Cousins Doesn't Deserve A Longterm Contract

[Sharkinva]

Bit of a fallacy far as Dallas' defense goes. The best thing about the Dallas defense was the Dallas offensive line. The best offesnes they faced were the Steelers who scored 30 points on em. The Packers twice and they scored 34 and 27 on them and us. We scored 23 (should been significantly more imo) and 26 and that should been more as well imo.

Would you not give up the President Elects Left Nut, and the out going guys right pinky toe for a defense that averaged less than 20 points per game given up?? Where they the Ditka Bears, or the Purple People Eaters?? Nope.

But flip side is, I dont care who we bring in at DC, its going to take minimum this year and next year to egt the defense from

Fuck we suck to middle of the pack.

 

[Breed]

Since 1966 there have been 749 QBs drafted. 1 out of every 53.5 drafted QBs.

/Begin Sarcasm

Well fuck sign me up!!

/End Sarcasm

~~ Disclaimer~~ I was not particularly being sarcastic to you Breed, Just the notion that we have a good shot at doing what Dallas did with a Rookie QB.

I just happened to come across the article on Prescott and than saw dad's question. And my post lowered the bar to 9 wins cuz that's what thje article had listed.

I'm happy to say I've never floated that notion. Aside from the Colts and they were touched ny the football gods its eems. The Cowboys have been very fortunate in their QB situation.

There are a lot more teams like the Redskins and Browns than the Colts and Cowboys when it comes to finding/lucking up on good QBs. Hell. even the Skins kinda lucked up far as Cuz is concerned. As while I know people love to super glue themselves to Shanny's nuts when it comes to drafting Cousins. Aside from that and acquiring a handful of other palyers. Shanny was a totally shitty HC in every other way.

 

[Breed]

Would you not give up the President Elects Left Nut, and the out going guys right pinky toe for a defense that averaged less than 20 points per game given up?? Where they the Ditka Bears, or the Purple People Eaters?? Nope.

But flip side is, I dont care who we bring in at DC, its going to take minimum this year and next year to egt the defense from

Fuck we suck to middle of the pack.

Dallas' defensive rankings arn't accurate in terms of how good they actiually are. Look at the 3 good offensive teams they played. Every game was a high scoring down to the wire shoot-out. And in some way or another all 3 teams hung a lotta yards on Dallas as well.

Or put another way.............I'd rather have the Dallas offensive line much more than their defense.

 

[Breed]

Sure it will take a couple seasons most likely to square away the defense. But if we're smart and a little lucky. We become a more balanced offensive team run/pass-wise and fix the red zone issues. On defense we get better in two areas, tackling and not allowing 3rd dn conv. I bet that'll be good for 2 maybe 3 extra wins.

 

[Sharkinva]

Dallas' defensive rankings arn't accurate in terms of how good they actiually are. Look at the 3 good offensive teams they played. Every game was a high scoring down to the wire shoot-out. And in some way or another all 3 teams hung a lotta yards on Dallas as well.

Or put another way.............I'd rather have the Dallas offensive line much more than their defense.

Totally agree on the line thing. But all things being equal, and knowing we arent going to commit 2 more first rounders to the O-line any time soon, I would be fine with a defense that gave up say 6 points per game on average less than we did this year.

 

[Sharkinva]

Sure it will take a couple seasons most likely to square away the defense. But if we're smart and a little lucky. We become a more balanced offensive team run/pass-wise and fix the red zone issues. On defense we get better in two areas, tackling and not allowing 3rd dn conv. I bet that'll be good for 2 maybe 3 extra wins.

Again I agree. But I dont think we really go full bore to fix the defense if we are still in the must find QB mode. I will be the first to say, Kirk aint elite. But he is good enough that barring a total collapse on his part, we would be able to take QB off the list for 2-3 seasons which would allow us to concentrate on building the defense, and the run game for that matter.

Flip side is, it would likely take us out of the market for chasing an elite QB... at least for the next 2-3 seasons. Some how Im ok with that though.

 

[Breed]

Yeah, I agree. Signing Kirk now takes looking for a QB off that table for the next 3-5 years.......unless we somehow luck up on Darnold. I think he's gonna be the next big thing far as NFL QBs. But we can stay firmly in the area of respectable with Kirk and strive for some more with spme good drafts and wise FA p/ups.

