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SteelersPride

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Tampa was a young team with a lot of talent... They weren’t an aging team looking to take one last shot before rebuilding. Sure, I guess any team can catch lightning in a bottle. Tampa was a team last year that oozed with potential, but a QB who tossed 30+ INTs... I think their path was a bit more obvious. I don’t see as obvious a fix for Pittsburgh.
Yep, and they will soon be without some wide receivers, and qbs, and running backs.. they took their shot, and won... and will pay for it in a few years.

why do you keep referencing pittsburgh. I kee saying im not talking about pittsburgh. Saying in general
 

Payton

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Yep, and they will soon be without some wide receivers, and qbs, and running backs.. they took their shot, and won... and will pay for it in a few years.

why do you keep referencing pittsburgh. I kee saying im not talking about pittsburgh. Saying in general
Did you not see that my Blackhawks reference was a direct reply to the discussion about whether Pittsburgh should try for another ring? I thought that was the focal point of the entire discussion... If not, I really need to hone my reading skills..
 

Payton

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Yep, and they will soon be without some wide receivers, and qbs, and running backs.. they took their shot, and won... and will pay for it in a few years.

why do you keep referencing pittsburgh. I kee saying im not talking about pittsburgh. Saying in general
Anyway, in reference to Tampa... As I understand it the one Linebacker is the only big time free agent... Could be wrong.. Fournette? Gronk? Meh.. Then Brady is done (probably) after 21/22 and the Bucs move on... Either way, they did win, so that IS worth a bit of a mess for a few years...
 

SteelersPride

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Anyway, in reference to Tampa... As I understand it the one Linebacker is the only big time free agent... Could be wrong.. Fournette? Gronk? Meh.. Then Brady is done (probably) after 21/22 and the Bucs move on... Either way, they did win, so that IS worth a bit of a mess for a few years...
Godwin coming up, the tight end, the qb, rojo, fournette. Ab as well, the lb...alot...They have a lot of pieces. 2021 NFL Free Agents Tracker

Not all big name guys, but like a great defense, its those rotation and 3rd-4th CB's, and rotational line guys that take the good and make them great.
Did you not see that my Blackhawks reference was a direct reply to the discussion about whether Pittsburgh should try for another ring? I thought that was the focal point of the entire discussion... If not, I really need to hone my reading skills..
Looking back, i was not clear in what i was trying to say that's on me, my fault, apologies.
 

HaroldSeattle

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1613628234024.png

Sounds about right, surely they draft another RB. How early is the question, with having no 1st or 3rd round pick seems unlikely to use their 2nd round pick on a RB, but Carroll just might IDK. Waiting until round 4 or 5 means likely slim pickings although maybe Javonte Williams could still be available.
I would guess that unless they draft Harris in the 2nd round, Penny is going to get first crack at being the workhorse. Penny and Williams would make for a decent RB duo.
 

TREFF

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View attachment 265424

Sounds about right, surely they draft another RB. How early is the question, with having no 1st or 3rd round pick seems unlikely to use their 2nd round pick on a RB, but Carroll just might IDK. Waiting until round 4 or 5 means likely slim pickings although maybe Javonte Williams could still be available.
I would guess that unless they draft Harris in the 2nd round, Penny is going to get first crack at being the workhorse. Penny and Williams would make for a decent RB duo.
I dunno that Harris goes in the first, possible he does, but, I sure can't see him falling to 56. The Jets would have to pass on him 3 times, the Dolphins 4. Not to mention a couple Cardinals picks, Steelers, Falcons..and that's assuming Jacksonville decides Robinson is good enough.

Seattle likely needs to trade up if he's their guy..Williams would be tough too..either reach on him a little at 56, or trade back into the late 2nd/early third to get him, wouldn't bank on him reaching the 4th
 

HaroldSeattle

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I dunno that Harris goes in the first, possible he does, but, I sure can't see him falling to 56. The Jets would have to pass on him 3 times, the Dolphins 4. Not to mention a couple Cardinals picks, Steelers, Falcons..and that's assuming Jacksonville decides Robinson is good enough.

Seattle likely needs to trade up if he's their guy..Williams would be tough too..either reach on him a little at 56, or trade back into the late 2nd/early third to get him, wouldn't bank on him reaching the 4th
Your probably right, but teams have lots of needs. Some need QBs and of course that position gets over drafted, pass rushers, OL seem to go before RBs get picked so I’m holding onto the dream until it fails me. I don’t see much value in drafting for the Homer and Dallas types. At least they have Penny,but he needs to stay on the field.
Harris won’t last until the 4th round that I agree on, but maybe the Seahawks consider him in the second round?
 

Trudem

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Your probably right, but teams have lots of needs. Some need QBs and of course that position gets over drafted, pass rushers, OL seem to go before RBs get picked so I’m holding onto the dream until it fails me. I don’t see much value in drafting for the Homer and Dallas types. At least they have Penny,but he needs to stay on the field.
Harris won’t last until the 4th round that I agree on, but maybe the Seahawks consider him in the second round?
Honestly Jamaal Williams would be a good fit for you guys. Physical back that can also catch passes and block.
 

