pacers, clearly they are playing well and doing great things because the Heat can't hit shit. It does seem like the Heat decide they have to beat every team at that teams game. Bucks, no game. Bulls, street fighting. Pacers, inside inside inside, keep games close and miss every 3.

 

[trojanfan12]

Both teams could easily be up 2-0.

There's nothing to figure out for Miami as it is all about playing better. If Miami plays a little better perimeter defense and their role players step up they can easily win both games in Indy. To be quite honest with you Miami played like shit in both games offensively and played like shit tonight defensively....Indiana on the other hand, they can't play much better offensively than they did tonight.

Chalmers had a wide open 3 with the game tied at 91....If he hits that shot Miami probably win tonight and go up 2-0.

So, in your mind it's strictly about Miami and you give no credit to the Pacers? It may not be as simple as "Miami just needs to play better". It could very well be that the Pacers are simply a bad matchup for the Heat and that it's no accident that they beat Miami 2 out of 3 in the regular season.

 

[trojanfan12]

Exactly but my problem is when is the last time we saw them play well? Nobody is in a rhythm, maybe they need this to go 6 so they can stay in a rhythm.

Get rid of LBJ and CB and the Heat shot 2 of 10 from 3 point land.


I also want to credit the Pacers, clearly they are playing well and doing great things because the Heat can't hit shit. It does seem like the Heat decide they have to beat every team at that teams game. Bucks, no game. Bulls, street fighting. Pacers, inside inside inside, keep games close and miss every 3.

The Heat seem to have no answer for the size that the Pacers have. Particularly Hibbert.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

So, in your mind it's strictly about Miami and you give no credit to the Pacers? It may not be as simple as "Miami just needs to play better". It could very well be that the Pacers are simply a bad matchup for the Heat and that it's no accident that they beat Miami 2 out of 3 in the regular season.

Give the Pacers all the credit in the world. They have played hard on every posession, all 48 minutes of the games (or 53 if you add OT).
The Heat are the more talented team, but they tend to piss around the first 5-6 minutes of the game 'feeling' out the other team. Wating posessions forcing the ball to Wade and UD (who should be playing only mop up minutes).

The Heat also tend to settle for alot of 3's early in posessions vs atttacking once the have tied up these games or taken small leads.

The Heat won't lose 3 games in Indy, so if the Pacers want to win the series, they will have to win another game here somewhere along the way.

Either way, it has been some good, fun basketball so far. As a Heat fan, the blowouts against shit teams are easier to watch, but I would still rather have it this way. Two good teams going at it where every posession matters and then watching which team can fnd a way to in the game.

 

[trojanfan12]

Give the Pacers all the credit in the world. They have played hard on every posession, all 48 minutes of the games (or 53 if you add OT).
The Heat are the more talented team, but they tend to piss around the first 5-6 minutes of the game 'feeling' out the other team. Wating posessions forcing the ball to Wade and UD (who should be playing only mop up minutes).

The Heat also tend to settle for alot of 3's early in posessions vs atttacking once the have tied up these games or taken small leads.

The Heat won't lose 3 games in Indy, so if the Pacers want to win the series, they will have to win another game here somewhere along the way.

Either way, it has been some good, fun basketball so far. As a Heat fan, the blowouts against shit teams are easier to watch, but I would still rather have it this way. Two good teams going at it where every posession matters and then watching which team can fnd a way to in the game.

I agree 100%!! The Heat are definitely the more talented team, but there is the possibility that because of the matchups, they are not the better team.

In 2011, the Mavericks beat the defending champion Lakers in the playoffs and then beat Miami for the title. Both of those teams were more talented than the Mavs, but the Mavs were a bad matchup for both teams and was able to beat them.

Same thing when the Pistons beat the 2004 Lakers and their 4 hall of famers. The Lakers were more talented, but the Pistons were better.

Btw, why the hell is Mike Miller still on the Heat? He came in for like 3 minutes yesterday, hit the only 3 he took, but then looked like he could barely walk when he was headed back to the bench. Not criticizing him, because I like that he got out there, but he just looked like he was in a lot of pain.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Miller IMO should be playing more. Especially when Allen and moreso Battier have been off. As far as the Miller basket, that corner is my blindspot so all I really saw was the ball go in the basket, but I assume maybe he was hit on the play? He has been healthy for awhile now. If nobody touched him, I have no clue.

 

[trojanfan12]

Miller IMO should be playing more. Especially when Allen and moreso Battier have been off. As far as the Miller basket, that corner is my blindspot so all I really saw was the ball go in the basket, but I assume maybe he was hit on the play? He has been healthy for awhile now. If nobody touched him, I have no clue.

Yeah, I just found it odd that he hasn't been playing, especially when he played so well last year even though he was pretty banged up.

Then when I saw him walking back to the bench, it looked like his back was really hurting him by the way he was walking!! But I agree, if he's good to go, he's a weapon the Heat could use!!

Maybe he was doing like they used to say about Magic: Walking on and off the court he looked like he couldn't take another step, then he gets in the game and plays great!!

 

[lakersrule]

I agree 100%!! The Heat are definitely the more talented team, but there is the possibility that because of the matchups, they are not the better team.

In 2011, the Mavericks beat the defending champion Lakers in the playoffs and then beat Miami for the title. Both of those teams were more talented than the Mavs, but the Mavs were a bad matchup for both teams and was able to beat them.

Same thing when the Pistons beat the 2004 Lakers and their 4 hall of famers. The Lakers were more talented, but the Pistons were better.

Btw, why the hell is Mike Miller still on the Heat? He came in for like 3 minutes yesterday, hit the only 3 he took, but then looked like he could barely walk when he was headed back to the bench. Not criticizing him, because I like that he got out there, but he just looked like he was in a lot of pain.

The Heat may be the better team, but match ups mean a lot in the NBA. Indy simply matches up well with Miami. Interior size gives Miami trouble. Indy has interior size that can score.

 

[lakersrule]

I wouldn't be so confident that Miami can take a game in Indy. Indy hasn't lost at home yet these playoffs. They beat Miami in both regular season games at Indy. Role players generally play better at home. I gotta think Stephenson shoots better at home.

Great first two games. Should be more to come.

 

[BOTSLAYER]

The Heat seem to have no answer for the size that the Pacers have. Particularly Hibbert.

they have one, they just haven't used it much. Lebron at the 5.

Miller IMO should be playing more. Especially when Allen and moreso Battier have been off. As far as the Miller basket, that corner is my blindspot so all I really saw was the ball go in the basket, but I assume maybe he was hit on the play? He has been healthy for awhile now. If nobody touched him, I have no clue.

was not touched, he is very broken right now, which if you think about it is kind of impressive as he has hardly played this season.

I wouldn't be so confident that Miami can take a game in Indy. Indy hasn't lost at home yet these playoffs. They beat Miami in both regular season games at Indy. Role players generally play better at home. I gotta think Stephenson shoots better at home.

Great first two games. Should be more to come.

Role players do, but Miami doesn't seem to start fighting until they have been punched. Let's hope losing one was their punch.

 

[trojanfan12]

they have one, they just haven't used it much. Lebron at the 5.

I don't think I'd want to use that unless/until it's a game where Miami could be eliminated. Lebron is an athletic freak, no doubt. He could definitely play the 5 in short stints, but I think that if they tried it too much, it would wear him down and make less effective on offense!! Especially considering how physical the Pacers bigs are!!