 

[Breed]

For you Shark. Heh.

Should the Redskins let Cousins go for extra draft picks this year and next?

• 46%
  Absolutely
  (232 votes)
  
  
• 47%
  Not a chance
  (236 votes)
  
  
• 8%
  For a shot at Sam Darnold I'd "move" the whole team!
  (38 votes)
  

506 votes total

 

[Sharkinva]

Yeah, I agree. Signing Kirk now takes looking for a QB off that table for the next 3-5 years.......unless we somehow luck up on Darnold. I think he's gonna be the next big thing far as NFL QBs. But we can stay firmly in the area of respectable with Kirk and strive for some more with spme good drafts and wise FA p/ups.

For us to luck up, I think he would have to suffer an impacted tooth that kept him completely out of the game for all of 2017 and then still declare for the draft. It would also require him to walk into every team interview at the combine buck ass naked with a sign that says IM here to fuck the organization.. bend ova bitches. And even then Some one drafting high than us would laugh it off and draft him in the first round.

 

[Sharkinva]

For you Shark. Heh.

Should the Redskins let Cousins go for extra draft picks this year and next?

• 46%
  Absolutely
  (232 votes)
  
  
• 47%
  Not a chance
  (236 votes)
  
  
• 8%
  For a shot at Sam Darnold I'd "move" the whole team!
  (38 votes)

506 votes total

LOL.... Like i said, I fully believe 1/4th of the fanbase simply wants Cousins gone because they are still but hurt over Kirk becoming the starter in the first place.

2/4ths is of the opinion that shit has been entirely too smooth and we NEED a little excitement in the form of a big signing or move.

And then there is the 1/4th that says... we should resign Kirk long term and show him the love and respect he apparently wants... unless of course Kyle calls and offers us deal we cant refuse. To me that starts at two firsts and a 3rd. Not because I think Kirk is worth that kind of haul, but because i think we are going to need that, plus another pick to make the Darnold move.

 

[Skin'EmAll]

Again, there is the skewed thinking.

Dallas did what they did sure by bringing in a rookie QB and RB.

What you miss is that Dallas also did it with e defensive scheme that they have been working on for FOUR years and finally got it right. You do realize Dallas had a top five over all defense, and top TWO in rushing defense?? Not to take away from what Dak and Zeke did, but give Dallas our defense and thats a 6-8 win team.

I apologize -- "mirroring" was exclusively in reference to the Dallas offense.
Watson, Tribusky, and Kizer -- who all have higher grades than Prescott, could likely duplicate his success.
Hear me out..."IF" we can get Leary, Zietler, etc. and solid Center play...then we basically have Beasley, Witten, and Dez on offense. Crowder, Reed, and Djax(the deep threat) are in respects equivalent talent wise as a unit.
...obviously Kelley is no Zeke...I won't even go there.

I'm sorry man, the Dallas defense still has looked vunerable, even its STAR has been disrespected.
Lee was not even named into the pro bowl, however some unsung heroes were in the right place at the right time this season. Its fair to expect some regression from Dallas, and NYG...while PHI and WASH should improve.
Teams have always played Dallas from a pocket QB perspective, we will see how he does next year with all the film. Also, its amazing Dak remained healthy, he could miss a few games next year.
NYG appear to be on the verge of an internal meltdown. Also, we've seen what happens to Eli when you get a fingernail on him.

 

[skinsdad62]

I apologize -- "mirroring" was exclusively in reference to the Dallas offense.
Watson, Tribusky, and Kizer -- who all have higher grades than Prescott, could likely duplicate his success.
Hear me out..."IF" we can get Leary, Zietler, etc. and solid Center play...then we basically have Beasley, Witten, and Dez on offense. Crowder, Reed, and Djax(the deep threat) are in respects equivalent talent wise as a unit.
...obviously Kelley is no Zeke...I won't even go there.

