1919 Reds

[JohnU]

I am currently organizing an outline and some characters for a fiction of the 1919 Reds up to and including the W.S. with the Black Sox.

This isn't a definitive history but I think it will be fun to write. What happens after that is the comment all writers are told: Write it first, worry about it later.

I have found a few interesting tidbits so far that I will share if you are interested. I would also like links to photos of that era to give me some imagery.

Were you aware: There was a reference to Redlegs in the 1919 season. I had always believed it was only a Cold War nickname. But it makes sense.

 

[tomcat1]

I am currently organizing an outline and some characters for a fiction of the 1919 Reds up to and including the W.S. with the Black Sox.

This isn't a definitive history but I think it will be fun to write. What happens after that is the comment all writers are told: Write it first, worry about it later.

I have found a few interesting tidbits so far that I will share if you are interested. I would also like links to photos of that era to give me some imagery.

Were you aware: There was a reference to Redlegs in the 1919 season. I had always believed it was only a Cold War nickname. But it makes sense.

Hey John, Very Interesting! I have nothing to contribute at the moment but I can assure you that I will contribute later when you have finished your writing to help it to become a best seller. Good luck in compiling and completing your project which I will be looking forward to reading.

 

[JohnU]

Hey John, Very Interesting! I have nothing to contribute at the moment but I can assure you that I will contribute later when you have finished your writing to help it to become a best seller. Good luck in compiling and completing your project which I will be looking forward to reading.

Many many components to this story, given the uniqueness of the year -- the 1919 pennant race is just another part of it. The year itself is probably one of the most pivotal in U.S. history.

 

[tomcat1]

Many many components to this story, given the uniqueness of the year -- the 1919 pennant race is just another part of it. The year itself is probably one of the most pivotal in U.S. history.

My dad and mom were both born in 1919 and of course if they were still living they would both be 100 years old this year so that was a very important year to me too.

Maybe you should be writing about the 2019 Reds because I think they are going to be much better this season with the moves they have made.

 

[JohnU]

My dad and mom were both born in 1919 and of course if they were still living they would both be 100 years old this year so that was a very important year to me too.

Maybe you should be writing about the 2019 Reds because I think they are going to be much better this season with the moves they have made.

My mom was also born that year.
The 1919 season is intriguing enough on its own. Add in Prohibition and the Black Sox, that's too good to pass up. Plus the post-war world was really bizarre. The old newspapers are full of cool stuff.

 

[tomcat1]

My mom was also born that year.
The 1919 season is intriguing enough on its own. Add in Prohibition and the Black Sox, that's too good to pass up. Plus the post-war world was really bizarre. The old newspapers are full of cool stuff.

Are we both saying that we are getting old since we have parents who were born in 1919?

I do understand what you are saying about the year 1919 and like I said I will be looking forward to reading what you come up with after you do your research and writing.

 

[JohnU]

The most interesting thing I've found so far is that the team was being managed by Christy Matthewson, the Great One. Matty had retired three years earlier, still wasn't all that old.

Matty had, however, gone off to war in August of 1918 and while there, was accidentally afflicted by exposure to a chemical that was being ruthlessly used by the Kaiser's army during WW1 (was made illegal after the conflict) ...

So the Reds owner, "Mister Herrmann," had cabled Matty in January about whether Matty would be interested in managing again. As a week went by, he hadn't gotten a rely. He told the Enquirer that he would hire Moran if he didn't hear from Matty "within a few days."

So they started looking for a new manager. They ended up hiring Pat Moran. I didn't learn if Matty had replied to the cable or if he did and said he was too sick to manage.

The poison gas accident shortened Matty's life.

I don't know if Herrmann knew that Matty had been stricken or if he didn't care. He likely did know, which was why he was interviewing Moran.

Sad story. Moran proved to be a pretty good manager.

 

[tomcat1]

The most interesting thing I've found so far is that the team was being managed by Christy Matthewson, the Great One. Matty had retired three years earlier, still wasn't all that old.

Matty had, however, gone off to war in August of 1918 and while there, was accidentally afflicted by exposure to a chemical that was being ruthlessly used by the Kaiser's army during WW1 (was made illegal after the conflict) ...

So the Reds owner, "Mister Herrmann," had cabled Matty in January about whether Matty would be interested in managing again. As a week went by, he hadn't gotten a rely. He told the Enquirer that he would hire Moran if he didn't hear from Matty "within a few days."

