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M's Trade Walker & Marte

Msfann

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I love getting another good hitter. Losing Walker kinda hurts though.
 

Mariners_44

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I like the deal. It's easy to feel like we got the shorter end of the stick when considering both the ceiling in Walker and what could have been two years ago had we traded him. This team is constructed to win now, we are not the Cubs. It sounds like Segura may have over shot his ceiling, but when you take the name Walker out of the deal it's an answer at SS for the now and future for a SP that threw for a mid 4.00 era. It's easy to say we should have gotten more for Walker, but hanging on to someone until his value stales isn't the way to get better either. We are getting guys that get on base in the offseason and I love it!
 

kcden

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Weren't we already going to be really thin at SP?
 

megalodon30

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I don't know about this. Trading Walker may not be the best move, but he wasn't exactly lights out this year. Wait and see, I guess.
 

unlvmariners

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Weren't we already going to be really thin at SP?
We are very very thin at SP. As it stands right now without any other moves we would be looking at at rotation probably along the lines of: Felix, Kuma, Paxton, then maybe Karns and Ariel Miranda. That's not even mentioning the depth beyond that because you are typically going to have about 10 different guys start games throughout the season.
Personally I think this trade will end up looking a lot better when everything is all said and done because I think it forces Dipoto to add decent starters and depth.
 

TheDman875

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I love this trade. Yea it sucks losing Walker, but the M's needed a top notch leadoff hitter badly and we got one of the top 5 in the majors numbers wise last season so the pricetag (Walker) was going to be hefty. Yea he doesn't walk a lot (Edgar will work with him) but he's just entering his prime, hit .319 last season, swiped 33 bases, 41 doubles, 7 triples, and only had 10 errors in 153 games, so a huge defensive upgrade as well. Even though he played 2B most of the season, I think he'll be just fine at SS.

Excellent move for an every day player and makes the M's a less stationary baserunning team which killed us last season at crucial times when we needed to manufacture runs.
 

PolarVortex

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We are very very thin at SP. As it stands right now without any other moves we would be looking at at rotation probably along the lines of: Felix, Kuma, Paxton, then maybe Karns and Ariel Miranda. That's not even mentioning the depth beyond that because you are typically going to have about 10 different guys start games throughout the season.
Personally I think this trade will end up looking a lot better when everything is all said and done because I think it forces Dipoto to add decent starters and depth.
I think Dipoto must have gotten a green light to sign an FA starting pitcher. Add to that the emergence of Miranda at the end of the season and that must be what gave them the confidence to trade Walker.
Miranda seemed legit from what little we saw of him. But, pitching in September is easier than pitching in May and June. So, I guess we will see what is.
 

Mariners_44

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We haven't even made it to the winter meetings and Jedi is probably the most active GM in baseball. Not only does he show that he wants to win, but it looks as if he truly has a game plan. These aren't lose canon moves to go out and get big names, they are gameplan moves that are making the team better. He has a lot of time to shape the pitching, not too worried.
 

unlvmariners

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I think Dipoto must have gotten a green light to sign an FA starting pitcher. Add to that the emergence of Miranda at the end of the season and that must be what gave them the confidence to trade Walker.
Miranda seemed legit from what little we saw of him. But, pitching in September is easier than pitching in May and June. So, I guess we will see what is.
I suspect the same thing. I wouldn't be surprised to see something happen on theach trade front either.
 

seattlefan75

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I like this trade I know a lot of M's fan have their head wrapped about Tai because he was such a highly regarded prospect but watching him pitch last season I was just not impressed. You guys remember when he struggled in the beginning of the season? If I remember correctly he was sent back down the minors and also dealing with injury I started growing some concern about him being a great Pitcher. I wanted Ketel Marte to become a stud SS but towards the end of the season his batting numbers started to tank maybe to fatigue I really dont know.

Now guys we got back an All Star short stop that can get 200 hits and lead off the top of the lineup. Its not like this guy is 33 years old he is only like 27. He can be our guy for the next 6-7 years for sure listen Tai may not pan out. There was nothing you can honestly see this season and last that could tell you that he would be a great talent.
 

SeattleCoug

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Yes we are currently thin at SP. However it's November and there isn't a game being played anytime soon. I'm willing to let the rest of the offseason play out. I'm sure Dipoto knows the rotation as currently constructed won't cut it
 

Banned 10x

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Yes we are currently thin at SP. However it's November and there isn't a game being played anytime soon. I'm willing to let the rest of the offseason play out. I'm sure Dipoto knows the rotation as currently constructed won't cut it


I love this trade and completely agree with you, Dipoto will trade for somebody to replace Walker.
 

JMR

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I'm iffy on it, didn't like it at first but coming around a bit with the more I learn about Segura. I don't think he's heralded much for his D, but he'll definitely be an offensive upgrade over Marte. And I know Marte wasn't great with the glove last year anyway, so reasonable to expect a push there.

