R.I.P. Jeremy Lamb's Pacers Career

[buckalis]

Ben did Drummond ask out? Everything I saw said he wanted to stay and was surprised by the trade. And if you want out you don't want out to Cleveland.

and the Pistons are doing the very definition of tanking. They traded or cut everyone they could that was making money to set up for a rebuild. By ridding yourself of all NBA -level talent you are trying to lose as an organization. I disagree with your definition of tanking. It's not throwing game s, which the players could do; tanking is more at the whole organization level, not the individual player level.

I guess it's obvious you (and others) understand the meaning of "tanking" different, but still, tanking only means "losing in purpose"...

Putting together a young core of rookies and young talent and through them into fire, is not tanking... it's accelerating their development, you still want them to do their best and win (if they can).

 

[trojanfan12]

Putting together a young core of rookies and young talent and through them into fire, is not tanking... it's accelerating their development, you still want them to do their best and win (if they can).

I think that you are confusing the effort of the players with the intentions of the front office.

As I said earlier, players and coaches don't tank. Whether they are rookies, in their prime superstars, or washed vets...they all play to win every night.

Front offices tank by intentionally putting together a roster that they know can't win, no matter how hard the players play or how well the coaches coach.

When a team that is developing rookies and young talent wants to win while developing that young talent, they add veterans who can actually still play and help the kids win.

 

[buckalis]

I think that you are confusing the effort of the players with the intentions of the front office.

As I said earlier, players and coaches don't tank. Whether they are rookies, in their prime superstars, or washed vets...they all play to win every night.

Front offices tank by intentionally putting together a roster that they know can't win, no matter how hard the players play or how well the coaches coach.

When a team that is developing rookies and young talent wants to win while developing that young talent, they add veterans who can actually still play and help the kids win.

No... the intentions of the front office have nothing to do with it... The front office may have the plan to set a team up in two or three seasons and therefore trade or waive everybody but the under 25yo... Still the youngsters on the floor will want and win each and every game they play and that's not tanking...

To be honest, I think there are no more teams that are having tanking as a policy (with the meaning of the work) they follow... There are some games that are tanked by some teams in certain cases, but tanking as a policy doesn't make sense anymore...

I mean what would one achieve by tanking this season? During the draft night, one can pick gold at No25 and another can pick garbage at 5... It's all a matter of how good your scouters are with respect to competition... There are many players with excellent potential IMO in this up coming draft, which will fell outside of the lottery picks.

 

[trojanfan12]

No... the intentions of the front office have nothing to do with it...

The intentions of the front office have everything to do with it. They control who is and isn't on the roster.

If they intentionally put a roster together that can't win because they are too young, too old, or just can't play...they are tanking.

I mean what would one achieve by tanking this season? During the draft night, one can pick gold at No25 and another can pick garbage at 5... It's all a matter of how good your scouters are with respect to competition... There are many players with excellent potential IMO in this up coming draft, which will fell outside of the lottery picks.

Is the bold a real question? In any draft, you will have players picked in the lottery who don't pan out or who never live up to their draft status...and you're going to have players that are picked late in the draft who end up being very good players.

But the chances of getting a star player are much greater earlier in the draft than later.

 

[buckalis]

The intentions of the front office have everything to do with it. They control who is and isn't on the roster.

If they intentionally put a roster together that can't win because they are too young, too old, or just can't play...they are tanking.

it never happens... The F.O buys the roster and the coach, the coach decides on the tactics, the roles, the minutes and the roster formation.

Is the bold a real question? In any draft, you will have players picked in the lottery who don't pan out or who never live up to their draft status...and you're going to have players that are picked late in the draft who end up being very good players.

But the chances of getting a star player are much greater earlier in the draft than later.

This draft in particular seems to hide many diamonds in the rough in it...

 

[trojanfan12]

it never happens... The F.O buys the roster and the coach, the coach decides on the tactics, the roles, the minutes and the roster formation.

lol

If the front office "buys the roster" they are the ones deciding who is on the roster.

If they don't give the coach a roster that can win, the team isn't going to win.

