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Paul George forces his second trade in barely two years...

ATL96Steeler

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His point was in free agency. Never said anything about teams willing to trade with the Lakers.

We've now see a number of all-star players play elsewhere instead of with Lebron. Last year we saw it with Paul George who had a chance to go to the Lakers. This year we saw it with Kawhi.

Admittedly I was surprised George signed a long term deal with OKC instead of the Lakers, but I always felt Kawhi wanted his own team, and going to the Lakers would be going to LJ's team.
 

TrustMeIamRight

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It doesn't help that most teams have refused to trade with the Lakers of late. Pels at first, Spurs with Kawhi, etc. I'm sure if the Lakers had convinced PG13 that he should come to LA via trade, the Thunder wouldn't have been so quick to act.

Jealousy is a coldhearted bitch.

While that sounds good — the only team to be jealous of in California is Golden State right now. The Lakers haven’t won anything in a decade.

SA wouldn’t trade to LA, not because they are LA, but because you are in the same conference.

Indiana didn’t trade to LA, because Oklahoma made them a better offer and LA thought he’d be signing with them after one year anyway.

And the Pelicans didn’t make the trade because they knew in the off-season, they’d have teams bidding against one another and they could squeeze even more out of LA, which is exactly what they did.

I’d be more worried about all the FA’s who could have signed with LA and didn’t even give them the time of day. In a FA class of Durant, Klay Thompson, Jimmy Butler, Tobias Harris, Kyrie Irvin, Kemba Walker, Kawhi Leonard, Khris Middleton, etc. — the Lakers signed none. They added AD, but gave up their roster and their future to get him and it still didn’t draw another star to play alongside them.

To see the Lakers and Knicks sign zero superstars this off-season was shocking to me and to see the Clippers be the team in LA to pull off the heist of Kawhi and PG13 was a close 2nd.
 

dtgold88

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Yeah.

And as a Cleveland fan you of all people should understand this.

If you can’t get in the room, your only viable rebuild option is through the draft.
Better example for me is as a Buckeye fan. I can tell you I've never taken solace in being in a guy's top 3-5 unless we got him.

Laker's history and location can get them a meeting with most. Not sealing the deal is not anything to be proud of.
 

dtgold88

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It doesn't help that most teams have refused to trade with the Lakers of late. Pels at first, Spurs with Kawhi, etc. I'm sure if the Lakers had convinced PG13 that he should come to LA via trade, the Thunder wouldn't have been so quick to act.

Jealousy is a coldhearted bitch.
sorry....not buying this at all. If LAL made a better offer than what they received for Kawhi I believe SA would have moved him to LA. True, all things equal, they'd deal him out of conference.

Pels simply waited to see how lottery shaked out and what other offers they'd receive. AD saying LA or bust helped them obviously.
 

shopson67

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sorry....not buying this at all. If LAL made a better offer than what they received for Kawhi I believe SA would have moved him to LA. True, all things equal, they'd deal him out of conference.

Pels simply waited to see how lottery shaked out and what other offers they'd receive. AD saying LA or bust helped them obviously.

Do you ever respond without twisting words? Where did I say LA offered the best deal? I said that the Spurs refused to negotiate with the Lakers. I don't recall it ever getting to a true offer stage.

Pels were just messing around with the Lakers before the deadline, leaking offers (true or not) and moving the goalposts the whole time. Those shenanigans got their GM fired. If they believed Ainge at any point, that's on them.
 

tlance

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Better example for me is as a Buckeye fan. I can tell you I've never taken solace in being in a guy's top 3-5 unless we got him.

Laker's history and location can get them a meeting with most. Not sealing the deal is not anything to be proud of.

You miss the point.

The more top 5s you get in, the more guys you actually land.

Nobody gets every FA they pitch. If you are never in the conversation for the superstar FA, you have a 0% chance of landing him.

There are many franchises out there who are NEVER in that conversation.
 

shopson67

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While that sounds good — the only team to be jealous of in California is Golden State right now. The Lakers haven’t won anything in a decade.

SA wouldn’t trade to LA, not because they are LA, but because you are in the same conference.

