The First 2018 College Football Playoff

[Mistaken4193]

When you look at the selection process since the inception of the play offs. The only thing that is clear is the committee doesn't actually have a criteria. We've already seen TCU and Baylor left out of the play offs. Based on not having a conference champion or playing a CCG. Penn State being left out despite winning the head to head and conference in favor of Ohio State. Ohio State being left out despite having the same win total,a conference championship and a stronger schedule over Alabama who finished 3rd in their conference. The current system resembles the blueprint for marketing more than football. If the NCAA actually wants a true champion they're going to have to reduce the human influence and the game played off the field.And provide a system that relies more on the game played on the field

I agree with you about PSU getting left out in favor of Ohio State was wrong because PSU beat them on the field.


But last year they got it right. Bama didnt deserve the 4th spot but neither did anyone else, so we WERE THE TALLEST MIDGET, CLARK!!!! We ended up proving them right.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

How are people really this clueless? I can't understand how it is even possible.

There is no individual decision made by the playoff committee that says x can never be used again or only y is used.

It is a clear overreaction to even suggest it. And that's if you aren't simply functionally retarded.

No, the committee did NOT say conf champs means nothing. They said it doesn't mean everything. That's entirely different. They didn't say go make a crap schedule and you are in. They said don't get blown out by shit teams and have that stain on your record when everything else is similar between you and another team.

If any of you actually honestly believe that CCG are no longer factored in at all or have any impact at all seriously go have a brain scan. It has to be cancer.

Seriously.

Committee
TCU/ Baylor non conference champions
Penn State Conference Champions
Ohio State Conferemce Champions

All left out while changing criteria each year. I gave you numbers and facts. I get you like semantics and debate. But I prefer concrete data to determine a champion. The current systems foundation is based heavily on human influence and opinions.

If you need to use a scenario ie “but team a lost to a P5 team or was blown out by a P5 team. When they could have watered down their schedule and played a meaningless game in its place. Where as playing an extra game and winning a conference championship holds more value. Based on a higher difficulty. Whensroerating two 11 win teams etc...

The 4 best teams in the current system is based on opinion not fact. Participation trophy

Unless you have factual data. They need a concrete system. If you would like you can continue debating opinion and semantics but that’s just meaningless....

 

[Mistaken4193]

I was never sold on LSU or Florida. As per LSU. I ralso wouldnt use LSU's defense as a gauge

QB A 330 yars Passing 3 TD’s 1 Int

QB B 225 yards passing 2 TD 1 Int

I won't name the QB's both stat lines were against the LSU defense.. But it is a great example of hype

5-4 won by 16 pts
6-3 won by 1 pt
6-3 won by 17 pts
5-4 won by 29pts
6-3 loss by 8pts
8-1 won by 20 pts
6-3 won by 16 pts
9-0 loss by 29pts



How can you look at that resume and not think they are legit??

 

[WizardHawk]

It’s pretty easy to understand their thought process and reasoning. I’ll sum it up real easy for you, don’t suck, win all your games, have some of those games against teams that also don’t suck, and boom, you get a chance to prove it.

Similarly

Lose some games, prove nothing by kicking th shit out of inferior competition all year, and oh shit, you’re not guaranteed shit outside of a typical bowl game when the season ends.

I can make it even more concise if it helps-they are looking for the 4 best teams, do the shit top 4 teams do and you’re in.

The only thing they really proved last year, and I linked articles for those lost with direct conversations with the committee about it, is if everything else is similar, really bad losses alone are enough to sink you.

They don't make decisions based on a formula which may deeply upset clark, but is really the only way it works. There is no one set of rules that covers every situation. Last years end proves that more than makes a case for breaking it and doing something dumb in its place. Ohio State got entirely embarrassed and paid a price for it. That's ALL we learned.

The committee has appeared to not worry about wins that weren't by comfortable enough margins, at least by fans standards. Beating a crappy team by 1 is still a win. They seem to take into account injuries, targeting suspensions, and other outside factors. It is something they have talked about. No formula or laid in stone set of rules can do that.

It would be stupid to create such a thing. The goal is to put the best 4 teams in the post season together. ANY other system you can think of would swap 'best' for 'most deserving' which is what Clarky is entirely obsessed with. If you win this game, you DESERVE to be in. He doesn't care at all about leaving really good teams out.

Why? Because Clark believes in the transitive property of football. He believes that football is played in a static universe and outcomes are all encompassing. If team A beats B and B beats C then A for sure is better than both. BETTER, not more deserving. It is clear in all he says. If you come from that premise you of course would be for auto bids.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

I agree with you about PSU getting left out in favor of Ohio State was wrong because PSU beat them on the field.


