Bill Simmons trade idea

[flyerhawk]

When Simmons dominates a game as consistently as Giannis, get back to me.

Are you just arguing to argue now? Ben Simmons is in his 2 year of playing basketball. Giannis is in his 6th.

A lot of it would depend on if the entire front office is crashing off a coke binge on the day the trade is offered. Nobody on earth turns that deal down.

Cool story.

And Simmons had a major injury and has shown little interest in developing a shot from range.

You're right. He's probably not all that desirable a target. And he's probably developed as far as he is going to now that he has 100 games under his belt.

 

[flyerhawk]

How did I change my question to a declarative statement? I was simply asking for further clarification. You don't have to get all defensive about it, lol.

As I said, I'm as big of a fan of Simmons as any one around here, Sixer fans aside. I just don't know what his top tier level game is.

I apologize if I misinferred what you were saying. Sometimes I can conflate the tone and tenor different posters in a thread.

Simmons, IMO, is more of a facilitator, with scoring as his bonus. Giannis is more of a downhill scorer, with the ability to create. There's a difference. I don't know if you can ask a guy like Simmons to completely change his game. It's like the argument that's been around for years about Lebron. Just because he possesses the ability to get to the rim every time, it's not in his nature to do so as a basketball player.

I'm not sure he has to completely change his game. He needs to improve in 3 key areas.

1. Mid-range shooting
2. Free throw shooting
3. Consistent aggression.

If he can improve those 3 things he is going to be a dominant player.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Are you just arguing to argue now? Ben Simmons is in his 2 year of playing basketball. Giannis is in his 6th.

I'm not the one who brought up Giannis lol

Cool story.

I'm stating that I think 31 out of 31 NBA teams would make that trade. Disagree if you like, but if you want to be a troll go find someone else.

You're right. He's probably not all that desirable a target. And he's probably developed as far as he is going to now that he has 100 games under his belt.

Because that's obviously what I said.

 

[flyerhawk]

I'm not the one who brought up Giannis lol

You make a claim that Simmons game can't work in the modern NBA. I provide an example of a player quite similar to Simmons and rather than simply concede that Simmons game COULD work you go with "When Simmons dominates like Giannis, get back to me". Not only does that miss my original point completely but it ignores where the two players are in their careers.

I'm stating that I think 31 out of 31 NBA teams would make that trade. Disagree if you like, but if you want to be a troll go find someone else.

I'm trolling my own thread? Cool story, bro. So every team in the league would just say yes to trading Simmons for AD right now? Doesn't matter than AD is a free agent next year?

Obviously AD is a better player than Simmons right now. And he very well will have a far better career. But this isn't NBA2K and trades aren't always as clearly beneficial to teams as you would think on paper.

Because that's obviously what I said.

You seem to prefer hyperbole.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

You make a claim that Simmons game can't work in the modern NBA. I provide an example of a player quite similar to Simmons and rather than simply concede that Simmons game COULD work you go with "When Simmons dominates like Giannis, get back to me". Not only does that miss my original point completely but it ignores where the two players are in their careers.

JFC this is stupid. You brought up Giannis. I noted that it is a poor comparison and now you're shitting on me for telling you that it's a poor comparison because you know it's a poor comparison but you brought it up anyway. Okay?

I'm trolling my own thread? Cool story, bro. So every team in the league would just say yes to trading Simmons for AD right now? Doesn't matter than AD is a free agent next year?

Literally just did it again. Figure it out.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Simmons is a really intriguing offer for AD, but there are a lot of good deals out there to be made. What if the Trailblazers offered a deal centered around McCollum and Nurkic. Pairing AD with Dame would be really amazing. Pelicans would get back an all-star caliber guard with a quality starting center in the NBA. A lineup of Jrue, McCollum, Mirotic, Randle and Nurkic would be at least fun to watch.

Celtics could put together a nice package as well rather easily. What if the Knicks offered Porzingas, THJ and picks, in an attempt to further lure KD to them in the off-season?

Or what if the Warriors gave them Iguodala and Livingston. That'd be a hard offer to pass up. (kidding, obv).

Lots of options if the Pelicans decide they want to deal AD.

You forgot the best offer...

Love, Osman and a 2020 1st rounder for AD

 

[YourFriendGannon]

You forgot the best offer...

Love, Osman and a 2020 1st rounder for AD

Lineups featuring Love and Mirotic together would baffle the hell out of defenses for sure.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Lineups featuring Love and Mirotic together would baffle the hell out of defenses for sure.

Easy fix throw him in the deal and Cleveland will throw back Burks or J.R.

 

[YourFriendGannon]

It always feels weird to me to think that New Orleans is where J.R. got his start...

 

[flyerhawk]

JFC this is stupid. You brought up Giannis. I noted that it is a poor comparison and now you're shitting on me for telling you that it's a poor comparison because you know it's a poor comparison but you brought it up anyway. Okay?



Literally just did it again. Figure it out.

Why is Simmons a poor comparison to Giannis? How many games did Giannis dominate in his SECOND SEASON?

 

[tlance]

Just being completely objective here about Simmons (and I'm a big fan btw) what is Simmons upside? He's a guard that can't shoot in a league that has shifted away from post play and is now very 3-heavy. At a certain point if Simmons can't ever be a threat from more than 6 feet out, his value diminishes GREATLY. He still holds tremendous trade value now because of his youth, but for sake of argument, let's say he never develops a jump shot. He's basically like a tall version of Rubio and/or a Lamar Odom type player.

