A ridiculous trade idea that actually makes sense...

[SFGRTB]

Just to 1-up the Phillies...

First, trade Zito to the desperate Yankees, eating some of his salary for whatever you can get. Yankees really need pitching, they only have 2 reliable starters in Sabathia and Hughes. Burnett is just crap and then they have 2 un-proven guys. With the Red Sox lineup being quite left-handed, Zito would make sense for them.


Then trade for Matt Garza. He has been made available from the Rays who are looking for bullpen help/depth, catching prospects and 1B.

Lincecum vs. Halladay
Cain vs. Lee
Bumgarner vs. Oswalt
Garza vs. Hamels
Sanchez vs. Blanton

LOL, pitching rich. Sounds crazy, but at the right price it could be done, and I don't think it will cost Belt.

 

[tzill]

I'd rather go with Runzler as the #5 until Wheeler is ready. If we could unload Zeet's contract, I'd be ecstatic.

 

[Yoshi]

Looks as if Blanton is being shopped around by the Phils:

Joe Blanton Could Be Traded by Phillies; Brewers Among Possible Suitors -- MLB FanHouse

 

[CameronFrye]

Just to 1-up the Phillies...

First, trade Zito to the desperate Yankees, eating some of his salary for whatever you can get. Yankees really need pitching, they only have 2 reliable starters in Sabathia and Hughes. Burnett is just crap and then they have 2 un-proven guys. With the Red Sox lineup being quite left-handed, Zito would make sense for them.

I know the Spanks have more money than god, but I just cannot rationalize the logic of why the Spanks management would agree to acquire Zito's salary. Hank Steinbrenner is not like his old man. He's not going to spend just because he can.

Unless New York is completely fed up with Burnett and wants to trade him so bad that it would consider eating a larger salary in Zito's, I just cannot see this happening.

Even then, the Giants would only be saving a few million per season.

I know I am not alone in saying that I would LOVE to find someone to take Zito and most (even half) of his salary. But unless the Giants take back a huge burden themselves or pay a large portion of the remaining dollars, I just don't see it happening.

 

[SFGRTB]

I know the Spanks have more money than god, but I just cannot rationalize the logic of why the Spanks management would agree to acquire Zito's salary. Hank Steinbrenner is not like his old man. He's not going to spend just because he can.

Unless New York is completely fed up with Burnett and wants to trade him so bad that it would consider eating a larger salary in Zito's, I just cannot see this happening.

Even then, the Giants would only be saving a few million per season.

I know I am not alone in saying that I would LOVE to find someone to take Zito and most (even half) of his salary. But unless the Giants take back a huge burden themselves or pay a large portion of the remaining dollars, I just don't see it happening.

Don't worry, I'm not holding my breath. I've pretty much accepted the fact that we have Zeets and his contract and there isn't anything we can do about it. I look at it this way, we are paying Zito the money that we should be paying the other 4 guys, so it evens out IMO.

 

[SF11704]

IMHO I feel that the Zitoish type contract is actually becoming much more prevalent in MLB today. All of the high profile picthers are looking for long term deals at a very high rate of return. Zito, Sabathia, Lee, Halladay etc. Not unusual to see 5-7 years at 100M-160M. Zito just didn't work out. I personally think he was regressing when we entered the deal. In the next 5 years I think we're going to see many teams saddled with very high contracts for pitchers that are declining. Lee is 31. What will he be like at 35? 36?

Teams are being forced into these positions. If Timmeh (and maybe Cain) was willing to take 140M over the next 7 years I'm guessing we would see a long term contract offered. But as good as they both are it still represents somewhat of a gamble. That's a lot of money to tie up for an extended period of time. I think a handful of these types of contracts will work out well for the teams but most will turn into a financial burden that they will not be able to pass along to someone else.

 

[tzill]

IMHO I feel that the Zitoish type contract is actually becoming much more prevalent in MLB today. All of the high profile picthers are looking for long term deals at a very high rate of return. Zito, Sabathia, Lee, Halladay etc. Not unusual to see 5-7 years at 100M-160M. Zito just didn't work out. I personally think he was regressing when we entered the deal. In the next 5 years I think we're going to see many teams saddled with very high contracts for pitchers that are declining. Lee is 31. What will he be like at 35? 36?

