NBA Draft Semi-Final Game 2

[wlk3]

This is pretty much how I see things, too. Noah is a good defender but struggles against physical players. A prime Shaq, for example, would annihilate him. Cousins would do just enough to where he would at least draw even and he'd probably win the match to a certain extent.

Did you really compare Cousins to Shaq...? and what about Cousins on the defensive end...? This why I wanted maybe a small gameplan... I'd use Horns (both bigs high on either side of free throw line)... PnR with Noah would KILL Cousins... Giving Noah the ball at the free throw line would KILL Cousins... Dribble drive and passing... Noah had like 3 triple-doubles this year and close to more... Then if Duncan helps KG kills you with that jumper... PG helps Westbrook kills you to the rim, kills you with the free-throw jumper... Parker can NOT stay with Westbrook... When I bring any of my bigs off the bench they can ALL play the same roll... Add that to the fact I can then post Andre Miller on Lillard which is a done deal... Why is everybody looking at what his offense would do but not mention Westbrook and Jason Richardson on the break... I own the boards, who's going to stop that break...? That's only rivaled by Lebron and Wade...

 

[Logicallylethal]

Ha... Surprise surprise... If you can't beat em... Join somebody who can...

I always vote objectively. I had Team D ranked as the best team.

 

[Clayton]

Did you really compare Cousins to Shaq..

No. I was just using an extreme example of what Noah can't defend

 

[wlk3]

You have a great team but you should probably hold off on talking about the benches, D has a much better bench...

Let's do your method because there is no way D has the better bench...

Miller > Lillard
Crawford > Calderon
Green < Derozan
Granger > Wilson
Prince < Gay
Odom > Jefferson
Millsap < Al Jefferson
Kaman = Gortat

That's how I see it... If you want switch players when doing so we could manipulate either side, just tried to match up by position... Add that to the fact team E has 2 six- man of the year players...

4 E
1 =
3 D

Starters, to be honest it's even to me... Ask yourself this... How different would we look at Duncan and KG if Duncan went to Minny and KG went to SA...?

 

[wlk3]

No. I was just using an extreme example of what Noah can't defend

That's pretty extreme... Nobody can guard Shaq...

 

[Nosferatu]

Let's do your method because there is no way D has the better bench...

Miller > Lillard
Crawford > Calderon
Green < Derozan
Granger > Wilson
Prince < Gay
Odom > Jefferson
Millsap < Al Jefferson
Kaman = Gortat

That's how I see it... If you want switch players when doing so we could manipulate either side, just tried to match up by position... Add that to the fact team E has 2 six- man of the year players...

4 E
1 =
3 D

Starters, to be honest it's even to me... Ask yourself this... How different would we look at Duncan and KG if Duncan went to Minny and KG went to SA...?

Well I don't have Lillard so... We can start there...

Irving > Miller : Not close IMO

Calderon > Crawford : The only thing Crawford is better at is scoring, Calderon is a better shooter and passer.

DeRozan > Green : Not very close IMO.

Chandler < Prince : You win.

Gay > Granger : Granger is one of the most overrated players of his generation.

R.Jefferson = Odom : Not sure how Odom is better, he's a better rebounder but Jefferson is a better 3 point shooter and scorer.

Gortat = Kaman : I'll say this one is even although I like Gortat better.

A.Jefferson > Millsap : This one isn't real close IMO either...

So I have it

5 - 1 D wins and 2 ties...

6th man of the year means nothing in this...

If I had to imagine KG and Duncan switching although it's not reality... KG was never a great 1st guy, when the game is on the line he didn't always step up, he put up great numbers and was an intense competitor but Duncan is one of the best clutch players in the history of the sport. Not sure many GM's would take KG over Duncan if given the chance to have them their entire careers.

 

[wlk3]

I had Team D rated as the best team in my rankings


Looking at the match ups there are a few that stand out

1) Tim Duncan vs Kevin Garnett is pretty much equal. If you look up their career head to heads both player's numbers are nearly identical as well

2) Paul George vs Kawhi Leonard. George owns Leonard in his career. George averages 19 ppg shooting 53 % head to head while Leonard only averages 11.

3) Cousins also holds up pretty well against Noah. 17.7 ppg 11 reb shooting 45 %. Noah's defense causes the slightly lower shooting percentage, but as "good" as Noah is defensively you have to admit his DPOY is nowhere near the DPOY of a Camby, Duncan, KG, Mutombo, Hakeem, etc.