Indiana didn’t trade to LA, because Oklahoma made them a better offer and LA thought he’d be signing with them after one year anyway.

And the Pelicans didn’t make the trade because they knew in the off-season, they’d have teams bidding against one another and they could squeeze even more out of LA, which is exactly what they did.

I’d be more worried about all the FA’s who could have signed with LA and didn’t even give them the time of day. In a FA class of Durant, Klay Thompson, Jimmy Butler, Tobias Harris, Kyrie Irvin, Kemba Walker, Kawhi Leonard, Khris Middleton, etc. — the Lakers signed none. They added AD, but gave up their roster and their future to get him and it still didn’t draw another star to play alongside them.

To see the Lakers and Knicks sign zero superstars this off-season was shocking to me and to see the Clippers be the team in LA to pull off the heist of Kawhi and PG13 was a close 2nd.

For some reason, teams are still willing to trade assets to the Warriors. They haven't built up that cache of hate yet.

This same-conference stuff makes no sense. It ended up for one season and he's right back in the West. They would've had to go through Kawhi to win last year anyway. If divisions made any real difference in playoff seeding, within the division might be an issue, but that's not really the case in the NBA.

Indiana didn't trade PG to LA because LA had no reason to give away assets for a rental that said he was coming in free agency anyway. PG was weak-minded and signed an extension with OKC, only to regret it the following summer.

Pels didn't get anything more than what they leaked the Lakers had offered last year, minus Kuzma. Think Kuzma was worth a 1st rounder lower than the #4? Of course he is.

Durant - damaged goods, out for the year, and packaged with Kyrie (Lakers can't fit 2 max deals)
Kyrie - only in consideration due to how he played with Lebron, packaged with Durant (Lakers can't fit 2 max deals)
Klay - would only leave Warriors if low-balled - not an option
Kemba - not a good fit as a ball-dominant scoring PG, never really made it to free agency
Tobias - not worth the max (why the Clips traded him away)
Middleton - not worth the max, don't need a forward for the max anyway
Butler - could be a fit, not ideal fit age-wise with AD, not going to sign him if you're still in the running for Kawhi
DLo - see Butler, but a better fit age-wise

The Lakers only missed on Kawhi, the one max target that truly fit what they wanted. They constructed a pretty solid team very quickly once Kawhi decided on the Clips, likely because the negotiations had already been done. It's no coincidence that all those players were still available. Many argued that the fill out the roster approach made more sense than chasing Kawhi (which I disagree with, just didn't like the wait).
 

dtgold88

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Do you ever respond without twisting words? Where did I say LA offered the best deal? I said that the Spurs refused to negotiate with the Lakers. I don't recall it ever getting to a true offer stage.

Pels were just messing around with the Lakers before the deadline, leaking offers (true or not) and moving the goalposts the whole time. Those shenanigans got their GM fired. If they believed Ainge at any point, that's on them.
Twisting words? You said the Spurs "refused to trade with the Lakers". Those were your exact words. I'm saying if the Lakers offered them the best deal then SA would have traded with the Lakers. Disagree? Tell me how that was twisting words.

Pels did end up trading with the Lakers and were smart to wait, no matter what their GM did at the time.
 

dtgold88

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You miss the point.

The more top 5s you get in, the more guys you actually land.

Nobody gets every FA they pitch. If you are never in the conversation for the superstar FA, you have a 0% chance of landing him.

There are many franchises out there who are NEVER in that conversation.
I don't miss your point at all. I just disagree with it. They get in the conversation because they are in LA. Stealing from Freddy Kitchens, but whoop-de-hell if you so far cannot land the top guy you are going after.
 

tlance

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I don't miss your point at all. I just disagree with it. They get in the conversation because they are in LA. Stealing from Freddy Kitchens, but whoop-de-hell if you so far cannot land the top guy you are going after.

Shocker
 

HurricaneDij39

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The 2 situations aren't rea

The 2 situations aren't really the same though. He did the Pacers a favor by telling him he would not remain in Indy after his contract was up. Otherwise the Pacers would have received nothing in return. Instead they got Sabonis and Dipo.