I was hopeful on Walker still as the year ended. He had an up and down season, but he was pretty good and much more consistent down the stretch after the coaches tweaked his leg kick. The higher knee lift on the wind-up clearly made him tougher to hit. Time will tell if it was just a gimmick thing that will be figured out, but TW looked to me like a guy who could pitch well into his late 30s due to his size and pitching style. I like to hold onto guys like that.

I can see how the trade will help near & long term, but I also see some clear risks with it. Past trade failures may make it tougher to get behind this, but I'm willing to get on board with DiPoto and see what else he does now to round out the rotation.
 

Anointed One

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I like the move... Walker has been so inconsistent while we all waited for him to breakout but never saw it... We're getting a proven player at the leadoff spot... I like trading for a proven allstar type of a player like we did vs someone we keep waiting to breakout and live up to expectations... He may always be that up and down starter or he could possibly turn into the lights out player all of us have been waiting for... You take the risk and if we were to take one, this is the deal i'm comfortable with... We have our leadoff/SS positions established for years to come...
 

JMR

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I like the move... Walker has been so inconsistent while we all waited for him to breakout but never saw it... We're getting a proven player at the leadoff spot... I like trading for a proven allstar type of a player like we did vs someone we keep waiting to breakout and live up to expectations... He may always be that up and down starter or he could possibly turn into the lights out player all of us have been waiting for... You take the risk and if we were to take one, this is the deal i'm comfortable with... We have our leadoff/SS positions established for years to come...
My main hang-up on shipping off TW is it seems we traded pretty low. His stock was higher at pretty much every other point in his Mariners career than it was the day we traded him. Maybe it would've dipped lower here in the future, but then again maybe the delivery tweaks they made with him weren't just gimmicks and he would've matured into a solid top of the rotation guy for the next decade. I cannot recall exactly when he switched to that much higher leg kick, but his last 5 starts of the season were pretty dang good: 10 runs in 30.2 innings, 30 Ks, and the team was 4-1. I know he was inconsistent and at times pretty bad throughout the season, but that's not incredibly uncommon in younger pitchers. He got a lot of grief around here this year, but he gave up 3 runs or less in 17 of 25 starts (didn't give him credit for getting yanked after the 2nd inning one time either). I just can't agree that we "never saw it" with him.
 

wazzu31

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Well, they did try selling him high but it was vetoed. It's hard to sell high on a guy, Walker was essentially in Adam Jones shoes where they were a top rated prospect but didn't show anything consistent in the big leagues. You can only keep a guy in the minors so long to keep his value up. The bigger issue is player development that they keep having they have to keep trading their top prospects at low value, like Franklin and Miller. Jack Z and Bavasi were dumb with his value deals and Pat Gillick refused to trade guys until their value was nothing, but Dipoto doesn't really have an option on selling low. Eventually they need to develop guys.
 

JMR

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Well, they did try selling him high but it was vetoed. It's hard to sell high on a guy, Walker was essentially in Adam Jones shoes where they were a top rated prospect but didn't show anything consistent in the big leagues. You can only keep a guy in the minors so long to keep his value up. The bigger issue is player development that they keep having they have to keep trading their top prospects at low value, like Franklin and Miller. Jack Z and Bavasi were dumb with his value deals and Pat Gillick refused to trade guys until their value was nothing, but Dipoto doesn't really have an option on selling low. Eventually they need to develop guys.
Ok, so they only get 2 MLB seasons to show something consistent and develop? Some fans act like Walker has been up for 3 or 4 years and not done a thing. There were people in here who had already written of TW in the middle of this past season, so 1.5 years as a big leaguer.
 

wazzu31

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Ok, so they only get 2 MLB seasons to show something consistent and develop? Some fans act like Walker has been up for 3 or 4 years and not done a thing. There were people in here who had already written of TW in the middle of this past season, so 1.5 years as a big leaguer.

I get the frustration with that line of thinking but Walker has only been in the big league for 1.5 seasons because of himself, he could've had 3 full seasons in by now had he had the work ethic and attitude (according to reports). IMO he is the epitome of type of prospect you can try to maximize as much as you can in a deal and just live with the consequences if he turns out a star somewhere else. He wasn't messed with like so many other highly regarded Mariners prospects, was given every opportunity to become successful and just couldn't with this organization, whether his fault, the organizations or a combination of the two. He still had value and you can't just let it rot until nothing like Ackley's did.
 

JMR

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I get the frustration with that line of thinking but Walker has only been in the big league for 1.5 seasons because of himself, he could've had 3 full seasons in by now had he had the work ethic and attitude (according to reports). IMO he is the epitome of type of prospect you can try to maximize as much as you can in a deal and just live with the consequences if he turns out a star somewhere else. He wasn't messed with like so many other highly regarded Mariners prospects, was given every opportunity to become successful and just couldn't with this organization, whether his fault, the organizations or a combination of the two. He still had value and you can't just let it rot until nothing like Ackley's did.
I dunno, seems to me like most of the time pitching prospects get a lot more time to develop than what Walker had here before we decide "he just couldn't with this organization". I hope this one doesn't blow up in our face.
 
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