Payton

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I dunno that Harris goes in the first, possible he does, but, I sure can't see him falling to 56. The Jets would have to pass on him 3 times, the Dolphins 4. Not to mention a couple Cardinals picks, Steelers, Falcons..and that's assuming Jacksonville decides Robinson is good enough.

Seattle likely needs to trade up if he's their guy..Williams would be tough too..either reach on him a little at 56, or trade back into the late 2nd/early third to get him, wouldn't bank on him reaching the 4th

Why is it that everyone has Miami pegged for taking a RB in round 1 or 2? Gaskin looked MORE than capable and Ahmed seemed to be an adequate back up... Just seems that RB is more of a luxury pick and I’m not sure the Fins are in a “luxury” position... And this is just me asking you because you’re the last to bring it up... I’m seeing this everywhere...

Is it like a Marlon Mack situation, where he just isn’t a “sexy” big name, so no matter what he did, he was always going to be replaced?
 

TREFF

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Your probably right, but teams have lots of needs. Some need QBs and of course that position gets over drafted, pass rushers, OL seem to go before RBs get picked so I’m holding onto the dream until it fails me. I don’t see much value in drafting for the Homer and Dallas types. At least they have Penny,but he needs to stay on the field.
Harris won’t last until the 4th round that I agree on, but maybe the Seahawks consider him in the second round?
If the smoke surrounding RW's "frustration", has any legs to it at all, I would expect a strong push for OL with at least that 2nd rounder. A RB would be nice, but like you said, teams have others needs. And with them still sitting on former #1 Penny, wouldn't it make more sense to resign Hyde on the cheap, or, like Trudeau mentioned, J. Williams, or someone similar?

I envision N. Harris going to Miami, NyJ, ATL, or Pitt. If I were to put money on it, I'd bet on Pitt or Atl, teams with real need, and cap problems that would make it rough to go with a free agent.

But since when has common sense ever dictated how the draft plays out? The friggin Patriots might take him at 15 or 46, just to fuck with us.
 

TREFF

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Why is it that everyone has Miami pegged for taking a RB in round 1 or 2? Gaskin looked MORE than capable and Ahmed seemed to be an adequate back up... Just seems that RB is more of a luxury pick and I’m not sure the Fins are in a “luxury” position... And this is just me asking you because you’re the last to bring it up... I’m seeing this everywhere...

Is it like a Marlon Mack situation, where he just isn’t a “sexy” big name, so no matter what he did, he was always going to be replaced?
Gaskin looked slightly adequate. I never got a chance to personally watch Ahmed, so I won't offer a specific opinion on him, but he certainly wasn't anything exceptional. Regardless, they are both "replacement level talent", or, another way of saying it, good enough to get by until something better comes along. Well there's multiple "something betters" available in the draft, and multiple "something betters" available in free agency. If the Phil's go yet another year of not addressing the mediocrity at RB, it'll be a disservice to what they're trying to do with Tua. If you're going all in on this kid, you've gotta get him something besides Parker and Gesiki to rely on.
And if the playoffs/SuperBowl proved anything, it's that good RB's, are not luxury items. Teams that can't run the ball effectively, don't win Super Bowls very often. Brady barely cleared 200 yards and they crushed the Chiefs, because the Chiefs couldn't run the ball even though there was never a focus on the defense to stop the run, and they knew they couldn't pass protect. Even the Chiefs '19 win was centered around Williams, even if Mahommes did screw him out of the MVP.

The pass happy stuff sells tickets, makes us fantasy footballers happy, drives ratings, and gets analytics acolytes excited, but in the end, defense and balanced, efficient offenses win titles. And you can't have a balanced, efficient offense without a good RB.

Personally, I think they address RB in free agency, an Aaron Jones signing makes a ton of sense, and go OL/WR/and hit defense with their 4 picks in the first two rounds. But the need is there, and the opportunity is there, so it's pretty linear thought to think they very well could use one on Harris, Etienne or maybe even Williams.
 

TREFF

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Wow, local Denver radio Boys just reported Wentz to the Colts for a 3rd rounder...
As per usual, the local Denver radio Boys got it wrong..

Colts acquired Carson Wentz from the Eagles in exchange for a 2021 third-round pick and conditional 2022 second-round pick.​

The conditional second-rounder becomes a first-round pick if Wentz plays 75 percent of the snaps or 70 percent and the team makes the playoffs.
 

SmokingMonkey

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Why is it that everyone has Miami pegged for taking a RB in round 1 or 2? Gaskin looked MORE than capable and Ahmed seemed to be an adequate back up... Just seems that RB is more of a luxury pick and I’m not sure the Fins are in a “luxury” position... And this is just me asking you because you’re the last to bring it up... I’m seeing this everywhere...

Is it like a Marlon Mack situation, where he just isn’t a “sexy” big name, so no matter what he did, he was always going to be replaced?