Teams are being forced into these positions. If Timmeh (and maybe Cain) was willing to take 140M over the next 7 years I'm guessing we would see a long term contract offered. But as good as they both are it still represents somewhat of a gamble. That's a lot of money to tie up for an extended period of time. I think a handful of these types of contracts will work out well for the teams but most will turn into a financial burden that they will not be able to pass along to someone else.

That is the 800 pound guerilla -- what about Cain in 2013? His contract is going to tell us a lot about what we can expect re: Timmy, Chez, Bum. I don't think it's coincidence that Gamer comes off the books in 2013 and Zeets in 2014 (buyout notwithstanding) when Cain and Timmy respectively become FA.

 

[SF11704]

That is the 800 pound guerilla -- what about Cain in 2013? His contract is going to tell us a lot about what we can expect re: Timmy, Chez, Bum. I don't think it's coincidence that Gamer comes off the books in 2013 and Zeets in 2014 (buyout notwithstanding) when Cain and Timmy respectively become FA.

Spot on! I agree that Cain will be the fiirst of our pitchers to test these waters. It will be interesting for a number of reasons. As you said it sets the expectations for the rest of the starting rotation. It also raises some interesting financial questions. Is management willing to spend 40-50M per year to retain their top two starters? If so what will their annual budget really be? Will they be willing to push it to 135M-150M? At 150M they will still be spending a 1/3 of their budget on two pitchers. This almost reminds me of when they were spending almost 40% budget on Schmidt and Bonds. That's when they kept bringing in rethreads hoping they could catch lightening in a bottle with a limited investment.

 

[CameronFrye]

The thing about Cain that makes him different is that he has not won any major awards - no Cy Young award, no post-season award, no ERA title, no strikeout title, and only one All-Star appearance to his name.

Don't get me wrong, I am not selling Cain short here. I truly love him as a pitcher. But when it comes time for contract negotiations, he is really not going to be in a position to demand $140 mil over 7 years like Sabathia or Lee or even Lincecum because he does not have the peripherals to back up that kind of monetary demand.

Unless Cain explodes this year or next, he will likely get less than $100 mil, He might get the contract length he wants because dude is ultra durable - he doesn't miss starts. But to garner the kind of green he wants, he has to be a legitimate staff ace. Right now, he's one of the best #2 pitchers in the game, but is not an ace.

 

[calsnowskier]

The thing about Cain that makes him different is that he has not won any major awards - no Cy Young award, no post-season award, no ERA title, no strikeout title, and only one All-Star appearance to his name.

Don't get me wrong, I am not selling Cain short here. I truly love him as a pitcher. But when it comes time for contract negotiations, he is really not going to be in a position to demand $140 mil over 7 years like Sabathia or Lee or even Lincecum because he does not have the peripherals to back up that kind of monetary demand.

Unless Cain explodes this year or next, he will likely get less than $100 mil, He might get the contract length he wants because dude is ultra durable - he doesn't miss starts. But to garner the kind of green he wants, he has to be a legitimate staff ace. Right now, he's one of the best #2 pitchers in the game, but is not an ace.

Good points.

In order to vault yourself to the elite contract tier in MLB, you have to have marketability (i.e. hardware). Cain is a stud, but he has no hardware.

I would disagree with you on one point, however. I believe he is the BEST #2 in the game. I would take him over Lee every day of the week, twice in twilight games. Lee is a legit elite tier pitcher, though, because he has the hardware (CY).

Edit:
(ooooh Post #666. scary)

 

[TidrowThePitchingMaster]

The thing about Cain that makes him different is that he has not won any major awards - no Cy Young award, no post-season award, no ERA title, no strikeout title, and only one All-Star appearance to his name.

Don't get me wrong, I am not selling Cain short here. I truly love him as a pitcher. But when it comes time for contract negotiations, he is really not going to be in a position to demand $140 mil over 7 years like Sabathia or Lee or even Lincecum because he does not have the peripherals to back up that kind of monetary demand.

Unless Cain explodes this year or next, he will likely get less than $100 mil, He might get the contract length he wants because dude is ultra durable - he doesn't miss starts. But to garner the kind of green he wants, he has to be a legitimate staff ace. Right now, he's one of the best #2 pitchers in the game, but is not an ace.

He'll probably get something close to what Burnett got. Burnett got 5 years, 82M, and while that was an overpay at the time, seeing as how market value goes up every year, something like that is in the neighborhood of what he would deserve after the next 2 years.