The end results are still the same, though. Paul George wanted out and it's everyone else's fault but his, at least in the eyes of the media.

He does not receive any credit from yours truly for our haul in the OKC trade. We landed Oladipo and Sabonis in spite of George wanting out, not because of it.
 

TrustMeIamRight

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For some reason, teams are still willing to trade assets to the Warriors. They haven't built up that cache of hate yet.

This same-conference stuff makes no sense. It ended up for one season and he's right back in the West. They would've had to go through Kawhi to win last year anyway. If divisions made any real difference in playoff seeding, within the division might be an issue, but that's not really the case in the NBA.

Indiana didn't trade PG to LA because LA had no reason to give away assets for a rental that said he was coming in free agency anyway. PG was weak-minded and signed an extension with OKC, only to regret it the following summer.

Pels didn't get anything more than what they leaked the Lakers had offered last year, minus Kuzma. Think Kuzma was worth a 1st rounder lower than the #4? Of course he is.

Durant - damaged goods, out for the year, and packaged with Kyrie (Lakers can't fit 2 max deals)
Kyrie - only in consideration due to how he played with Lebron, packaged with Durant (Lakers can't fit 2 max deals)
Klay - would only leave Warriors if low-balled - not an option
Kemba - not a good fit as a ball-dominant scoring PG, never really made it to free agency
Tobias - not worth the max (why the Clips traded him away)
Middleton - not worth the max, don't need a forward for the max anyway
Butler - could be a fit, not ideal fit age-wise with AD, not going to sign him if you're still in the running for Kawhi
DLo - see Butler, but a better fit age-wise

The Lakers only missed on a Kawhi, the one max target that truly fit what they wanted. They constructed a pretty solid team very quickly once Kawhi decided on the Clips, likely because the negotiations had already been done. It's no coincidence that all those players were still available. Many argued that the fill out the roster approach made more sense than chasing Kawhi (which I disagree with, just didn't like the wait).

What superstars were traded to GSW? They drafted the stars they have and signed Durant in FA. So your comment makes no sense, as GSW hasn’t had to make deals to put a super team together.

As far as the other FA — LA WANTED Kawhi more than the others and he made it known he wanted to come back to LA. Kawhi just chose to sign with the Clippers instead of the Lakers.

Making excuses why the Lakers didn’t want the other FA’s is ridiculous. Middleton is exactly what LA needs — a shooting guard to help stretch the floor and open up the middle for Lebron and Davis.

Kyrie had a choice to go to LA with Lebron and Anthony Davis — he chose to go to NY with Durant.

Tobias is another guy who would have been exactly what LA needed — shoots 40% from 3 and stretches the floor.

To say Kemba Walker doesn’t fit, then have the Lakers sign Rondo, who is a ball dominant PG doesn’t make sense then?!? The difference is — Kemba can stretch the floor for the team he is playing on. You don’t even have to guard Rondo at the 3 point line.

You’d be better off saying — the Lakers put all their eggs in one basket and Leonard left them holding nothing. Because the reality is — they ended up with LeBron and AD, and a hodge podge of whatever was leftover.
 

Myles

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The end results are still the same, though. Paul George wanted out and it's everyone else's fault but his, at least in the eyes of the media.

He does not receive any credit from yours truly for our haul in the OKC trade. We landed Oladipo and Sabonis in spite of George wanting out, not because of it.
I disagree. Had he not told the Pacers he was planning to leave, a trade would not have been sought.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of his. I just don't think what he did to get to the Clippers is comparable to how he left the Pacers.
 

trojanfan12

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The end results are still the same, though. Paul George wanted out and it's everyone else's fault but his, at least in the eyes of the media.

lol

Why is it his fault for wanting out of a situation he wasn't happy with? It's hilarious that you want to put all of the blame on him and none on the teams.

One thing that is on him is the fact that he re-signed with OKC without taking meetings from any other teams. Imo, he made an emotional decision based on how he was welcomed by the Thunder and their fans and the party that Westbrook threw for him.

I don't know if meeting with other teams would have changed his decision. But he at least would have been able to make some comparisons and make a more informed, less emotional decision.