McCollum is 27, but Jrue Holiday is 28 as well. The Pelicans don't exactly have a wealth of young talent, but they'd have two dynamic guards in their prime, a really good big in Nurkic and after that they'd have pretty much open cap space. They could go after another Max player to play with those guys. If say they traded McCollum and Nurkic for AD and Solomon Hill, not including Randle's option the Pelicans would have 79M on the books. They'd have just below a max slot to go after another free agent.

I just don't see how Holiday and Simmons work as a back-court. The Pelicans have Holiday signed through 2022. They have to factor that in to any deal they make.

Everything you say here is accurate.

However, how many players in the league today currently have more straight up trade value than Ben Simmons? You could make a case for Doncic or any superstar signed for more than the next 2 years, but there aren't many out there.

We are talking about an allstar caliber player with upside beyond that on a rookie contract for the next 2 under team control for the next 6.

Once you factor in contract and # of years, Simmons has more trade value than Anthony Davis. Now, a package of Tatum ++ might be preferable for the Pelicans, but aside from Boston I don't think there is another team out there that could get close to a Philly offer if they had were actually willing to include Simmons.

 

[SideSwipe52]

If New Orleans would make that trade, they should request for Simmons, 3 1st round picks, TJ McConnell and Markelle Futz.

 

[CitySushi]

If New Orleans would make that trade, they should request for Simmons, 3 1st round picks, TJ McConnell and Markelle Futz.

Not sure if that would be enough. Might need to throw Embiid in there too.

 

[tlance]

Not sure if that would be enough. Might need to throw Embiid in there too.

Seriously though,

What is worth more?

5.5 years of Simmons, or 1.5 years of AD?

For a contender, the answer is AD. For a non-contender, it is Simmons all day every day.

 

[Gman]

Not sure if that would be enough. Might need to throw Embiid in there too.

And a philly cheese steak party platter.

 

[CitySushi]

Seriously though,

What is worth more?

5.5 years of Simmons, or 1.5 years of AD?

For a contender, the answer is AD. For a non-contender, it is Simmons all day every day.

Absolutely. I wasn't contending that Simmons is not a good player or worthy enough to start a deal around. My first post just stated that there are other deals that might be attractive based upon what the Pelicans wanted to do.

I wasn't contending that a deal of McCollum and Nurkic is necessarily BETTER than a deal centered around Simmons. I just stated that it was one that was an intriguing option because they would get a top 10 SG, a top 12-15 NBA center, both in their primes, with a lot of cap space to go after a potential max free agent. Again that's not necessarily better than Simmons, but just a different route.

The post you quoted was just my logic based around what the Pelicans could view as attractive.

With respects to my critiques of Simmons, what I was mainly illustrating is that because of his short-comings so far, you would need a complete roster over-haul because I don't believe he fits with Jrue. Maybe that's a bridge you cross down the line and that's fine. I was just simply pointing it out.

So, all due respect, you're arguing a point with me that doesn't exist. I'm not devaluing Simmons based on outside circumstances. I was purely talking a basketball perspective that evolved from first saying that there could be other attractive offers, then escalated from there based on me and @flyerhawk 's discussion of Simmons peak. It at no point ever had to do anything with tangible trade value.

 

[LUNCHBOX]

Simmons was talking to Kevin O'Connor about hoops and offered this trade idea.

Anthony Davis for Ben Simmons. Perhaps other pieces would need to be involved.

It is an intriguing option for both teams. I doubt either team would actually do it but there are reasons why it would work for both teams.

Too close in skill set to Embiid. Ben just needs to learn to shoot from the perimeter.

 

[shopson67]

Simmons was talking to Kevin O'Connor about hoops and offered this trade idea.

Anthony Davis for Ben Simmons. Perhaps other pieces would need to be involved.

It is an intriguing option for both teams. I doubt either team would actually do it but there are reasons why it would work for both teams.

How is this intriguing for the Sixers? They lose their "PG" and add another PF/C.

There is also an imbalance of a $14M+ in salaries to make it work under the cap. Nobody wants Chandler, Reddick, or Fultz (or even Butler, since he has an opt out) to balance the deal further as they will be of little to no help moving forward in New Orleans. So, not intriguing for the Pelicans either. Besides, who trades a top 5 NBA player for someone who can't/won't shoot?

 

[flyerhawk]

How is this intriguing for the Sixers? They lose their "PG" and add another PF/C.

There is also an imbalance of a $14M+ in salaries to make it work under the cap. Nobody wants Chandler, Reddick, or Fultz (or even Butler, since he has an opt out) to balance the deal further as they will be of little to no help moving forward in New Orleans. So, not intriguing for the Pelicans either. Besides, who trades a top 5 NBA player for someone who can't/won't shoot?

You managed to argue that the trade is bad for both sides. Well done.

As I've said, I don't know if the Sixers would make that deal. But Embiid and Davis and Butler would be a pretty interesting mix.

Simmons may not shoot from the outside but he still puts up impressive numbers.

 

[trojanfan12]

You managed to argue that the trade is bad for both sides. Well done.

As I've said, I don't know if the Sixers would make that deal. But Embiid and Davis and Butler would be a pretty interesting mix.

Simmons may not shoot from the outside but he still puts up impressive numbers.

Not sure that trade would really help Philly. But, it would be interesting. Imo, the Sixers just need to stay the course and develop what they have.

Simmons seems like the right guy to run their stuff too.