OT: Sharks officially sign Antii Niemi

[filosofy29]

For any fellow Sharks fans out there.

Niemi's first reaction to being a Shark (from Finlandia):

"I thought for me it was really important to get to a really good team and also a really good organization," he said in a phone call from Finland. "They really wanted me there, too, so it wasn't too hard a decision after all."

Niittymaki and Griess's feelings about the signing:

Eenie, meenie, miney — Niittymaki, Greiss have different reactions to Niemi’s arrival | Working the Corners

Pretty cool of Niemi to make sure that Niittymaki knew how the contract talks were going with him. Sounds like a team guy.

 

[calsnowskier]

Sorry, my eyes glass over and go slightly cross when the topic turns to hockey...

 

[filosofy29]

Sorry, my eyes glass over and go slightly cross when the topic turns to hockey...

So not a fan then?

 

[calsnowskier]

So not a fan then?

I like giving my friends who LOVE the Red Wings shit when the Sharks win, though. It is extra powerful because when they beat the Sharks, I just tell them I dont give a shit

 

[SFGRTB]

Well, I'm not as familiar with hockey (especially compared to baseball), but I remember he destroyed us in the playoffs and shutdown pretty much everyone else as well. And with Nabby gone, seems like a smart move. But I don't know the terms of the contract or how old Niemi is, so is this really a good move?

Enlighten me...

 

[filosofy29]

Well, I'm not as familiar with hockey (especially compared to baseball), but I remember he destroyed us in the playoffs and shutdown pretty much everyone else as well. And with Nabby gone, seems like a smart move. But I don't know the terms of the contract or how old Niemi is, so is this really a good move?

Enlighten me...

It's just a 1 year contract for $2mil. I'm not necessarily thrilled nor upset about the move. The market has dictated the hand that Doug Wilson (GM) has had to play. The goalie market is saturated with decent goalies, so DWil was able to get a good goalie for a (relatively to other years) low price. Unfortunately, the biggest need the Sharks currently have is for a top 4 defenseman. The only problem is, there aren't any top 4 defenseman available. He's upgraded the goaltending, but he's wasted some of his salary cap here ($2mil worth) to fill a position that wasn't the biggest need. He's now going to have to fill the void on defense by trading a top 6 forward.....most likely Ryane Clowe.

 

[Heathbar012]

When you say Top 4 defender or Top 6 forward, you're talking about on the team, right? As in they need a better defender for their second line, so they'll have to give up a forward from that line? It would be a bummer if the Sharks have to give up Clowe. He has improved every year, and by hockey standards, still has 12 good years left in him. How much stock do you put in +/-, filo? For example, was Clowe's fall back from +8 a year ago to even this year simply a product of needing stronger defenders behind him? What do you see in his game that needs to improve? I never played hockey, but from playing soccer and basketball, I think I understand the spacial relationship and nuances of the game (just never that great at skating ).

 

[filosofy29]

When you say Top 4 defender or Top 6 forward, you're talking about on the team, right? As in they need a better defender for their second line, so they'll have to give up a forward from that line? It would be a bummer if the Sharks have to give up Clowe. He has improved every year, and by hockey standards, still has 12 good years left in him. How much stock do you put in +/-, filo? For example, was Clowe's fall back from +8 a year ago to even this year simply a product of needing stronger defenders behind him? What do you see in his game that needs to improve? I never played hockey, but from playing soccer and basketball, I think I understand the spacial relationship and nuances of the game (just never that great at skating ).

Heath, your assumptions are correct. On game nights, teams usually carry 12 forwards, 6 defensemen and 2 goalies. A top 6 forward would be one that plays on one of the scoring lines (1 or 2) and a top 4 defensemen would be one that played on of the top two defense pairings.

I really like Clowe.....when he plays mean. The guy is a beast on skates, but ever since he's improved skill-wise as a player, he's been playing a lot more of the Ferdinand the Bull role, which is not cool. Unfortunately for the Sharks, he probably won't put it all together (skills and toughness) until he gets traded. With players like him, it sometimes takes a slap in the face for them to get their head right.

As for +/-, I really don't care for the stat. I think it is only effective when it is taken in context with the team. For example, if everybody on the Sharks was a +20 and Clowe was at -1, that's a problem. However, even that can be misleading. I'll put in another post why I think that +/- is a little unreliable (especially when comparing players from different teams).

 

[filosofy29]

Why +/- is overrated and misunderstood (EDIT: in my humble opinion ). It is still a useful stat, but it needs to be examined way more than people care to think. In no way is it a litmus test to tell the use of a player.

1.) The most obvious factor: A guy makes a bad line change and player X jumps out on the ice just as the other team scores. So Player X is punished with a -1 even though he had no involvement with the play and did nothing wrong on defense yet is branded.