Gaskin looked slightly adequate. I never got a chance to personally watch Ahmed, so I won't offer a specific opinion on him, but he certainly wasn't anything exceptional. Regardless, they are both "replacement level talent", or, another way of saying it, good enough to get by until something better comes along. Well there's multiple "something betters" available in the draft, and multiple "something betters" available in free agency. If the Phil's go yet another year of not addressing the mediocrity at RB, it'll be a disservice to what they're trying to do with Tua. If you're going all in on this kid, you've gotta get him something besides Parker and Gesiki to rely on.

Marlon Mack situation is a great comp, and Treff outlines the reason - it isn't about them (Mack/Gaskins) not being big names, but entirely about them being average or replaceable.

Mack had a great season 2yrs ago, and by most evaluations, he still left a ton of yards on the field behind the Colts OL. The RBs that it's worth retaining and, dare I say, worth signing to a 2nd contract, are the ones that gobble up everything given then have the ability to create more on top.
The rest of them are all situation/opportunity dependent and can be interchanged with some 40-60 other good RBs trying to get their chance.

Could totally see Miami using a 2nd or 3rd rd pick on a RB, but also totally plan on them using their 2 early first rounds picks on OL/WR
 

Payton

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Hmmmm, guess I saw Gaskin totally different (Possible I watched more Miami games due to my daughter being a fan?). He battled for extra yards and ran extremely hard and did very well when healthy. Honestly, Tua is showing all the signs of a ‘Bama QB bust to me... but I get that the Dolphins don’t give up on him just yet. They need WRs that can stay on the field first and foremost. That is how you compliment Gesicki... O Line, draft a Minkah Fitxpatrick replacement and build one of those teams that any ole schlub RB can succeed behind... Gaskin was hardly the problem for Miami last year. If anything, he was a surprise success... and that is what I meant with the Mack comparison. He did everything you could have asked of him, so is it just that you don’t trust it because he wasn’t supposed to? JMO.
 

Payton

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Marlon Mack situation is a great comp, and Treff outlines the reason - it isn't about them (Mack/Gaskins) not being big names, but entirely about them being average or replaceable.

Mack had a great season 2yrs ago, and by most evaluations, he still left a ton of yards on the field behind the Colts OL. The RBs that it's worth retaining and, dare I say, worth signing to a 2nd contract, are the ones that gobble up everything given then have the ability to create more on top.
The rest of them are all situation/opportunity dependent and can be interchanged with some 40-60 other good RBs trying to get their chance.

Could totally see Miami using a 2nd or 3rd rd pick on a RB, but also totally plan on them using their 2 early first rounds picks on OL/WR
Ahhh, “replaceable” is actually a perfect word. Can they upgrade Gaskin in the draft? Sure! Is it a critical need? Not based on what I saw and the numbers put up when healthy... And this is with a marginal passing game, mind you.
 

SmokingMonkey

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Hmmmm, guess I saw Gaskin totally different (Possible I watched more Miami games due to my daughter being a fan?). He battled for extra yards and ran extremely hard and did very well when healthy. Honestly, Tua is showing all the signs of a ‘Bama QB bust to me... but I get that the Dolphins don’t give up on him just yet. They need WRs that can stay on the field first and foremost. That is how you compliment Gesicki... O Line, draft a Minkah Fitxpatrick replacement and build one of those teams that any ole schlub RB can succeed behind... Gaskin was hardly the problem for Miami last year. If anything, he was a surprise success... and that is what I meant with the Mack comparison. He did everything you could have asked of him, so is it just that you don’t trust it because he wasn’t supposed to? JMO.

I trust it once FA and the draft passes us by, and they didn't make any significant additions to the RB room. Agree with you completely that RB isn't a need for Miami, but also think that they do everything possible to make Tua fit after the last few picks have all failed. So that typically means beefing up the OL and giving the QB weapons. Parker/Preston/1st rd pick, Gesicki already at TE....so that really just leaves us with RB left to use any draft capital against to help Tua.

In true Patriots fashion, the coaching staff put together a great defensive unit with cast-aways and no-name guys. I don't expect them to use a 1st or 2nd round pick on D unless someone high on their board falls
 

TREFF

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I trust it once FA and the draft passes us by, and they didn't make any significant additions to the RB room. Agree with you completely that RB isn't a need for Miami, but also think that they do everything possible to make Tua fit after the last few picks have all failed. So that typically means beefing up the OL and giving the QB weapons. Parker/Preston/1st rd pick, Gesicki already at TE....so that really just leaves us with RB left to use any draft capital against to help Tua.

In true Patriots fashion, the coaching staff put together a great defensive unit with cast-aways and no-name guys. I don't expect them to use a 1st or 2nd round pick on D unless someone high on their board falls
I see RB as a need, but yes, far from the most pressing need. Which is why I think they add a free agent with all that cap room as opposed to burning draft capital where they can lock up picks "cheaply" for 4-5 years, especially the likely OT they grab, those don't come around as FA's very often, and when they do, they're generally too beat up to be worth it.
 
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