Wins Vs Quality Starts

[MilkSpiller22]

I plan on starting threads about how to find the ideal setup for your fantasy league...

the first thread is for category of Wins or QS(rotisserie and H2H categories)

As some may know, Quality starts is one of my favorite pitching stats... With that said, in fantasy baseball i think Wins is a superior stat...

First of we are only talking about standard 5X5, once other categories are added that changes the whole thing, so for this thread we are only talking about leagues with 5 pitching categories and they are ERA, WHIP, S, K, W or QS


QS is clearly the better stat in real life baseball, but the biggest problem with it in fantasy is that it excludes all relievers... with wins, it may be a valid strategy to start middle or long relievers if their ratio stats are good... Especially in daily roster changes, where you can just keep relievers in all week, and then stream starters as they actually start...

My other problem with QS compared to Ws in fantasy is that QS is a better indicator on who is the better pitcher... I like to keep my categories seperate and equal... If we have to many categories that all have similar lists then what is the point of even doing categories??

And in H2H categories, the problem with QS is that releivers can not get them at all, and in a weekly scoring format that gives too much of an advantage to Starting pitching, and too much of an advantage to multi start pitchers...

 

[TDs3nOut]

Frustrating and elusive as the W stat often is in fantasy baseball, I think it is also the most exciting, precisely for those two reasons. LOL

Never played in a league where QS counted, but it seems to me like using that instead of W would make the competition somewhat less interesting.

 

[TKOSpikes]

I just wish a QS was 7 innings with 3 runs or less. Six innings makes it nothing special, IMO. I'll take wins in a 5x5 league. Too bad they can't be combined as one cat.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

I just wish a QS was 7 innings with 3 runs or less. Six innings makes it nothing special, IMO. I'll take wins in a 5x5 league. Too bad they can't be combined as one cat.

they actually can... Most sites allow you to set weights on each category... So if you wanted you could use both as one combined category... Not sure if that is worth it though...

 

[TDs3nOut]

An issue that might be related to whether to use QS or W is whether there is a restriction on the number of starts that your pitchers can make during the season. In the espn leagues that I've always played in each team is allowed a maximum of 200 starts per season. That limit seems to me like more of a constraint when the counting stat is W than if it were QS.

Pretty sure that BigD told me last summer, however, that in his leagues there is no limit on the number of starts that pitchers can make.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

An issue that might be related to whether to use QS or W is whether there is a restriction on the number of starts that your pitchers can make during the season. In the espn leagues that I've always played in each team is allowed a maximum of 200 starts per season. That limit seems to me like more of a constraint when the counting stat is W than if it were QS.

Pretty sure that BigD told me last summer, however, that in his leagues there is no limit on the number of starts that pitchers can make.

A starts limit, i dont think would change anythig, but maybe an innings limit would... If there is an innings limit changing to QS would be very interesting, because now QS has also become an efficiency stat...

 

[obxyankeefan]

An issue that might be related to whether to use QS or W is whether there is a restriction on the number of starts that your pitchers can make during the season. In the espn leagues that I've always played in each team is allowed a maximum of 200 starts per season. That limit seems to me like more of a constraint when the counting stat is W than if it were QS.

Pretty sure that BigD told me last summer, however, that in his leagues there is no limit on the number of starts that pitchers can make.

BigD's leagues have an inning limit in the 1600 range.

 

[TDs3nOut]

A starts limit, i dont think would change anythig, but maybe an innings limit would... If there is an innings limit changing to QS would be very interesting, because now QS has also become an efficiency stat...

I think there would be less variance between the teams in the league in QS than in W. For example, with a 200 start max, I think the number of Ws in a ten team league typically ends up somewhere between around 70 and 120. Seems likely to me that teams would likely be more tightly bunched in QS, since QS is quite a bit more predictable than W.

 

[broncosmitty]

I don't see any advantage to having QS as a category.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

I think there would be less variance between the teams in the league in QS than in W. For example, with a 200 start max, I think the number of Ws in a ten team league typically ends up somewhere between around 70 and 120. Seems likely to me that teams would likely be more tightly bunched in QS, since QS is quite a bit more predictable than W.