But last year they got it right. Bama didnt deserve the 4th spot but neither did anyone else, so we WERE THE TALLEST MIDGET, CLARK!!!! We ended up proving them right.

I can’t say they got it right OSU played a stronger schedule and they won their CCG. The arguement could go either way. Between the past two years and the TCU/Baylor issues. I think they need to find an actual concrete format ,expand or both. Continue to evolve there’s too many question marks right now. Play offs were a good start now they just have to continue improving on what they started.

How have you been mistaken ?

 

[TheDayMan]

I agree with you about PSU getting left out in favor of Ohio State was wrong because PSU beat them on the field.


But last year they got it right. Bama didnt deserve the 4th spot but neither did anyone else, so we WERE THE TALLEST MIDGET, CLARK!!!! We ended up proving them right.

There’s obviously an argument for penn state that year, but going with Ohio state wasn’t wrong, and was consistent with what the committee has always said/shown they look at. Ohio State simply had more checks in the what they look for column, or less checks in the ‘what we don’t want to see column’. Against them they had the head to head loss @ penn state and that led to them not winning their conference. They also had a great out of conference win, and just one close loss to the quality team in question. Penn state won their conference and had the good wins that come with it, but they had two (really) bad losses. One to Pitt out of conference, and they got absolutely blown out by Michigan. As far as I’m concerned if you’re losing to Pitt and getting blown out against anyone you have no legitimate bitch about being left out, conference title or no.

As far as bama not deserving it last year and being the tallest midget, maybe, but they clearly made the right call unless you want to argue they got the other 3 wrong too.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

5-4 won by 16 pts
6-3 won by 1 pt
6-3 won by 17 pts
5-4 won by 29pts
6-3 loss by 8pts
8-1 won by 20 pts
6-3 won by 16 pts
9-0 loss by 29pts



How can you look at that resume and not think they are legit??

In order to properly analyze those numbers. All of the conferences would have to be working off a equal platform. Same amount of conference games and a uniform OOC schedule ie 2 P5 1 G5 etc..

Otherwise it’s OSU doesn’t take that extra loss if they played Mercer etc...

It’s not the teams that are flawed it’s the system that is flawed by design

 

[TheDayMan]

The only thing they really proved last year, and I linked articles for those lost with direct conversations with the committee about it, is if everything else is similar, really bad losses alone are enough to sink you.

They don't make decisions based on a formula which may deeply upset clark, but is really the only way it works. There is no one set of rules that covers every situation. Last years end proves that more than makes a case for breaking it and doing something dumb in its place. Ohio State got entirely embarrassed and paid a price for it. That's ALL we learned.

The committee has appeared to not worry about wins that weren't by comfortable enough margins, at least by fans standards. Beating a crappy team by 1 is still a win. They seem to take into account injuries, targeting suspensions, and other outside factors. It is something they have talked about. No formula or laid in stone set of rules can do that.

It would be stupid to create such a thing. The goal is to put the best 4 teams in the post season together. ANY other system you can think of would swap 'best' for 'most deserving' which is what Clarky is entirely obsessed with. If you win this game, you DESERVE to be in. He doesn't care at all about leaving really good teams out.

Why? Because Clark believes in the transitive property of football. He believes that football is played in a static universe and outcomes are all encompassing. If team A beats B and B beats C then A for sure is better than both. BETTER, not more deserving. It is clear in all he says. If you come from that premise you of course would be for auto bids.

They’ve been consistent enough to figure it out for sure, unless you’re a dumbass (no offense clarkson). If they ever break with that consistency I might get the complaint, but otherwise I’m happy with them being able to look at and consider everything to figure it out. Adding specific criteria is one of those things that sounds good until it ruins everything. Every year’s different. All things being equal a conference championship might give one team the nod over an other, that doesn’t mean every year a conference championship should be a requirement.

 

[WizardHawk]

Committee
TCU/ Baylor non conference champions
Penn State Conference Champions
Ohio State Conferemce Champions

All left out while changing criteria each year. I gave you numbers and facts. I get you like semantics and debate. But I prefer concrete data to determine a champion. The current systems foundation is based heavily on human influence and opinions.

If you need to use a scenario ie “but team a lost to a P5 team or was blown out by a P5 team. When they could have watered down their schedule and played a meaningless game in its place. Where as playing an extra game and winning a conference championship holds more value. Based on a higher difficulty. Whensroerating two 11 win teams etc...

The 4 best teams in the current system is based on opinion not fact. Participation trophy

Unless you have factual data. They need a concrete system. If you would like you can continue debating opinion and semantics but that’s just meaningless....

No, you did not give facts. Again you can't tell the difference between facts and opinions and yours are so far in left field they have a different zip code.