3) Parker vs Westbrook is a good one too. Westbrook struggles head to head against Parker shooting only 38 % from the field while only scoring 18 ppg. Parker is 17-6 shooting 46 %.

4) Harden vs Jrich. Basically a tie.


5) Bench I give the edge to Team D.

1) Agreed

2) You're logic is flawed... George is the #1 option on his team Kawhi doesn't even get plays called for him... I'm assuming you've seen the Spurs play... The emphasis is stopping the team, if the "star" shines so be it, but they kill the body... Lebron's numbers would suggest a Finals win, yet it wasn't close... You showed Lebron's finals numbers but what about the rest...

3) which brings me to 3... KDs #s vs the Spurs are probably very strong I'd guess without looking... Ibaka's ability to stretch out is what gives the Spurs problems... You saw the same problem with Dirk when Duncan had to leave the post... He makes it hard for people to drive when he is down there, so if you have a great jumper (Paul and Lebron have been wet in their jumpers) you will score well as a star... They collapse very well with Duncan and mostly Kawhi... While the others stay home and on the floor... Westbrook likes the drive... He struggles with that collapse...

4) agreed

5) disagree

 

[wlk3]

Well I don't have Lillard so... We can start there...

Irving > Miller : Not close IMO

Calderon > Crawford : The only thing Crawford is better at is scoring, Calderon is a better shooter and passer.

DeRozan > Green : Not very close IMO.

Chandler < Prince : You win.

Gay > Granger : Granger is one of the most overrated players of his generation.

R.Jefferson = Odom : Not sure how Odom is better, he's a better rebounder but Jefferson is a better 3 point shooter and scorer.

Gortat = Kaman : I'll say this one is even although I like Gortat better.

A.Jefferson > Millsap : This one isn't real close IMO either...

So I have it

5 - 1 D wins and 2 ties...

6th man of the year means nothing in this...

If I had to imagine KG and Duncan switching although it's not reality... KG was never a great 1st guy, when the game is on the line he didn't always step up, he put up great numbers and was an intense competitor but Duncan is one of the best clutch players in the history of the sport. Not sure many GM's would take KG over Duncan if given the chance to have them their entire careers.

I agree with the KG thing, it has always been my thinking which is why I started Westbrook... But I'd submit, KGs best Minny teammate was Terrell Brandon Wallyworld I honestly can't remember to many others... Was Fred Hoiberg there... Joe Smith on an illegal trade...? Anyway that's a far cry from The Admiral, Manu, Parker etc... The Spurs put players to compliment him, I would imagine they would do the same for him...

 

[Nosferatu]

Hoiberg? lolzzz


He had Spree and Cassell for the run they made a decade ago, they beat the Lakers if Cassel doesn't get hurt.

 

[wlk3]

Kyrie can not even come close to holding Miller in the post either... I think Miller brings more to the table than Kyrie... Miller in a close 1...

Calderon is not better than Crawford... Especially in the rolls we have them in...

I guess the problem here is I'm setting a team up that would at together... Each player complimenting the others... Which is why I stated earlier to look at it as a whole... Add that to I don't agree with some of your thoughts but that is subjective... Richard Jefferson keeps getting bounced around because he CAN'T shoot the 3 and his hops have gone... They left him in NJ and even the Spurs couldn't get much out of him... Also the 6th men awards I brought up was proof that although these players were starters and excelled they were also productive off the bench... Again, has more to the construction of the team than who has better rosters... I realize this is all imaginary, but if we are to imagine a roster shouldn't we imagine how they would play together...? I don't feel team D is constructed better to plaY together beside the difference of opinion on individual talent... In all this is probably falling on dead ears as I believe this is the number of votes all the games have ended with...

 

[wlk3]

Hoiberg? lolzzz


He had Spree and Cassell for the run they made a decade ago, they beat the Lakers if Cassel doesn't get hurt.

I was seriously asking... Don't remember much of his cast... I thought Spree was gone by then and Cassell, eh... Like him, he was good for that team... But Cassell << Tony Parker... Better than Avery but then you add DR and Elliot... It's not close when you talk about talent surrounding KG and Duncan... Duncan couldn't play with Rodman, can you imagine KG and Rodman...?

 

[Nosferatu]

Kyrie can not even come close to holding Miller in the post either... I think Miller brings more to the table than Kyrie... Miller in a close 1...

Calderon is not better than Crawford... Especially in the rolls we have them in...