I'm sorry man, the Dallas defense still has looked vunerable, even its STAR has been disrespected.
Lee was not even named into the pro bowl, however some unsung heroes were in the right place at the right time this season. Its fair to expect some regression from Dallas, and NYG...while PHI and WASH should improve.
Teams have always played Dallas from a pocket QB perspective, we will see how he does next year with all the film. Also, its amazing Dak remained healthy, he could miss a few games next year.
NYG appear to be on the verge of an internal meltdown. Also, we've seen what happens to Eli when you get a fingernail on him.

lee was named all pro so there you have that . look we can hace a solid LG and sign KC we can sign dljax PG baker and davis money isnt the issue

 

[Sharkinva]

I apologize -- "mirroring" was exclusively in reference to the Dallas offense.
Watson, Tribusky, and Kizer -- who all have higher grades than Prescott, could likely duplicate his success.
Hear me out..."IF" we can get Leary, Zietler, etc. and solid Center play...then we basically have Beasley, Witten, and Dez on offense. Crowder, Reed, and Djax(the deep threat) are in respects equivalent talent wise as a unit.
...obviously Kelley is no Zeke...I won't even go there.

I'm sorry man, the Dallas defense still has looked vunerable, even its STAR has been disrespected.
Lee was not even named into the pro bowl, however some unsung heroes were in the right place at the right time this season. Its fair to expect some regression from Dallas, and NYG...while PHI and WASH should improve.
Teams have always played Dallas from a pocket QB perspective, we will see how he does next year with all the film. Also, its amazing Dak remained healthy, he could miss a few games next year.
NYG appear to be on the verge of an internal meltdown. Also, we've seen what happens to Eli when you get a fingernail on him.

Dude... i get it that it would be much more exciting to deal Kirk, make the sexy draft pick and get the sweet new rookie QB.

Im just saying... we been chasing elite at QB for 22 years. Why not hang onto good and build the team around him. Will Kirk be cheap?? Probably not. But after 22 years to finally find a Good, not elite, but good QB... to throw that away because we were too stupid to sign him long term last year and now bitch about how much he will cost.

Thats like saying well I could have bought Microsoft stock when it was $25 a share, but I waited, and now Im pissed... so fuck it, I will just buy Enron stock instead and hope it works out.

 

[Skin'EmAll]

money isnt the issue

Exactly!!!

Dude... i get it that it would be much more exciting to deal Kirk, make the sexy draft pick and get the sweet new rookie QB.

Im just saying... we been chasing elite at QB for 22 years. Why not hang onto good and build the team around him. Will Kirk be cheap?? Probably not. But after 22 years to finally find a Good, not elite, but good QB... to throw that away because we were too stupid to sign him long term last year and now bitch about how much he will cost.

Based on those redskins wiki pages, I HOPE that wasn't Casserly drafting WRs back-to-back in the top 10.
passing on amazing talents for need. We have established money isn't the issue, BUT obviously the "face" is.
They don't believe in Kirk, and despite his leverage...they now can get something GOOD for him.
Scotty is supposed to be a personnel guru, just like Gruden is a QB guru. So why, put money into someone you
don't like who is a poor man's Matt Ryan? Matt Ryan...despite the talent he's had around him, is JUST now...being put into ELITE conversation. You really wanna make someone the HIGHEST paid QB in the league, when it will be the defense who will possibly get us to the superbowl? Granted Seattle and Green Bay are probably not as dominate in 3 years...but who knows what NFC team will emerge???

 

[Sharkinva]

Based on those redskins wiki pages, I HOPE that wasn't Casserly drafting WRs back-to-back in the top 10.
passing on amazing talents for need. We have established money isn't the issue, BUT obviously the "face" is.
They don't believe in Kirk, and despite his leverage...they now can get something GOOD for him.
Scotty is supposed to be a personnel guru, just like Gruden is a QB guru. So why, put money into someone you
don't like who is a poor man's Matt Ryan? Matt Ryan...despite the talent he's had around him, is JUST now...being put into ELITE conversation. You really wanna make someone the HIGHEST paid QB in the league, when it will be the defense who will possibly get us to the superbowl? Granted Seattle and Green Bay are probably not as dominate in 3 years...but who knows what NFC team will emerge???

Umm hell yes. For three reasons.

One I could care less how many Subways Commercials or sports center highlights my Qb gets if its better for the team over all for him to take another three years to become elite.

Two.... massive numbers of high draft picks is no guarantee the team will get better.. Ask the Rams about that.

Three...In two years, what ever we pay Cousins will be considered a bargain. Actually considering Stafford will be up for HIS new contract next year, Cousins deal will be obsolete within a year.


Bottom line is, if this is more about how sexy the face of the franchise is, over the best way to move forward.. we are already fucked. Because thinking like that is what brought us Griffin, McNabb and Schuler. Not to mention ditching Brad Johnson for Jeff George.