YOU place ultimate weight on ONE game every year: That last conf match up pinning the winner of two divisions (or whatever the hell that stupidity B12 does lol). THAT GAME IS ALL THERE IS IN FOOTBALL TO YOU. PERIOD.

The rest of us get that sometimes the 'best' team can actually lose a game to a team that otherwise isn't better than them, but played better on that day. That is really football 101 to almost everyone. It is borne out over and over every year. When you see a Mich lose to an App St or similar it again shows that sometimes the best team doesn't win.

It is NOT a fact that the conf champs are the best teams in football. Again, PERIOD. They won their league. It's not the same thing.

The winner of the national championship also is the winner of a 4 team tournament. They may not actually have been the 'best' team of the year. When we left the polls picking winners we left the idea that the crown when on the head of the best team. We now try to put the best 4 teams together and see who wins and give them a title.

These are facts, not that stupidity you keep spewing.

You have no clue how football works.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

No, you did not give facts. Again you can't tell the difference between facts and opinions and yours are so far in left field they have a different zip code.

YOU place ultimate weight on ONE game every year: That last conf match up pinning the winner of two divisions (or whatever the hell that stupidity B12 does lol). THAT GAME IS ALL THERE IS IN FOOTBALL TO YOU. PERIOD.

The rest of us get that sometimes the 'best' team can actually lose a game to a team that otherwise isn't better than them, but played better on that day. That is really football 101 to almost everyone. It is borne out over and over every year. When you see a Mich lose to an App St or similar it again shows that sometimes the best team doesn't win.

It is NOT a fact that the conf champs are the best teams in football. Again, PERIOD. They won their league. It's not the same thing.

The winner of the national championship also is the winner of a 4 team tournament. They may not actually have been the 'best' team of the year. When we left the polls picking winners we left the idea that the crown when on the head of the best team. We now try to put the best 4 teams together and see who wins and give them a title.

These are facts, not that stupidity you keep spewing.

You have no clue how football works.

This is just more opinion and semantics......

When one uses words like

Had an argument to get in...Eye test....etc...

That by definition is opinion. Which is a direct confirmation that the play off teams selected are the best 4 teams by opinion. Not the best 4 teams by direct results....

Bottom line if we want the best teams in the play offs and a true champion. College football is going to need a system that reduces the impact of human influence. And increases the impact of the game being played on the field.

Feel free to think that through. In the mean time its all nothing more than opinion and semantics basically the scenario village......

 

[Mistaken4193]

I can’t say they got it right OSU played a stronger schedule and they won their CCG. The arguement could go either way. Between the past two years and the TCU/Baylor issues. I think they need to find an actual concrete format ,expand or both. Continue to evolve there’s too many question marks right now. Play offs were a good start now they just have to continue improving on what they started.

How have you been mistaken ?

Well....Im fat as fuck now but I guess im alright....how are you?

 

[WizardHawk]

They’ve been consistent enough to figure it out for sure, unless you’re a dumbass (no offense clarkson). If they ever break with that consistency I might get the complaint, but otherwise I’m happy with them being able to look at and consider everything to figure it out. Adding specific criteria is one of those things that sounds good until it ruins everything.

'adding criteria' is clarks substitute for simply not understanding how it works. Nothing more. You can't objectively look at what has happened and not understand it HAS to be dynamic because there are way too many variables, way too few games, way too few connections between leagues, and way too many teams to have some simple formula.

Autobids would not fix any of that. It doesn't build connections between the conferences, and in fact would stifle it because it would kill quality OOC games which are now the only few we DO have that connect them. It doesn't reduce the number of teams, nor increase the number of games. Unless all of the conferences are thrown out and rebuilt from the ground up they would be seriously imbalanced. The 'winners' of each have nothing in common outside of they are roughly the same age of kids on the field. That's it. And we all know how dumb it is to leave out really good teams in favor of the tallest midget from the worst conference. It's a bad idea all around.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

Well....Im fat as fuck now but I guess im alright....how are you?

I'm doing good. I would like a new head coach if y'all got one lying around

 

[Mistaken4193]

In order to properly analyze those numbers. All of the conferences would have to be working off a equal platform. Same amount of conference games and a uniform OOC schedule ie 2 P5 1 G5 etc..

Otherwise it’s OSU doesn’t take that extra loss if they played Mercer etc...

It’s not the teams that are flawed it’s the system that is flawed by design

All games I listed were against P5s...except 1 of the 6-3's

 

[Mistaken4193]

I'm doing good. I would like a new head coach if y'all got one lying around

Well Butch Jones has been....as Red in Shawshank said....Rehabilitated.

 

[TheDayMan]

This is just more opinion and semantics......

When one uses words like

Had an argument to get in...Eye test....etc...

That by definition is opinion. Which is a direct confirmation that the play off teams selected are the best 4 teams by opinion. Not the best 4 teams by direct results....