I guess the problem here is I'm setting a team up that would at together... Each player complimenting the others... Which is why I stated earlier to look at it as a whole... Add that to I don't agree with some of your thoughts but that is subjective... Richard Jefferson keeps getting bounced around because he CAN'T shoot the 3 and his hops have gone... They left him in NJ and even the Spurs couldn't get much out of him... Also the 6th men awards I brought up was proof that although these players were starters and excelled they were also productive off the bench... Again, has more to the construction of the team than who has better rosters... I realize this is all imaginary, but if we are to imagine a roster shouldn't we imagine how they would play together...? I don't feel team D is constructed better to plaY together beside the difference of opinion on individual talent... In all this is probably falling on dead ears as I believe this is the number of votes all the games have ended with...

Kyrie would just run circles around Miller.

Calderon is better, if you are counting on Crawford to lead your team in scoring maybe you have a point but Calderon would serve as another great passer on the floor with finishers who would knock down a 3 from time to time...

I agree about Jefferson but you are kind of forgetting all players are in their prime. Nets Jefferson was a pretty damn good player.

All that sixth man stuff shows is that you drafted backups!

I also don't think you could be more wrong than to suggest your team would play well together and mine wouldn't...

 

[broncosmitty]

I can't believe Kyrie isn't someone's starting point gaurd.

 

[Nosferatu]

I can't believe Kyrie isn't someone's starting point gaurd.

Anyone wanna trade?

 

[wlk3]

Kyrie would just run circles around Miller.

Calderon is better, if you are counting on Crawford to lead your team in scoring maybe you have a point but Calderon would serve as another great passer on the floor with finishers who would knock down a 3 from time to time...

I agree about Jefferson but you are kind of forgetting all players are in their prime. Nets Jefferson was a pretty damn good player.

All that sixth man stuff shows is that you drafted backups!

I also don't think you could be more wrong than to suggest your team would play well together and mine wouldn't...

Even at this age, Miller is solid defender... There are only 2 games where the minutes are close and even then we can't say who guarded whom, but the first 1 was extremely close numbers wise minutes were 32 vs 24 the second was much different in favor of Kyrie but the minutes are 38 vs 22... Miller was well out of his prime by this time as well... But I'll concede Kyrie over Miller, this isn't over a career but prime, and as of now Kyrie has better individual stats and he just started out... But Miller is the much STRONGER leader... We will see how Kyrie handles being the second and maybe 3rd guy if Love comes over...

I'm not forgetting Jefferson, you stated he was a better 3pt shooter and he's not... He was a great wing player because Kidd pushed the ball and they were anchored by Kenyon Martin so he could take off on the break early and Kidd found him for lobs and such... Parker and Kyrie are not like Kidd in fact Parker/Jefferson didn't work as we have evidence, the Spurs let him walk because he didn't fit... He'd play well with Calderon for sure...

Crawford is being asked to score... I have him paired with a pass first PG... To say I picked backups is a bit contradictory when you say something about forgetting how good a player is... The 6th man award was pointed out to show that even as a backup they came in and played well... Recall Iverson being asked to come off the bench...? It was so bad when he attempted a comeback and said he would come off the bench people didn't listen... He ruined the Pistons and Nuggets... But let's remember how good Lamar was in Miami before he was traded for Shaq... He was the main trade chip... Let's remember how great of a scorer Crawford is... Besides having the most 4pt plays in NBA history, he's scored 50 or more with 3 different teams, he can light it up and that's why he was picked... On 1 hand you argue Kyrie is better because scores more than Miller, then say Calderon is better because he does the "other" things better...

Finally I'm not suggesting your team wouldn't play well together, just not better than mine...

 

[Nosferatu]

On 1 hand you argue Kyrie is better because scores more than Miller, then say Calderon is better because he does the "other" things better

Show me where I said Kyrie was better because he scores more?

 

[wlk3]

On 1 hand you argue Kyrie is better because scores more than Miller, then say Calderon is better because he does the "other" things better

Show me where I said Kyrie was better because he scores more?

Well that's all he does better... What else is there...?

 

[Nosferatu]

Well that's all he does better... What else is there...?

Careful, you back peddle any quicker you will fall down!

 

[wlk3]

Careful, you back peddle any quicker you will fall down!

Hahaha... That's seriously all he does better which what I thought you were getting at... Kyrie would run circles around Miller...? I assumed you meant offensively... That would be a very awkward defense to run...

 

[Nosferatu]

We need more votes!