I am not following what you are arguing... are you arguing against QS here??

What i said, is that the only time in 5x5 i see any use for it is if there is an innings limit, because then the stat doubles as an efficiency category... Which is actually kind of cool... But with a Games started limit, i dont see any advantage of QS over Wins, and only see the same old disadvantages...

 

[TDs3nOut]

I am not following what you are arguing... are you arguing against QS here??

What i said, is that the only time in 5x5 i see any use for it is if there is an innings limit, because then the stat doubles as an efficiency category... Which is actually kind of cool... But with a Games started limit, i dont see any advantage of QS over Wins, and only see the same old disadvantages...

I prefer W to QS if there is a limit on number of starts, since choosing how to use each start is more challenging if the counting stat is W rather than QS.

 

[Chef99]

I just wish a QS was 7 innings with 3 runs or less. Six innings makes it nothing special, IMO. I'll take wins in a 5x5 league. Too bad they can't be combined as one cat.

This is my one problem with QS as well. 3 runs in 6 innings is not a quality start, imo. Making it 7 innings is a big difference.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

This is my one problem with QS as well. 3 runs in 6 innings is not a quality start, imo. Making it 7 innings is a big difference.

don't be knocking on QS, it is a great stat... One of my favorites, i dedicated a whole thread to it... Just not a great fantasy stat...

 

[MilkSpiller22]

there is 2 formats where i think QS is better than Wins... and only 2 with these exact features...

1. rotisserie with no flexibility in how to start pitchers... there is only SP, and RP, and you must start a RP at RP... No P spot, where you can start either a reliever or a starter.

2. rotisserie or H2H categories where there is an attainable maximum of innings weekly or per season... in this format QS would double as an efficiency stat...

 

[broncosmitty]

It's not a good measure of efficiency.

Pitcher A goes 6 innings, gives up 3 runs. Gets a QS.

Pitcher B goes 9 innings, gives up 4 runs. Gets nothing, but did his job 33% longer, with a lower ERA.

Over the course of seasons and careers, QS is a worthy indicator. Game to game, not so much.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

It's not a good measure of efficiency.

Pitcher A goes 6 innings, gives up 3 runs. Gets a QS.

Pitcher B goes 9 innings, gives up 4 runs. Gets nothing, but did his job 33% longer, with a lower ERA.

Over the course of seasons and careers, QS is a worthy indicator. Game to game, not so much.

I didn't say it was a good measure of efficiency... I said it is a good measure ONLY in that specific format...

Lets say there is a weekly maximum innings in H2H categories league of 50 innings, and you start 8 pitchers... then the more QS you have shows how efficient you used those 50 innings... the most you can get with 50 innings is 8 QS...

 

[Reverend Jim]

I'll let this speak for my opinion on the matter.
quality starts over wins | Fantasy Assembly

 

[MilkSpiller22]

I'll let this speak for my opinion on the matter.
quality starts over wins | Fantasy Assembly

and, i read your article, very well written... But i feel like you miss the whole point of categories in fantasy... They all measure a certain aspect of a fantasy player... Having a better measurement of who is better is not always best, thats the point of all the other categories to be measured together... different lists is the whole purpose otherwise why even do categories??

with QS, on draft day, you can pretty much forget about the whole category since the rest of the categories already answer who is the better pitcher... With Wins, you have to take into account the team, and some other factors, and it just adds actual strategy on draft day...

QS, is also a stat only starting pitchers can get, so by using that stat there is never any use for any non-closer reliever... and it also hurts the value of a closer...

 

[MilkSpiller22]

and, i read your article, very well written... But i feel like you miss the whole point of categories in fantasy... They all measure a certain aspect of a fantasy player... Having a better measurement of who is better is not always best, thats the point of all the other categories to be measured together... different lists is the whole purpose otherwise why even do categories??

with QS, on draft day, you can pretty much forget about the whole category since the rest of the categories already answer who is the better pitcher... With Wins, you have to take into account the team, and some other factors, and it just adds actual strategy on draft day...

QS, is also a stat only starting pitchers can get, so by using that stat there is never any use for any non-closer reliever... and it also hurts the value of a closer...

that sounds like fighting words... did not mean it that way...