When will Lebron pass Jordan?

[Shaqdaddy11]

This will also be quick and easy. Using the same seasons:

Player A:
23.6 PER
.558 TS%
30.3 OWS
15.9 DWS
46.3 WS
.180 WS/48
4.6 OBPM
18.9 VORP

Player B:
29.8 PER
.589 TS%
48.0 OWS
21.5 DWS
69.5 WS
.276 WS/48
8.6 OBPM
40.7 VORP

I mean for real, your argument is so weak you had to bring up team accomplishments? lmao.

The only team accomplishment is championships, lol! But yeah, let's just ignore that shall we when comparing better and successful players

And then you throw the Win Shares argument out

Come on man, even YOU should be better than this.

 

[Wishbone]

And don't forget Jordan took a few years off between 3 peats to play baseball.

 

[ericd7633]

The only team accomplishment is championships, lol! But yeah, let's just ignore that shall we when comparing better and successful players

And then you throw the Win Shares argument out

Come on man, even YOU should be better than this.

Holy shit, you're dumb. Kobe winning 2 titles in that time frame doesn't prove he was better. I mean lmao. I honestly think the only thing Kobe did better during that 4 year stretch was shoot 1% better from 3.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Holy shit, you're dumb. Kobe winning 2 titles in that time frame doesn't prove he was better. I mean lmao. I honestly think the only thing Kobe did better during that 4 year stretch was shoot 1% better from 3.

So being the best player and MVP on two championship winning teams means nothing but a guy with a better offensive win share on a team that got knocked out in the second round of the playoffs twice is a lot better, right?

This is getting pathetically hilarious.

 

[Black Adam]

NEVER if it comes to ring count...

 

[DorianRo]

I don't think he'll ever get that recognition, but healthy debates will occur, IMO. The biggest thing about this is Jordan's legacy will always grow over time. There's no erasing his 6-0 finals record, or taking two years off in his prime as the only time teams in the NBA had a shot to win a title over him. He's one of the greatest defenders of all time and the greatest scorer of all time. There's no getting away from that.

The thing about Lebron that most Jordan fans will never realize is that at any point in his career, if Lebron really wanted to, he could have lead the league in any statistical category he wanted. If Lebron wanted to be the best point guard of all time, he could do it. He could lead the league in assists every year. If Lebron wanted to average 40 a game, he could do it, no question. Rebounding, Steals, Blocks, you name it. He could do it. That's within his skill set. The difference is that Lebron chooses to be a well rounded player, sometimes to the detriment of his own legacy.

Jordan is arguably the best one man force the game has ever seen. Lebron's game doesn't make him as such. He's as much of a product of his teammates as he is his own individual force. Lebron makes his teammates better in a different way than MJ did. Lebron elevates his teammates. Jordan carried them. People for some reason want to give more credit to being carried though, when IMO, it's much more difficult to make everyone around you better.

If you're in a group project for school, you can have one guy who does all the work, and get's the A for the group. Or you can have the guy carries the brunt of the work but also who pushes everyone to do their part and collectively they're able to get the A. Who's more valuable?

Good post until the "LeBron makes his teammates better stuff". Who played their best basketball with LeBron?? Wade didn't Bosh didn't, Love didn't.

I guess he Made Dellavodova better. Cant think of many others.

Jordan challenged and made those around him better. If Not for Jordan, Pippen wouldn't have become the player he did. He bullied guys like Kerr in practice to be the best they could be

 

[tlance]

This will also be quick and easy. Using the same seasons:


Player A:
23.6 PER
.558 TS%
30.3 OWS
15.9 DWS
46.3 WS
.180 WS/48
4.6 OBPM
18.9 VORP

Player B:
29.8 PER
.589 TS%
48.0 OWS
21.5 DWS
69.5 WS
.276 WS/48
8.6 OBPM
40.7 VORP

I mean for real, your argument is so weak you had to bring up team accomplishments? lmao.

Player B. By a lot.

Good post.

 

[redseat]

so Jordan's job was to score but Lebron's wasn't? How can you say that? I need to be explained about that more

 

[ericd7633]

So being the best player and MVP on two championship winning teams means nothing but a guy with a better offensive win share on a team that got knocked out in the second round of the playoffs twice is a lot better, right?