So they started looking for a new manager. They ended up hiring Pat Moran. I didn't learn if Matty had replied to the cable or if he did and said he was too sick to manage.

The poison gas accident shortened Matty's life.

I don't know if Herrmann knew that Matty had been stricken or if he didn't care. He likely did know, which was why he was interviewing Moran.

Sad story. Moran proved to be a pretty good manager.

Now that's very interesting!

If you have a public library near you with a good research department I've got a feeling you will be able to dig up a lot more about this topic. Just a suggestion which I'm sure you've already thought about.

 

[JohnU]

From January 1919, Chicago Tribune:

Felsch spent most of 1918 in the Army. I don't know what he meant about not expecting trouble ... but a year later, Hap would find plenty of it.

 

[tomcat1]

From January 1919, Chicago Tribune:

Felsch spent most of 1918 in the Army. I don't know what he meant about not expecting trouble ... but a year later, Hap would find plenty of it.

View attachment 196720

Now you are digging deep!

 

[JohnU]

Essentially it was 100 years ago on this date that Pat Moran was named manager of the Reds. "Matty" did not respond to the cable since he was in France, recovering from exposure to chemical weapons.

Sad story but effectively the difference for the 1919 W.S. winners.

 

[JohnU]

The above story is pretty hard to read but there is a reference that says ... "No decision handed down ... " in the Hal Chase case.

Chase was involved in throwing games and was basically run out of Cincy by his teammates. Chase went to the Giants the next year and was essentially kicked out of baseball later on. The court case involved several Reds players who testified against Chase.

Meanwhile, the Giants tried to minimize his corrupt activities so they could get him. He was a good hitter. The Giants evidently didn't care. Gambling was common in those days. Chase was called the most corrupt player in history.

One assumes Moran would not have been too kind to Chase.

 

[tomcat1]

The above story is pretty hard to read but there is a reference that says ... "No decision handed down ... " in the Hal Chase case.

Chase was involved in throwing games and was basically run out of Cincy by his teammates. Chase went to the Giants the next year and was essentially kicked out of baseball later on. The court case involved several Reds players who testified against Chase.

Meanwhile, the Giants tried to minimize his corrupt activities so they could get him. He was a good hitter. The Giants evidently didn't care. Gambling was common in those days. Chase was called the most corrupt player in history.

One assumes Moran would not have been too kind to Chase.

Thanks for sharing because I love baseball history.

 

[JohnU]

I found a SABR biography on one of the pitchers -- Dolf Luque (Loo-key) who was a Cuban born pitcher who was 27-8 in 1923 (There was no CY Young winner in those days).
Luque played in the 1919 Series with the Reds and again as a member of the 1933 Giants.

Luque was a rare Cuban, being light-skinned so he could play. Others were not so lucky.

He was only 5-feet-7 but was pretty intense. Got into a fight once that shaped his legend and thst of other Latin players. His widow says he never died, but is in the Bermuda Triangle.

 

[tomcat1]

I found a SABR biography on one of the pitchers -- Dolf Luque (Loo-key) who was a Cuban born pitcher who was 27-8 in 1923 (There was no CY Young winner in those days).
Luque played in the 1919 Series with the Reds and again as a member of the 1933 Giants.

Luque was a rare Cuban, being light-skinned so he could play. Others were not so lucky.

He was only 5-feet-7 but was pretty intense. Got into a fight once that shaped his legend and thst of other Latin players. His widow says he never died, but is in the Bermuda Triangle.

That's interesting! It appears that you and I are the only ones here who like baseball history.

 

[JohnU]

That's interesting! It appears that you and I are the only ones here who like baseball history.

There are others. Baseball fans know their moments.

 

[tomcat1]

There are others. Baseball fans know their moments.

Okay, but I have found what you have posted here to be very interesting.

Maybe I should start a thread on 'The Gas House Gang' or a thread about how the New York Yankees bought over half of their 27 world series championships but that probably wouldn't sell either.

 

[JohnU]

 

[JohnU]

I love the old style writing of a century ago. Sad that nobody is participating in this with me.

 

[Jiddy]

I'm with you.

I think the White Sox are gonna pull it off despite the rumors that they might have been paid to lose.