Tim Duncan > Kobe Bryant

[Inimical]

Disagree on both. Kobe definitely wasn't everyone's cup of tea as far as leadership styles, but for those who could handle his tough love approach, there were no issues.

Kobe didn't require Phil to win 2 more championships, he required better players around him. Specifically the addition of Pau Gasol and the improvement of Andrew Bynum. Prior to that, they were bounced out of the playoffs in the 1st round 2 years in a row with Phil as coach. Not to mention, how many titles did Timmy win without Pop?

Having said the above, I rate Timmy higher, but I wouldn't complain about having either to build a team around.

I agree with this and can build on it, but its so intricate it just takes a really long post. I just dont have the energy for it.

 

[trojanfan12]

I agree with this and can build on it, but its so intricate it just takes a really long post. I just dont have the energy for it.

lol Understandable. I'm too stoned to keep up with a long, intricate post anyway.

 

[Inimical]

lol Understandable. I'm too stoned to keep up with a long, intricate post anyway.

lol right on, i could do it tonight or in 3 months, fuck me.

 

[OutlawImmortal]

Disagree on both. Kobe definitely wasn't everyone's cup of tea as far as leadership styles, but for those who could handle his tough love approach, there were no issues and they got rings.

Kobe didn't require Phil to win 2 more championships, he required better players around him. Specifically the addition of Pau Gasol and the improvement of Andrew Bynum. Prior to that, they were bounced out of the playoffs in the 1st round 2 years in a row with Phil as coach. Not to mention, how many titles did Timmy win without Pop?

Having said the above, I rate Timmy higher, but I wouldn't complain about having either to build a team around.

That would be a good point if Timmy had ever acted like he was good enough to win without Pop. There's the reason why Phil called Kobe uncoachable and it wasn't just to sell copies of his book.

I would say Odom was more important than Bynum, Bynum was injured for a portion of Kobe's 2nd playoff run. I don't seem to recall any stories about Duncan demeaning any of his teammates. Duncan is the superior leader, I've avoided bringing up stats and accolades because they are pretty close on paper. Duncan was 1 Ray Allen 3-pointer away from matching Jordan 6-0 mark in the playoffs. Add to that the fact that Duncan wasn't just competitive in a single decade, and I don't know how you make the argument for Kobe.

Pau Gasol didn't stick around in LA, and Kobe wasn't able to attract free agents like someone like LeBron or Curry (who Durant recently stated has "no ego") has been able to. There's a reason for that.

 

[OutlawImmortal]

Kobe was also the reason for the lack of talent during those years. He chased Phil and Shaq out and blew up the team, then laughably, later demanded a trade when the team was lacking talent.

 

[The Oldtimer]

I think we did this a while back, but I agree Kobe was a great player but i'll take Duncan.

The problem with comparing NBA players, is you should try to compare players that play the same position. How in the hell can you compare a PF/C to a shooting guard. It's impossible. Why didn't you try to compare Duncan to Jabbar?

 

[Nosferatu]

The problem with comparing NBA players, is you should try to compare players that play the same position. How in the hell can you compare a PF/C to a shooting guard. It's impossible.

It's not impossible. You can compare their greatness, their ability to lead, their ability to make the players around them better, their ability to take over a game and other things...

 

[The Oldtimer]

It's not impossible. You can compare their greatness, their ability to lead, their ability to make the players around them better, their ability to take over a game and other things...

Sure you can compare some of the things you mentioned. But as far as talent and taking over a game, it's impossible to compare a PF/C to a shooting guard. Why aren't we comparing Duncan to Jabbar?

 

[OutlawImmortal]

I agree with this and can build on it, but its so intricate it just takes a really long post. I just dont have the energy for it.

No surprise there.

 

[Nosferatu]

Sure you can compare some of the things you mentioned. But as far as talent and taking over a game, it's impossible to compare a PF/C to a shooting guard. Why aren't we comparing Duncan to Jabbar?

I'm not the OP

 

[msgkings322]

Sure you can compare some of the things you mentioned. But as far as talent and taking over a game, it's impossible to compare a PF/C to a shooting guard. Why aren't we comparing Duncan to Jabbar?

Jabbar was never a PF and Duncan was barely ever a C. Better comparison would be Duncan and Karl Malone or Barkley.

