15 million in Cap

[-AC-]

I was hoping more in the line of $12 mill with built in incentives like 30TD's, 62% passing accuracy and leading the 49ers to a Super Bowl victory. I hope that Kap works on his weaknesses this offseason. His footwork needs a lot of work and so does his pocket presence. There are times when he depends too much of his athleticism thinking he could make any throw even throwing with his back foot. For $16 mill per year, a QB should be alble to view the entire field, not just locking to one receiver. Kap also needs to remember that he has a great defense that has his back.

4 of the last 8 games of the season, that great defense gave up 4th qtr leads, 3 of which the (Kap lead) offense were able to respond with game winning drives...

 

[AU_Fever]

4 of the last 8 games of the season, that great defense gave up 4th qtr leads, 3 of which the (Kap lead) offense were able to respond with game winning drives...

Which games? The same Kap who had three turnovers in the 4th quarter of the NFC championship game? The same Kap who led the Niners to have the 30th rank passing offense last year? The one read Kap who locks on to one receiver? AC, do you think he's worth $18 mill annually? IMO, he's not. He still has so much room for improvement. I want to see if he is willing to work on his weaknesses.

 

[Jikkle]

I was watching Bay Area Sports News with Matt Maiocco and he stated that there is a good chance that the Niners will try to work a deal with Kap. He also said that Kap's agent will use Cutler's salary as a starting point. Kawakami, who was also present chimed in and said that Kaps agent is looking at possibly $16-18 mill annually. That is a lot of money. I don't think Kap is worth $16-18 mill annually.

It's not a matter of worth but what the market says you're worth and he has no reason to ask for less than what Cutler got.

If I was in his shoes I wouldn't ask for less than what Cutler got as well.

 

[-AC-]

Which games? The same Kap who had three turnovers in the 4th quarter of the NFC championship game? The same Kap who led the Niners to have the 30th rank passing offense last year? The one read Kap who locks on to one receiver? AC, do you think he's worth $18 mill annually? IMO, he's not. He still has so much room for improvement. I want to see if he is willing to work on his weaknesses.

It is what it is, like I said the great defense gave up 4th qtr leads in half of the last eight games of the season. The NFC championship game was a combination of those 4th qtr TO's by Kap (that you mentioned) but also huge lapses from the defense with poor discipline, poor tackling and mental errors...

I wasn't necessarily trying to make a case for Kap with my response as much as I was pointing out that the defense is not as flawless as it would appear...

I to would like to see Kap improve his game, but right now I would be comfortable with giving him no more than 15 or 16 million a year (with a team option in two years to head in another direction or continue the contract)...

 

[AU_Fever]

It's not a matter of worth but what the market says you're worth and he has no reason to ask for less than what Cutler got.

If I was in his shoes I wouldn't ask for less than what Cutler got as well.

Jikkle, would your sign Kap for $18 mill per year for 6 six years? The market does dictate his worth. You're absolutely correct. But have you seen enough of Kap to give him this much money? I don't blame Kap for getting as much money as possible. I just don't think the Niners should sign him for that much per year. That's just my opinion.

 

[Jikkle]

Jikkle, would your sign Kap for $18 mill per year for 6 six years? The market does dictate his worth. You're absolutely correct. But have you seen enough of Kap to give him this much money? I don't blame Kap for getting as much money as possible. I just don't think the Niners should sign him for that much per year. That's just my opinion.

It's more of a question of if you believe Kap is the future of the franchise or not. As much as I would love to sign him as cheaply as possible he's not likely going to get less of what Cutler got.

I would because I believe he will continue to grow and will be good enough to be considered a top flight QB in the league. My take on this past season is it was just some growing pains of a young QB with a mix of some debatable playcalling.

But this is where the brain trust in the organization needs to determine if he's the future or not. They see all the things behind the scenes that we never see and are in way better position to determine if Kap has what it takes or not.

 

[Gold Rush 86]

With the salary cap projected to jump like crazy the next few years I think even avg QBs might start getting 20+ million a year. Even tho we dont wanna pay Kap 16-18 million a year now but say 5-7 years down the road it will still be a steal I think. Top QB are prolly on pace to be making close to 30 million a year in the next few years.

 

[MHSL82]

It's more of a question of if you believe Kap is the future of the franchise or not. As much as I would love to sign him as cheaply as possible he's not likely going to get less of what Cutler got.

By what was said earlier, it sounds like he will get less than what Cutler got. It was said here that Kaepernick was starting with Cutler numbers - you don't start with your floor, you start with your ceiling. And is Cutler money what he considers the fair balance that allows the team to not be strapped? No, it's the starting number that you negotiate down from. Then, he and the team can say he's worth Cutler money but he took a hometown discount.

Besides, it's the guaranteed and how it's structured, not per year averages. More years the better because it spreads out the bonus.

 

[MHSL82]

With the salary cap projected to jump like crazy the next few years I think even avg QBs might start getting 20+ million a year. Even tho we dont wanna pay Kap 16-18 million a year now but say 5-7 years down the road it will still be a steal I think. Top QB are prolly on pace to be making close to 30 million a year in the next few years.

That's a good point. We thought the cap was going to be 128 or so and now it's 133. So that 18 million that was too much is like 13 million.

Now, of course, you'd like to use that 5M cap jump elsewhere, too. It just helps.