Bottom line if we want the best teams in the play offs and a true champion. College football is going to need a system that reduces the impact of human influence. And increases the impact of the game being played on the field.

Feel free to think that through. In the mean time its all nothing more than opinion and semantics basically the scenario village......

I thought it through, it sounds stupid...

 

[TheDayMan]

'adding criteria' is clarks substitute for simply not understanding how it works. Nothing more. You can't objectively look at what has happened and not understand it HAS to be dynamic because there are way too many variables, way too few games, way too few connections between leagues, and way too many teams to have some simple formula.

Autobids would not fix any of that. It doesn't build connections between the conferences, and in fact would stifle it because it would kill quality OOC games which are now the only few we DO have that connect them. It doesn't reduce the number of teams, nor increase the number of games. Unless all of the conferences are thrown out and rebuilt from the ground up they would be seriously imbalanced. The 'winners' of each have nothing in common outside of they are roughly the same age of kids on the field. That's it. And we all know how dumb it is to leave out really good teams in favor of the tallest midget from the worst conference. It's a bad idea all around.

This is such a terrible year to argue automatic conference qualifiers too. God forbid we don’t add a week to see whoever comes out on top of Pac 12 garbage mountain get stomped in the playoff.

 

[WizardHawk]

This is just more opinion and semantics......

When one uses words like

Had an argument to get in...Eye test....etc...

That by definition is opinion. Which is a direct confirmation that the play off teams selected are the best 4 teams by opinion. Not the best 4 teams by direct results....

Bottom line if we want the best teams in the play offs and a true champion. College football is going to need a system that reduces the impact of human influence. And increases the impact of the game being played on the field.

Feel free to think that through. In the mean time its all nothing more than opinion and semantics basically the scenario village......

You really and truly are the absolute dumbest person I have ever conversed with at any point of time in my life.

I already clearly laid out where your flaw is. And yet you keep sticking to it.

There is NO SYSTEM OF ANY KIND that can use a formula of any type to 'prove' who the best teams in the sport are. The things you propose ALSO DO NOT DO THAT AT ALL.

The process is invalid to you if they don't have a script and math formula or computer something or other to make the same pick every time.

It cannot work that way. Maybe this year the same thing happens as last year but the conf winner didn't get their dicks chopped off by a scrub team AND THEY ARE IN. Likewise, I can assure you as bad as your whining is, the internet would blow up if teams were put in by wins/loss and conf champ status ONLY and some team got in with that aforementioned really bad loss and maybe some really bad wins on top it and left quality teams out. It would be a BADLY broken system.

Conferences create their own rules for seeding their CCG's. Do you get that? It isn't anything that resembles even footing across the sport. Teams in the SEC can go a decade without facing specific teams. The B12 doesn't even have divisions, more or less pick their final 2 the same way others do. They don't all have the same tiebreakers. And NONE OF THEM have anything built in about quality of win/loss. It is pure flat W/L which isn't a good metric alone.

Our playoff system takes the best information it has and fixes the flaws in the rest of the sport and at least puts forth the best effort available for finding the best 4 teams to play it out and take home the trophy.

 

[Mistaken4193]

This is just more opinion and semantics......

When one uses words like

Had an argument to get in...Eye test....etc...

That by definition is opinion. Which is a direct confirmation that the play off teams selected are the best 4 teams by opinion. Not the best 4 teams by direct results....

Bottom line if we want the best teams in the play offs and a true champion. College football is going to need a system that reduces the impact of human influence. And increases the impact of the game being played on the field.

Feel free to think that through. In the mean time its all nothing more than opinion and semantics basically the scenario village......

The best way to do it IMO is to have a 6 team playoff with 5 autobids CC and 1 WC but there are some rules.

1.Every P5 team plays 10 P5 games and 2 patsy G5/FCS games. The committee can only use P5 games to evaluate a team.

2. If you have more than 2 losses and win your conference you lose your autobid. That spot becomes an extra WC spot.


This is the best way IMO.

 

[TheRobotDevil]

All games I listed were against P5s...except 1 of the 6-3's

Problem with that is the last year we saw an example of a team that plays a 4 game OOC that included 2 G5s and an FCS get in over a team that played 11 P5's and 1 G5 with a conference championship. Both teams had 11 wins one won a CCG

The year before that we saw a team that won a H2H get left out for the team they beat. Both teams won 11 games one won a CCG

Baylor and TCU were left out because they had no CCG

The system has a lot of flaws. The committee has shown over time they have no criteria.

Conferences do not play uniform schedules and teams don't play uniform OOC schedules

Tbh theres a very strong case for expansion,outbids and at large. Cuts down the human influence and question marks. While leaving room for at large to round it out