Kobe is obviously a step below MJ but very similar games.

But it's fun to argue stuff.

Like LeBron being better than all of those, except MJ.

 

[The Oldtimer]

I'm not the OP

Fair enough. I have been watching basketball for many years and I have never tried to compare a PF/C to a Shooting Guard, but if anyone want to compare players from different positions on the court, then that's their right.

 

[Nosferatu]

Fair enough. I have been watching basketball for many years and I have never tried to compare a PF/C to a Shooting Guard, but if anyone want to compare players from different positions on the court, then that's their right.

Thanks, i'll make sure to write that down... Note to self don't compare players from different positions with Oldtimer...

 

[The Oldtimer]

Thanks, i'll make sure to write that down... Note to self don't compare players from different positions with Oldtimer...

Yeah make sure you write that down and don't forget it.

 

[Arizona_Sting]

Totally agree. Timmy is the best player since Jordan and there's no debating that. Kobe was more flashy and played in LA so he got more hype and attention from media. Kobe is an all-time great no doubt... but what Timmy did over his career is unbelievable and I doubt we ever see a run of consistent dominance like that again for a loooong time.

 

[msgkings322]

I give Kobe credit on this: he tried to out-Jordan Jordan. He said "I'm going to basically try to be the best SG ever." And he got pretty close.

 

[trojanfan12]

That would be a good point if Timmy had ever acted like he was good enough to win without Pop. There's the reason why Phil called Kobe uncoachable and it wasn't just to sell copies of his book.

I would say Odom was more important than Bynum, Bynum was injured for a portion of Kobe's 2nd playoff run. I don't seem to recall any stories about Duncan demeaning any of his teammates. Duncan is the superior leader, I've avoided bringing up stats and accolades because they are pretty close on paper. Duncan was 1 Ray Allen 3-pointer away from matching Jordan 6-0 mark in the playoffs. Add to that the fact that Duncan wasn't just competitive in a single decade, and I don't know how you make the argument for Kobe.

Pau Gasol didn't stick around in LA, and Kobe wasn't able to attract free agents like someone like LeBron or Curry (who Durant recently stated has "no ego") has been able to. There's a reason for that.

Agree with everything except the bold. Pau did stick around in L.A. He stuck around much longer than he had to. He wanted a chance to win another ring and gave the Lakers the chance to try and put together a roster that could contend before he left. They weren't able to do it. Pau also happens to be one of Kobe's closest friends. So, let's not pretend that Pau left because of Kobe.

Kobe wasn't able to attract free agents because, after the Achilles injury, he was no longer a guaranteed late playoff run. If he were, the Lakers would likely have not had a problem attracting FA's. FA's today are looking for a chance to win now. Kobe was no longer able to provide that.

Plus, I agreed that Duncan was the better leader. The post I responded to said that Kobe never won a title without Phil. Well, Duncan never won one without Pop. We have no idea whether or not Duncan would have any titles without Pop, because he didn't have to.

Oh and... for making me defend Kobe like some damned Kobe Kid. lol

 

[Mecca]

You're just being nice, Mecca. Kobe was a horrible leader and actually had to come crawling back to Phil Jackson in order to even win a title after Shaq's departure. It's unfathomable; I mean, imagine if Steph Curry told Durant not to come to GS because he would steal too much of the spotlight, and it would no longer be Curry's team?

I agree with you 100%.

Kobe was a shit teammate and , from what has been reported by the media, a shitier human being.

But, all that aside, he was a generational talent.

Look, if we are debating a couple of guys greatness and its close, I'm always gonna go with the other player over Kobe.

I'm just honest enough to admit my reasoning has very little to do with basketball.

 

[Mecca]

There was a poll a while back. Truth is that Duncan has always been a great player and Kobe has had up and down years. Duncan is the better.

I would say Duncan's Teams have been more consistent.

It all comes down to what you value most.

Silent leadership, consistent winning, very good numbers across the board.

Vs.

Brash polarizing, killer instinct with a tremendous scoring ability.

I'll take Timmy.

Not sure my answer would be the same if Kobe wore another jersey though....

 

[tducey]

Both where awesome all time players and definite 1st ballot Hall of Famers. The game is less without them but for me Kobe's the better all time player.