2.) Defensive specialists often aren't good at scoring. However, the only time you get a +1 is when you are on the ice for a non-Power Play goal. Defensive specialists also play against the teams TOP players. So not only do they not score that often, but they play against the players that DO score often. A really good defensive player might have a low/bad +/- (or at least in the negative) even if they do their job right a high percentage of the time.

3.) 5 Players on the ice can do a great job of defending their zone, but if one player screws up royally, they all get the -1. Imagine if you were doing an excellent job sticking with your man, you were on the defensive side of the puck and you had your guy smothered.....then all of a sudden a teammate gets deked out of their skates and a goal is scored. Does that mean that YOU are a bad defensive player??? Seems unfair to me.

4.) PP Specialists. Every goal counts the same for each team, but guys that are more proficient on the PP do not get a +1 when they score. What if a guy scored 3 power play goals, but was on for 1 goal against? He's got a net total of +2, but his box score line reads -1. I'll take that -1 anyday.

There are other reasons as well, but you are probably already bored to tears so I'll stop, lol.

 

[Heathbar012]

Why +/- is overrated and misunderstood. It is still a useful stat, but it needs to be examined way more than people care to think. In no way is it a litmus test to tell the use of a player.

1.) The most obvious factor: A guy makes a bad line change and player X jumps out on the ice just as the other team scores. So Player X is punished with a -1 even though he had no involvement with the play and did nothing wrong on defense yet is branded.

2.) Defensive specialists often aren't good at scoring. However, the only time you get a +1 is when you are on the ice for a non-Power Play goal. Defensive specialists also play against the teams TOP players. So not only do they not score that often, but they play against the players that DO score often. A really good defensive player might have a low/bad +/- (or at leas in the negative) even if they do their job right a high percentage of the time.

3.) 5 Players on the ice can do a great job of defending their zone, but if one player screws up royally, they all get the -1. Imagine if you were doing an excellent job sticking with your man, you were on the defensive side of the puck and you had your guy smothered.....then all of a sudden a teammate gets deked out of their skates and a goal is scored. Does that mean that YOU are a bad defensive player??? Seems unfair to me.

4.) PP Specialists. Every goal counts the same for each team, but guys that more proficient on the PP do not get a +1 when they score. What if a guy scored 3 power play goals, but was on for 1 goal against? He's got a net total of +2, but his box score line reads -1. I'll take that -1 anyday.

There are other reasons as well, but you are probably already bored to tears, lol.

I admit that I did have to take a break and grab some pretzels before finishing the second half of this post. . Thanks for the take. It stands to reason, and backs up everything that I've thought about +/- in basketball. I just wondered if die hard hockey fans put more stock in it than b-ball. It appears not. .

I appreciate the take on Clowe, too. I usually only catch about 10 regular season games and all of the playoffs. I did notice that he got a little timid in the playoffs, but I thought the whole team got that way (mostly against the Hawks). Whatever Wilson does, I hope it makes the team better, but I won't understand if it did until around the middle of the second round of the playoffs.

Either way, it still seems to me that the Sharks give the Bay Area the best chance at a sports championship in the near future, and even though hockey is probably my fifth or sixth favorite sport to watch, I know that the Stanley Cup is the coolest trophy in sports history.

 

[filosofy29]

I admit that I did have to take a break and grab some pretzels before finishing the second half of this post. . Thanks for the take. It stands to reason, and backs up everything that I've thought about +/- in basketball. I just wondered if die hard hockey fans put more stock in it than b-ball. It appears not. .

I appreciate the take on Clowe, too. I usually only catch about 10 regular season games and all of the playoffs. I did notice that he got a little timid in the playoffs, but I thought the whole team got that way (mostly against the Hawks). Whatever Wilson does, I hope it makes the team better, but I won't understand if it did until around the middle of the second round of the playoffs.

Either way, it still seems to me that the Sharks give the Bay Area the best chance at a sports championship in the near future, and even though hockey is probably my fifth or sixth favorite sport to watch, I know that the Stanley Cup is the coolest trophy in sports history.

LOL, sorry man, I love me some hockey. Baseball and Hockey are tied for first and then there's every other sport at a less significant level ;-)~
The funny thing is, that even a lot of hockey "experts" or "analysts" that actually write articles on the sport still LOVE +/-.....it truly baffles me.

I didn't even know they had +/- in basketball. I think I stopped watching the Warriors/Basketball after the Run TMC phase.

 

[Heathbar012]

LOL, sorry man, I love me some hockey. Baseball and Hockey are tied for first and then there's every other sport at a less significant level ;-)~
The funny thing is, that even a lot of hockey "experts" or "analysts" that actually write articles on the sport still LOVE +/-.....it truly baffles me.

I didn't even know they had +/- in basketball. I think I stopped watching the Warriors/Basketball after the Run TMC phase.

That might have been a wise move. . Things are looking up slightly now, though. Unfortunately, if you're not a fan of the Lakers or Heat this is not your year. Luckily, the West got weaker, so the Dubs have a shot at an eight-seed if they stay healthy.