 

[MHSL82]

It's more of a question of if you believe Kap is the future of the franchise or not. As much as I would love to sign him as cheaply as possible he's not likely going to get less of what Cutler got.

I would because I believe he will continue to grow and will be good enough to be considered a top flight QB in the league. My take on this past season is it was just some growing pains of a young QB with a mix of some debatable playcalling.

But this is where the brain trust in the organization needs to determine if he's the future or not. They see all the things behind the scenes that we never see and are in way better position to determine if Kap has what it takes or not.

If he's going to get more than Cutler money as you suggested, what changes between signing him this year and signing him next year if he wins the SB? Let's say he does get that 20 because we believe he's the Franchise and will grow. What would he get if he waited and won the SB? 20? 25? There's a certain point he would have to know he's hurting himself by hurting the team, but money is money and taking less money may hurt more than not winning another SB? Conversely, if he struggles again this year, misses the playoffs or first round exit, does that number go down to 12-16?

Like you said, it's the market, but it's also the team. Would he go to Cleveland for max (if he struggled here)? Or would he stay for a good but not elite pay (12-16)? Could we make up for that dip by increasing the guaranteed percentage or total?

 

[-AC-]

With the salary cap projected to jump like crazy the next few years I think even avg QBs might start getting 20+ million a year. Even tho we dont wanna pay Kap 16-18 million a year now but say 5-7 years down the road it will still be a steal I think. Top QB are prolly on pace to be making close to 30 million a year in the next few years.

This is a pretty good point...

All of a sudden 16-18 million doesn't sound so bad as compared to what some have already received and what others will get in the next couple seasons...

The question is, will they get it done now or gamble on what the next wave of QB's get and pay accordinly?

 

[deep9er]

It's more of a question of if you believe Kap is the future of the franchise or not. As much as I would love to sign him as cheaply as possible he's not likely going to get less of what Cutler got.

I would because I believe he will continue to grow and will be good enough to be considered a top flight QB in the league. My take on this past season is it was just some growing pains of a young QB with a mix of some debatable playcalling.

But this is where the brain trust in the organization needs to determine if he's the future or not. They see all the things behind the scenes that we never see and are in way better position to determine if Kap has what it takes or not.

yep, and it is too bad Harbaugh and Baalke aren't "determining" together.

 

[maniax]

Maybe it can be like this thread: instead of "15 Million in Cap," it could be, "15 Million in Kap."

FTR, I want the contract to be as close to 7 years and league minimum as possible. Not because that's what he worth or deserves but because anyone should want more money for the team. So if it's 16 v. 12, I want 12. If it's 12 or 8, I want 8. Etc. The less the better and this applies to everyone on the team, not just Kaepernick or QBs.

Hopefully, you read the whole thing. I'm not talking about what the Niners should offer. I'm just saying that I'm hoping for whatever they agree to being the most for for the other 50 that count against the cap and the future years.

haha... LOL.

We'll have $0 cap space after $15 million of Kap space.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

Brown is gone

I could see Brown returning after testing the market, but we'll see. He might be pissed at the team about his bonus, even though they gave him some of it.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

It's not a matter of worth but what the market says you're worth and he has no reason to ask for less than what Cutler got.

If I was in his shoes I wouldn't ask for less than what Cutler got as well.

Ask? No. But there's plenty of reason for him not to get it. Cutler's deal was expiring and he was poised to be a FA. Kap still has another year under contract at $1.5ish million. He could make many times that if he reaches an extension before the beginning of this season.

 

[MHSL82]

haha... LOL.

We'll have $0 cap space after $15 million of Kap space.

Ha, I meant standard backloading, but yes, that's what it'd be if it were all this year.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

Jikkle, would your sign Kap for $18 mill per year for 6 six years? The market does dictate his worth. You're absolutely correct. But have you seen enough of Kap to give him this much money? I don't blame Kap for getting as much money as possible. I just don't think the Niners should sign him for that much per year. That's just my opinion.

I wouldn't sign him to that this season. If he wants that kind of money, he needs to play another season and show some significant improvement. I'd probably offer around $14-15 million for six year this season - assuming the team has faith he's their longterm guy. If he won't take that, then I'd see what he does this year. There's no incentive for the Niners to give him $18 million this year, unless they're worried that the increase in the cap will bump the price significantly next year.

 

[-AC-]

I wouldn't sign him to that this season. If he wants that kind of money, he needs to play another season and show some significant improvement. I'd probably offer around $14-15 million for six year this season - assuming the team has faith he's their longterm guy. If he won't take that, then I'd see what he does this year. There's no incentive for the Niners to give him $18 million this year, unless they're worried that the increase in the cap will bump the price significantly next year.

I think that has to be a realistic concern now...

 

[Crimsoncrew]

I think that has to be a realistic concern now...

Yeah, that's fair. But the cap isn't going to increase this way annually. And QB is just one position; it's not like all the money from that increase would go straight to his pockets. I still struggle to see us paying him $20 million if he doesn't win the SB next year.

 

[Gold Rush 86]

We could give him 14 million a year with incentives. He threw for what 3200 yards last year? If he throws for 4000+ yards he gets 500K. If he has a 60%+ completion percentage another 500K. Wins the SB 2 million. Combine for 32+ TD passing and rushing another 500K. Just throwing somethings out there.