This is getting pathetically hilarious.

Yeah it is because your best argument for Kobe being better those 4 seasona is because the Lakers traded for Gasol. Lmao.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Player B. By a lot.

Good post.

Yes, let's compare Win Shares for a player who didn't win anything and a player who won two championships

 

[DorianRo]

Kobe's 2 championships coming out of a stacked West in 2009/2010 (with Gasol as 2nd fiddle) is more an impressive feat then Ive seen from LeBron bringing his team out of the East.

When was the last time the Eastern Conference was solid from top to bottom during Lebron's rule?

 

[Wamu]

Good post until the "LeBron makes his teammates better stuff". Who played their best basketball with LeBron?? Wade didn't Bosh didn't, Love didn't.

I guess he Made Dellavodova better. Cant think of many others.

Jordan challenged and made those around him better. If Not for Jordan, Pippen wouldn't have become the player he did. He bullied guys like Kerr in practice to be the best they could be

Bosh didn't get out of the 1st round in Toronto. Love never made the playoffs in Minnesota. Do you even follow the NBA?

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Yeah it is because your best argument for Kobe being better those 4 seasona is because the Lakers traded for Gasol. Lmao.

This is what you're using when the tank is empty?

"Lebron is better because Kobe had Gasol"

Really?

 

[DorianRo]

Bosh never got out of the 1st round in Toronto. Love never made the playoffs in Minnesota. Do you even follow the NBA?

They were also on crappy teams. Of course put them with other all-stars, on a stacked team and they win playoff series.

Good god man. Don't be an IDIOT

 

[Wamu]

They were also on crappy teams. Of course put them with other all-stars, on a stacked team and they win playoff series.

Good god man. Don't be an IDIOT

Always w/ the excuses. You said LeBron's never made any teammates better. I called you on your trolling bullshit. Also Irving never made it to the playoffs until LeBron returned to Cleveland. Of course you'll say that doesn't count.

By your dumbass logic KD's title last year is invalid because he went to a loaded team. You goofball.

 

[DorianRo]

Always w/ the excuses. You said LeBron's never made any teammates better. I called you on your trolling bullshit. Also Irving never made it to the playoffs until LeBron returned to Cleveland. Of course you'll say that doesn't count.

By your dumbass logic KD's title last year is invalid because he went to a loaded team. You goofball.

.... And he hasn't. Like I said, Wade played better before Joining James, So did Love and Bosh. What is this "he made teammates better" nonsense. If I go join the Warriors and sit the bench all series I can win some playoff rounds of basketball too ROFLMAO!!!

And yea, Irving was on a shitty Cavs team prior to LeBron too before he stacked out with Love/Lebron. Do you expect them to win playoff series on a team full of SCRUBS??

These guys went from playing on schlub teams to play on All star teams. I would HOPE they win some playoff series.

 

[True Lakers Fan]

Your argument that lebron has been the leagues best player (still arguable) for 11 years only means the league has had shitty players over the last decade compared to others.

MJ had to face a prime Magic and Bird early in his career.

As I recall- He did not win any titles until After Kareem A J RETIRED.

 

[Wamu]

.... And he hasn't. Like I said, Wade played better before Joining James, So did Love and Bosh. What is this "he made teammates better" nonsense. If I go join the Warriors and sit the bench all series I can win some playoff rounds of basketball too ROFLMAO!!!

And yea, Irving was on a shitty Cavs team prior to LeBron too before he stacked out with Love/Lebron. Do you expect them to win playoff series on a team full of SCRUBS??

LeBron took a team full of scrubs to the Finals in '07.

 

[DorianRo]

LeBron took a team full of scrubs to the Finals in '07.

Give him props for that. Never denied it. Outside of that he's been playing with all-stars in a weak conference ever since.

 

[DorianRo]

Bottom line these players were GREAT ever before joining LeBron. He didn't make them "great". Wade a solid 25-26ppg player before LeBron and former FMVP. Love was a solid 24ppg player. Bosh was a solid 20.

They were great players on lousy teams.

anyways. No LeBron will NOT catch MJ or even sniff his greatness. The ship has sailed.