 

[trojanfan12]

This draft in particular seems to hide many diamonds in the rough in it...

That doesn't change the fact that a team is more likely to find a top level player earlier in the draft.

 

[WiggyRuss]

I think that you are confusing the effort of the players with the intentions of the front office.

As I said earlier, players and coaches don't tank. Whether they are rookies, in their prime superstars, or washed vets...they all play to win every night.

Front offices tank by intentionally putting together a roster that they know can't win, no matter how hard the players play or how well the coaches coach.

When a team that is developing rookies and young talent wants to win while developing that young talent, they add veterans who can actually still play and help the kids win.

do you think that you are smart?

you have, and always have, what i would call the "Mike and Mike" takes---- the dry, boring, no depth takes that the casual sports fan gets on a hack-show like Mike and Mike. You just seem very very limited in so many ways. You can just tell that you had a menial job and likely never went to college- at least not a good one.

my dad never went to college but he was put in charge of 100 million dollars oil rigs for TransOcean.

You can usually tell how smart a person is from their writing and your writing and takes are surface deep and cliche. total "Mike and Mike".

 

[logic]

do you think that you are smart?

you have, and always have, what i would call the "Mike and Mike" takes---- the dry, boring, no depth takes that the casual sports fan gets on a hack-show like Mike and Mike. You just seem very very limited in so many ways. You can just tell that you had a menial job and likely never went to college- at least not a good one.

my dad never went to college but he was put in charge of 100 million dollars oil rigs for TransOcean.

You can usually tell how smart a person is from their writing and your writing and takes are surface deep and cliche. total "Mike and Mike".

You know Mike and Mike hasn't been a show for years now, and that TransOcean is best known for the deep water Horizon catastrophe. You are not exactly making strong points propping them up with these.

And on this thread you are backing the completely wrong party. Tanking is done by the front office. Coaches and playes can throw games (which is potentially illegal) where the front office can throw a season (tanking), by assembling a roster that can have no chance to compete (which is for some reason not illegal). This intentional tanking to rebuild a team should not be mistaken for ineptitude by a front office like the Knicks.

 

[Shanemansj13]

I mean what would one achieve by tanking this season? During the draft night, one can pick gold at No25 and another can pick garbage at 5... It's all a matter of how good your scouters are with respect to competition... There are many players with excellent potential IMO in this up coming draft, which will fell outside of the lottery picks.

Cmon man, are you serious?

What do you think odds are of selecting a future great/AS player in the top 3 compared to 20-30...the odds are significantly favoring the team picking in the top 3. It's common sense. Sometimes you make good points to seem like you are knowledgeable and then you come back with these idiotic elementary stuff like this question. I think my wife would know this and she knows absolutely nothing about sports.

So when teams tank they have a greater chance of acquiring a great player based on odds...also acquire a volume of picks is another factor in tanking which involves trading expiring contracts and/or veterans.

 

[WiggyRuss]

You know Mike and Mike hasn't been a show for years now, and that TransOcean is best known for the deep water Horizon catastrophe. You are not exactly making strong points propping them up with these.

And on this thread you are backing the completely wrong party. Tanking is done by the front office. Coaches and playes can throw games (which is potentially illegal) where the front office can throw a season (tanking), by assembling a roster that can have no chance to compete (which is for some reason not illegal). This intentional tanking to rebuild a team should not be mistaken for ineptitude by a front office like the Knicks.

just for clarity sake--- my dad first worked for Global Marine, and then it was bought and turned into Global Sante Fe, and then Global Sante Fe was bought by TransOcean.

My dad was working on a rig off the coast of Nigeria, Africa and retired 2 weeks before the disaster in the Gulf of Mexico happened because he hated the way TransOcean ran things.

After that he did consulting work for fracking operations in the Ohio/Pennsylvania/West Virginia area (Marsellus Shale Formation)- and ended up making like $1,800 a day (some contracts with certain operators were over 2k a day actually EQT, Rice, Chesapeake, etc.)- instead of flying half way around the world.

