Is LeBron James better than Michael Jordan?

[msgkings322]

IMO, people are too hung up on the fact that he's 3-5 in the Finals....and most would assume he's on his way to being 3-6.

But, the fact getting to 8 straight Finals is quite an achievement in it self.

Naw dog, it's way better to be 2-2 in the Finals than 3-6. Losing record in the Finals is for scrubs like Wilt Chamberlain.

 

[Beengay fudgepackers]

Lebron was almost to great in his first 2 seasons. Cleveland got the #1 pick because they were god awful in 2002-2003. They had the worst record in the league in 2002-2003 with 17 wins. Lebron more than DOUBLED their win total in his rookie season, so because of that they picked 10th in 2004, the FO took Luke Jackson, who was out of the league in 4 years(bust). Cleveland didn't have a 1st rounder in the 2005 draft because of a trade that happened in 1997. By the time the 2006 draft rolled around, Cleveland was drafting late in the 1st round.

I mean for real, these were the guys the Cavs drafted after Lebron in the 1st round:

2004 - Luke Jackson
2006 - Shannon Brown
2008 - JJ Hickson
2009 - Christian Eyenga

MJ was fortunate enough that the Bulls FO was great. The Bulls were able to trade for Scottie Pippen and draft Horace Grant 10th overall in 1987. Giving MJ a future HOF and future All-Star. So by the end of his 3rd season the Bulls got Pippen and Grant. By the end of Lebron's 3rd season they got Shannon Brown.

All I’m saying is Lebron got to choose his team. Jordan had to make it work with the players provided. Regardless of talent, Lebron has a team built around him to maximize his stats.

 

[Wamu]

I get all that. The fact that Jordan did it with 1 team and Lebron picked his surrounding (both through FA and then he also had a ton of say on trades and signings with each team) is why I stick with Jordan here. Lebron helped build this team so that he could play the way he plays.

You don't think behind closed doors MJ didn't have a say about the roster? You really think the Bulls would have picked up Rodman w/o talking to MJ first? All great players have a say about who their teammates will be.

 

[knowyourenemy]

Is this Philly's free agency pitch to LeBron?

Nah. If it were, I would have included Dario somehow.

 

[ericd7633]

All I’m saying is Lebron got to choose his team. Jordan had to make it work with the players provided. Regardless of talent, Lebron has a team built around him to maximize his stats.

Yeah Lebron was just dying to play with Luke Jackson, Shannon Brown, JJ Hickson and Christian Eyenga the first time around in Cleveland. The first 7 years in Cleveland the FO gave him shit to work with. Imagine a 21 year old Lebron James getting to team up with a future HOF and and All-Star like MJ did in his 3rd season? I mean for real, MJ leaves after 1993, they go from 57 wins to 55 wins without him, Lebron leaves and the Cavs go from 61 wins to 19 wins. That should tell you tell you something about the roster construction.

 

[DJ]

Yeah Lebron was just dying to play with Luke Jackson, Shannon Brown, JJ Hickson and Christian Eyenga the first time around in Cleveland. The first 7 years in Cleveland the FO gave him shit to work with. Imagine a 21 year old Lebron James getting to team up with a future HOF and and All-Star like MJ did in his 3rd season? I mean for real, MJ leaves after 1993, they go from 57 wins to 55 wins without him, Lebron leaves and the Cavs go from 61 wins to 19 wins. That should tell you tell you something about the roster construction.

They were expected to fold when he went off to play baseball and did a lot better than many people expected them to do. They almost made the ECF without him. That's a huge achievement without the best player of all time.

 

[DJ]

And MJ didn't drag that Wizards team into the playoffs.....meanwhile James has dragged a team of lesser talent to the NBA Finals.

And people will say he was 38 and 39. Well, he went off to play baseball for a season and had retired for 3, so essentially he had played in fewer games than James has.

It can't be argued James has more miles on him than MJ did at 38 and 39. James is in his 15th season and MJ played a total of 15 seasons.

 

[SteelersPride]

Yes

 

[Ickey Shuffle]

Yep. He just sealed the debate.

 

[MikeMed]

If Lebron matches M.J's 6 chips then his finals losses will count as positives not negatives....But not before he hits 6

 

[Black Adam]

If Lebron matches M.J's 6 chips then his finals losses will count as positives not negatives....But not before he hits 6

father time'll catch him before THAT happens...

 

[DorianRo]

See that is the thing.

People are too fixated on the team result. It isn't the Cavs beating Boston that is impressive. It is LeBron's performance in those games that elevated his team and gave them a chance.

He can average 45-12-10 against golden state and the Cavs might still get swept.

And it will be the same narrative. The objective people will be talking about how great LeBron is and the haters will say the loss somehow diminishes his greatness. It does no such thing. Just like the win last night isn't the reason people are taking about him alongside Mike.

How is beating Boston missing their two best players impressive anyways? While they go 7-50 from 3. "Oh gotta give him all time great status. He beat a team he was SUPPOSED TO. This series shouldn't even have gone 7.


If Lebron can beat the Warriors with Durant this year then we can revisit this thread.

 

[DJ]

How is beating Boston missing their two best players impressive anyways? While they go 7-50 from 3. "Oh gotta give him all time great status. He beat a team he was SUPPOSED TO. This series shouldn't even have gone 7.


If Lebron can beat the Warriors with Durant this year then we can revisit this thread.

7 of 39

 

[DJ]

All I’m saying is Lebron got to choose his team. Jordan had to make it work with the players provided. Regardless of talent, Lebron has a team built around him to maximize his stats.

MJ didn't do shit with the Bulls till Jackson replaced Collins and they drafted Scottie Pippen.

 

[DJ]

"MJ played incredible D. Lebron barely makes it to that side of the court"




You didn't need to say you're more of a casual fan. Your incorrect statement about LeBron's D proves you don't watch very often.

MJ was great on defense, but he was limited to defending a few positions.

James could guard 4, maybe even 5 in a small ball lineup.

 

[DJ]

I feel like I'm back on SI's FN, throwing down and arguing my ass off.

 

[Wamu]

MJ was great on defense, but he was limited to defending a few positions.

James could guard 4, maybe even 5 in a small ball lineup.

Exactly. And you don't have to like a player to acknowledge how great someone is. For me a perfect example is Tom Brady. Can't stand that meeeechegan fuck. But I appreciate how great of a player he is.

 

[Battlelyon]

 

[gohusk]

MJ was great on defense, but he was limited to defending a few positions.

James could guard 4, maybe even 5 in a small ball lineup.

He ain't guarding the quicker PG's in this league. Remember the feel good "Oh, yeah, James shut down Rose" when it was a team effort and then got roasted by Jason Terry on multiple occasions when he was put on an island with him in the finals? He plays great help defense and great transition defense but he is nowhere near the square-up defender that Jordan was.

 

[DJ]

Exactly. And you don't have to like a player to acknowledge how great someone is. For me a perfect example is Tom Brady. Can't stand that meeeechegan fuck. But I appreciate how great of a player he is.

I'm a diehard Lakers fan and respect how hard the undermanned Celtics fought and competed.

And hate James (much like I hated MJ) but respect the player.