 

[Sharkinva]

@Skin'EmAll


Would you take a poor mans Mat Ryan over a poor mans RG3 at a lower price when it also means you will likely end up firing the coach to boot. Because thats what you are suggesting. Get a sexy face of the franchise that doesnt fit the current offense at the cost of the coach with no idea who we might bring in.

I know people will say, well in that case Beville would be the obvious choice, But go to think if we are having issues finding a DC now, a new head coach might not be as easy as 123.

 

[Skin'EmAll]

Umm hell yes. For three reasons.

One I could care less how many Subways Commercials or sports center highlights my Qb gets if its better for the team over all for him to take another three years to become elite.

Two.... massive numbers of high draft picks is no guarantee the team will get better.. Ask the Rams about that.

Three...In two years, what ever we pay Cousins will be considered a bargain. Actually considering Stafford will be up for HIS new contract next year, Cousins deal will be obsolete within a year.


Bottom line is, if this is more about how sexy the face of the franchise is, over the best way to move forward.. we are already fucked. Because thinking like that is what brought us Griffin, McNabb and Schuler. Not to mention ditching Brad Johnson for Jeff George.

Daniel scares me, his patience looks like it has an eating disorder. His actions show he doesn't completely trust Cousins, and as you mentioned the organization has already proven they aren't great with lots of picks, especially 1st rounders. If the 'Skins keep Cousins, the one thing I believe that is in our favor is a power shift.
I think the NFC EAST and Tampa are going to be major threats within 3 years, while the major forces will have to rebuild. I guess now we have to wait? I think you mentioned SF can't do anything with Cousins until March if a deal was agreed upon. And that's if Wash let him go

 

[Skin'EmAll]

@Skin'EmAll


Would you take a poor mans Mat Ryan over a poor mans RG3 at a lower price when it also means you will likely end up firing the coach to boot. Because thats what you are suggesting. Get a sexy face of the franchise that doesnt fit the current offense at the cost of the coach with no idea who we might bring in.

I know people will say, well in that case Beville would be the obvious choice, But go to think if we are having issues finding a DC now, a new head coach might not be as easy as 123.

No, you are right. I wasn't even looking at half of the big picture, BUT i'm more so taking an Alex Smith over a Poor mans Matt Ryan for a lower price, or even an Andy Dalton. The coach still gets fired but the foundation is solid for Beville to come in and win. I'm not sure poor man's RG3 is fair...to become Sean Taylor level and then immediately hit Heath Shueler level...i dunno.

 

[Sharkinva]

No, you are right. I wasn't even looking at half of the big picture, BUT i'm more so taking an Alex Smith over a Poor mans Matt Ryan for a lower price, or even an Andy Dalton. The coach still gets fired but the foundation is solid for Beville to come in and win. I'm not sure poor man's RG3 is fair...to become Sean Taylor level and then immediately hit Heath Shueler level...i dunno.

If every uber touted draft pick panned out, Jamarcus Russell would still be in Oakland, Johnny Manziel would still be in Cleveland... and we wouldnt be talking about IF Kirk is worth the money because half redskins nation would be selling their houses and moving into homeless camps to give to the go fund me account the team would have needed to setup to pay RG3.


But let me ask you, if RG3 had had even close to the last two seasons Kirk had, would this even be an issue to pay HIM that kind of money? Sexy over substance is never a good tactic when building a team.

 

[Breed]

Totally agree on the line thing. But all things being equal, and knowing we arent going to commit 2 more first rounders to the O-line any time soon, I would be fine with a defense that gave up say 6 points per game on average less than we did this year.

Sure, me to. That would've made the Skins the 3rd best defense in the NFL pt allowed-wise surrendering 17.9 a pop. While I've seen peeps lament that we need more speed on defense, and I'm not against that in anyway. I think getting stronger and more physical is a greater need. The Skins have had some bad defenses since the days of Gibbs 1.0, bad tackling, taking terrible angles, pretty much the works. But I can't recall a Skins defense that was dragged, carried, ran through, ran over as much after making initial contact as this one. And sometimes it would be multiple guys it was happening to on the same play. I don't think we had a huge issue with not being fast enough, but not being physical or strong enough. That problem reared its head every week.