And before you start your usual "that's because you're a Lakers fan..." nonsense. I said "teams". Plural. Maybe he chooses the Clippers? They already had their current FO in place. Maybe they present a compelling pitch and he chooses them? Maybe someone else presents a great pitch and he goes there?

He does not receive any credit from yours truly for our haul in the OKC trade. We landed Oladipo and Sabonis in spite of George wanting out, not because of it.

No, they got Dipo and Sabonis because PG gave them plenty of notice that he wasn't going to be re-signing with them. Had he not told them that he wasn't coming back, they wouldn't have had the opportunity to trade him and would have been left without him and without any assets from trading him.
 
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shopson67

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Twisting words? You said the Spurs "refused to trade with the Lakers". Those were your exact words. I'm saying if the Lakers offered them the best deal then SA would have traded with the Lakers. Disagree? Tell me how that was twisting words.

Pels did end up trading with the Lakers and were smart to wait, no matter what their GM did at the time.

The Spurs wouldn't even talk trade with the Lakers is my point (but not yours).

How were the Pels smart to wait? So that they could lose out on Kuzma?
 

trojanfan12

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The Spurs wouldn't even talk trade with the Lakers is my point (but not yours).

Yeah, I doubt the Spurs wanted to send Kawhi to any Western Conference team...but they especially didn't want the Lakers getting him.

How were the Pels smart to wait? So that they could lose out on Kuzma?

At the time, it was smart for the Pels to wait because there were teams like the Celtics who were suggesting that they could and would beat the Lakers offer.

It didn't work out that way for them, but they essentially got the #4 pick for Kuzma. So, it still worked out pretty well.

Kind of like, even though they didn't get him, it was smart for the Lakers to stay in the Kawhi chase all the way to the end.
 

dtgold88

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The Spurs wouldn't even talk trade with the Lakers is my point (but not yours).

How were the Pels smart to wait? So that they could lose out on Kuzma?
You really believe if LAL called Pop doesn't take the call? Wont even look at a text? Come on. You can't be that naive.

How do you know they didn't choose to not take Kuzma and preferred the #4 pick instead?
 

dtgold88

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Yeah, I doubt the Spurs wanted to send Kawhi to any Western Conference team...but they especially didn't want the Lakers getting him.



At the time, it was smart for the Pels to wait because there were teams like the Celtics who were suggesting that they could and would beat the Lakers offer.

It didn't work out that way for them, but they essentially got the #4 pick for Kuzma. So, it still worked out pretty well.

Kind of like, even though they didn't get him, it was smart for the Lakers to stay in the Kawhi chase all the way to the end.
Didn't want to? Agreed.....but the idea they wouldn't even talk to LA and wouldn't deal with them if they made a better offer is silly. I do agree if offers were close he'd send him to another team and not LA.

Agree with the comments about the Pels.
 

trojanfan12

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How do you know they didn't choose to not take Kuzma and preferred the #4 pick instead?

Because when the trade was suggested, the Lakers didn't have the #4 pick yet. They were projected to have the #11 pick. That's part of why other teams could have beaten their offer.

The combination of the Lakers getting the #4 pick (which was much more attractive) and AD poisoning the well for other teams by saying he wouldn't re-sign with them is why AD is a Laker.
 

trojanfan12

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Didn't want to? Agreed.....but the idea they wouldn't even talk to LA and wouldn't deal with them if they made a better offer is silly. I do agree if offers were close he'd send him to another team and not LA.

There's talking to them and there's talking to them. I seriously doubt the Lakers had enough to offer the Spurs to get them to trade with the Lakers.

If, by chance, the Lakers had enough assets to get the Spurs to trade Kawhi to them, they probably would have had a good enough team that they wouldn't need to make the trade. lol
 

dtgold88

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There's talking to them and there's talking to them. I seriously doubt the Lakers had enough to offer the Spurs to get them to trade with the Lakers.

If, by chance, the Lakers had enough assets to get the Spurs to trade Kawhi to them, they probably would have had a good enough team that they wouldn't need to make the trade. lol
lol all you want. It's Kawhi. You get him if you can.
 
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