Top 32 tournament SS Wagner vs Larkin

[obxyankeefan]

Top 32 players ranked by BRWAR(as of 6/18/15).

Shortstop Bracket is:

1 H Wagner 8
32 N Garciaparra 0

16 PW Reese 3
17 L Boudreau 6

8 B Dahlen 8
25 A Fletcher 1

9 L Appling 8
24 D Bancroft 0

4 G Davis 6 advances on seed
29 O Vizquel 6

13 B Larkin 7
20 J Sewell 0

5 R Yount 8
28 V Stephens 4

12 A Trammell 14
21 J Tinker 0

3 C Ripken JR 8
30 T Fernandez 2

14 E Banks 10
19 L Aparicio 0

6 O Smith 16
27 J Rollins 1

11 D Jeter 12
22 B Campaneris 1

2 A Rodriguez 9
31 R Peckinpaugh 0

15 J Cronin 5
18 J Glasscock 4

7 B Wallace 5
26 M Tejada 6

10 A Vaughan 8
23 J Fregosi 0

1 H Wagner 9
17 L Boudreau 0

8 B Dahlen 1
9 L Appling 7

4 G Davis 2
13 B Larkin 10

5 R Yount 6
12 A Trammell 8

3 C Ripken JR 4
14 E Banks 8

6 O Smith 6
11 D Jeter 7

2 A Rodriguez 11
15 J Cronin 2

26 M Tejada 0
10 A Vaughan 10

1 H Wagner 7
9 L Appling 0

13 B Larkin 7
12 A Trammell 4

14 E Banks 9
11 D Jeter 6

2 A Rodriguez 8
10 A Vaughan 0

1 H Wagner
13 B Larkin

14 E Banks
2 A Rodriguez

 

[obxyankeefan]

Honus Wagner Statistics and History | Baseball-Reference.com
Beat Nomar Garciaparra, Lou Boudreau, and Luke Appling 24-0

Barry Larkin Statistics and History | Baseball-Reference.com
Beat Joe Sewell, George Davis, and Alan Trammell 24-2

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Power- Wagner wins(NOT CLOSE)
XBH%
Wagner-Career=8.5, Best=12.2, #499+PA seasons=11, MLB average=4.9(3.6)
Larkin- Career=7.9, Best=11.0, #499+PA seasons=6, MLB average=7.5(.4)

BA-Wagner wins(NOT CLOSE)
Wagner-Career=.328, Best=.381, # of 499+PA seasons=12, MLB average=.268(.06)
Larkin- Career=.295, Best=.342, # of 499+PA seasons=7, MLB average=.269(.026)

BB-Larkin wins(not close)
BB%
Wagner-Career=8.2, Best=12.0, # 499+PA seasons=10, MLB average=7.3(.9)
Larkin-Career=10.4, Best=17, # 499+ PA seasons=6, MLB average=8.8(1.6)

SO-Wagner wins(VERY CLOSE)
SO%
Wagner-Career=6.3, Best=2.9, # 499+PA seasons=10, MLB average=9.4(3.1)
Larkin-Career=9.0, Best=12.1, # 499+ PA seasons=5, MLB average=16(7)

Base stealing-Larkin based on incomplete data on wagner(close??)
Wagner-Career=723, Best=61, 20+ seasons=19,
Larkin=Career=379(83%), Best=51(91%), 20+seasonsof 75% or higher=9

Defense- TIE
anytime comparing an old player with a more modern player it is very difficult to measure since defense was much worse back then so dWAR of many are high just because they were better than than their peers but not necessarily great... But it does seem like we are talking about 2 of the best SS of their time... so I will call this a tie...

Career longevity-Wagner wins(over 2000 more PA)
positional longevity- Larkin wins(around 200 more games)
# of 499+PA seasons- Larkin=10, Wagner=17



WAGNER WINS and this is NOT CLOSE...

 

[calsnowskier]

Offensively, it isn't even close. If Wagner were an OFer while putting up the same numbers, he would still be considered one of the better bats of all time. Larkin would still be an MLB-starter, and might even be an all-star. But he would certainly not be considered elite.

Defensively, as Milk stated, it is hard to judge old-timers. None of us have seen him play, so we can only go off of dWAR and anecdotal evidence. Based on dWAR, Wagner was a bit better, but both were VERY good. Larkin has a rep as a VERY good defensive SS, but just south of the ELITE-class (Vizquel, Smith, etc). I am unaware of Wagner's reputation.