 

[logic]

just for clarity sake--- my dad first worked for Global Marine, and then it was bought and turned into Global Sante Fe, and then Global Sante Fe was bought by TransOcean.

My dad was working on a rig off the coast of Nigeria, Africa and retired 2 weeks before the disaster in the Gulf of Mexico happened because he hated the way TransOcean ran things.

After that he did consulting work for fracking operations in the Ohio/Pennsylvania/West Virginia area (Marsellus Shale Formation)- and ended up making like $1,800 a day (some contracts with certain operators were over 2k a day actually EQT, Rice, Chesapeake, etc.)- instead of flying half way around the world.

That is awesome for him. I hear it is a tough job, hence the pay.

 

[shopson67]

just for clarity sake--- my dad first worked for Global Marine, and then it was bought and turned into Global Sante Fe, and then Global Sante Fe was bought by TransOcean.

My dad was working on a rig off the coast of Nigeria, Africa and retired 2 weeks before the disaster in the Gulf of Mexico happened because he hated the way TransOcean ran things.

After that he did consulting work for fracking operations in the Ohio/Pennsylvania/West Virginia area (Marsellus Shale Formation)- and ended up making like $1,800 a day (some contracts with certain operators were over 2k a day actually EQT, Rice, Chesapeake, etc.)- instead of flying half way around the world.

So we can officially call you a son of a fracking ___? $1800/day is a lot of money to make people's tap water flammable, congrats!

 

[WiggyRuss]

That is awesome for him. I hear it is a tough job, hence the pay.

yah pretty crazy...started on land rigs in Ohio as a roughneck, and then to land rigs in Louisiana, and then to the Gulf of Mexico, then to Alaska for a while, and then to a number of different places in Africa- and ending as OIM- which is as high as you can go and still be on the rig and not managing multiple rigs from town.

Some of the airports he flew out of would give me nightmares. i could not even imagine.

He is pretty crazy though- in his younger days was in the Navy and on an aircraft carrier that went to the Philippines and Vietnam and Australia, etc.

One of the crazier stories is how some of the people intercepted his mail in Africa from a cousin who was in South Korea, they re-wrote the letter saying the cousin was kidnapped and to send them money--- after the initial shock wore off he saw numerous spelling errors that alerted him to the false nature of the letter.

Another one is that he had a buddy who set up a fishing resort (resort is not the right word)- more like camp, out in the Amazon. He visited him on his time off and caught a ton of peacock bass. The crazy part is thought that the guy said there are a ton of anacondas in the water, and if any of them peak their heads out of the water to just hit them on the head with your fishing pole and they will leave you alone.

 

[WiggyRuss]

this is not my dad, but is a picture of a peackock bass- they are really cool

 

[WiggyRuss]

So we can officially call you a son of a fracking ___? $1800/day is a lot of money to make people's tap water flammable, congrats!

dont forget the earthquakes!

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

You can usually tell how smart a person is from their writing and your writing and takes are surface deep and cliche. total "Mike and Mike".

Oh the irony

 

[HurricaneDij39]

Something we agree on. There may be hope for mankind after all.

I think all playoff teams should also have a chance to get a top 5 pick. Smaller of course, but a chance. For a team to make the playoffs as a 7th or 8th seed with no chance to win it all and they get punished by the league for it is crazy.

It's easy to forget that the Pacers weren't always the solidly-run organization we know them as today.

While I'll always believe Ron Artest got hosed with his season-long suspension, our FO didn't really handle the aftermath of the brawl in Detroit at all. In hindsight, we probably got we we deserved in the latter portions of the 2000's decade.

 

[Black Adam]

so @buckalis...

is it true you can't respond to our posts anymore...?

i mean, you had so much meaningful dialog for us all...

 

[True Lakers Fan]

I think the draft should be worst record drafts first and go in order from there.

The Pacers are part of the reason why. Because they are well run, they could tank for a season, maybe 2, get top flight rookie or 2 and develop and build around them.

The problem is that the NBA got tired of teams tanking it just to get the best pick - but mixing it up, the teams what would tank every game now are on notice that their strategy might not work and it forces them to do more than just tank