Pat Forde's realignment plan.

Thiefery · Jul 5, 2020

Deep Creek said:
This reminds me of my time as superintendent in a small school district. Most small schools join together to provide special education services in a cooperative manner. We had one school district that was growing and getting close to being large enough to go it alone. In fact, being in the co-op was costing them more. I could see they were getting ready to go it alone and that was going to hit us hard. We needed them, they didn't need us. Myself and two other superintendents motioned for the other schools to collectively pick up the extra expenses in order to entice the larger district to remain in the co-op. We got out voted 4-3. Because some of the smaller ones wouldn't pick up an extra 6-8%, our cost to provide special education services went up 15% per year for the next three years! Penny wise, pound foolish.

Let's face it. Texas Tech, TCU and K-State need OU and Texas to make it. OU and Texas would make it without them. Same can be said for every other P5 conference.

And this is why the un equal revenue was set up when the Big 12 launched. It was a lightning rod of the excuses why certain teams left but looking back at it.. it was a good model.

Big 12 could go back to it, but with UT and ou having its own tier 3 deal, it won't.

Olyduck · Jul 5, 2020

Deep Creek said:
This reminds me of my time as superintendent in a small school district. Most small schools join together to provide special education services in a cooperative manner. We had one school district that was growing and getting close to being large enough to go it alone. In fact, being in the co-op was costing them more. I could see they were getting ready to go it alone and that was going to hit us hard. We needed them, they didn't need us. Myself and two other superintendents motioned for the other schools to collectively pick up the extra expenses in order to entice the larger district to remain in the co-op. We got out voted 4-3. Because some of the smaller ones wouldn't pick up an extra 6-8%, our cost to provide special education services went up 15% per year for the next three years! Penny wise, pound foolish.

Let's face it. Texas Tech, TCU and K-State need OU and Texas to make it. OU and Texas would make it without them. Same can be said for every other P5 conference.

Could kansas survive on bball alone tho?

Olyduck · Jul 5, 2020

PhilSimms11 said:
G-5

AAC (10)
Army
Buffalo
East Carolina
FAU
FIU
Marshall
Navy
So Florida
Temple
UCF

C-USA (10)
LA Tech
Mid Tennessee
No Illinois
Rice
So Miss
Tulane
Tulsa
UAB
UTSA
W Kentucky

MAC (10)
Akron
Ball St
Bowling Green
C Michigan
E Michigan
Kent St
Miami (OH)
Ohio
Toledo
W Michigan

Sun Belt (10)
App St
Arkansas St
Co Carolina
GA Southern
Georgia St
Louisiana
So Alabama
Texas St
Troy
UL-Monroe

WAC (10)
Air Force
Boise St
Colorado St
Fresno St
Hawaii
Nevada
San Diego St
UNLV
Utah St
Wyoming

So you dropped 10 programs completely instead of another 10 team conference?

PhilSimms11 · Jul 5, 2020

Olyduck said:
So you dropped 10 programs completely instead of another 10 team conference?

I relegated:
Charlotte
Liberty
New Mexico
New Mexico St
Old Dominion
Rutgers
San Jose St
UConn
UMass
UTEP

I created 7 power conferences and 5 non-power conferences. Each would have a separate playoff.

Deep Creek · Jul 5, 2020

Olyduck said:
Could kansas survive on bball alone tho?

Hell yeah. The entire Big East does for the most part. Creighton, Marquette, Seton Hall.....

Olyduck · Jul 6, 2020

PhilSimms11 said:
I relegated:
Charlotte
Liberty
New Mexico
New Mexico St
Old Dominion
Rutgers
San Jose St
UConn
UMass
UTEP

I created 7 power conferences and 5 non-power conferences. Each would have a separate playoff.

but why relegate these teams down? Rutgers from Power 5 to FCS??
a few of these are just a few years removed from moving up and have had better success than some you kept.
I feel like you could easily add these or mix them in and still have competitive conferences of 10 and all you would do is change you playoff to 6 and 2 instead of 5 and 3.

MAIZEandBLUE09 · Jul 6, 2020

This is a bad plan. FBS should be around 65 teams; P5 teams. The other teams should play for a different national title. Anything less is just using them as a punching bag and for them to get money to continue existing as a major punching bag. CFB should be consolidated and league champs should face off in a playoff. Benefits: it keeps games meaningful, historic bowl matchups can be restored and there's no guessing who gets into a playoff. Win your league, go to the playoff.

6 10-11 team conferences, round robin schedules with 2-ish OOC games, 8 team playoff - conference champs + 2 at large in case one conference has multiple elite teams.

Olyduck · Jul 6, 2020

MAIZEandBLUE09 said:
This is a bad plan. FBS should be around 65 teams; P5 teams. The other teams should play for a different national title. Anything less is just using them as a punching bag and for them to get money to continue existing as a major punching bag. CFB should be consolidated and league champs should face off in a playoff. Benefits: it keeps games meaningful, historic bowl matchups can be restored and there's no guessing who gets into a playoff. Win your league, go to the playoff.

6 10-11 team conferences, round robin schedules with 2-ish OOC games, 8 team playoff - conference champs + 2 at large in case one conference has multiple elite teams.

Afraid Appalachian State will get you again?

MAIZEandBLUE09 · Jul 6, 2020

Olyduck said:
Afraid Appalachian State will get you again?

Not necessarily. I just think it's dumb that App State went from a 3x national champ, to FBS and now has a 0% shot at ever winning a national title.

Olyduck · Jul 6, 2020

MAIZEandBLUE09 said:
Not necessarily. I just think it's dumb that App State went from a 3x national champ, to FBS and now has a 0% shot at ever winning a national title.

under Forde new system that chance would increase tho

PhilSimms11 · Jul 6, 2020

Olyduck said:
So you dropped 10 programs completely instead of another 10 team conference?

Okay, I made some alterations. I'm not sure how the Big 8 operates without Oklahoma and Texas.

--I moved No Texas and SMU from SWC to C-USA.
--Moved Nebraska, Oklahoma, Oklahoma St to the SWC.
--Moved Arkansas from SWC to Big 8. Big 8 now with 8 teams (the fewest).
--Put No Illinois and Buffalo back in the MAC, giving it 12 teams (the most).
--Created the ECC (East Coast Conference) from many of the 10 teams I originally relegated.
--Promoted James Madison to the G-6.
--Kept San Jose St relegated.
--Tweaked some G-6 conferences as well.
--P-7 = 68; G-6 = 62

ACC (10)
Clemson
Duke
Florida St
GA Tech
Maryland
NC St
No Carolina
So Carolina
Virginia
Wake Forest

Big 8 (8)
Arkansas
BYU
Colorado
Iowa St
Kansas
Kansas St
Missouri
Utah

Big Ten (10)
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Michigan
Michigan St
Minnesota
Northwestern
Ohio St
Purdue
Wisconsin

Big East (10)
Boston College
Cincinnati
Louisville
Miami (FL)
Notre Dame
Penn St
Pitt
Syracuse
VA Tech
West Virginia

Pac-10 (10)
Arizona
Arizona St
Cal
Oregon
Oregon St
Stanford
UCLA
USC
Washington
Washington St

SEC (10)
Alabama
Auburn
Florida
Georgia
Kentucky
LSU
Mississippi St
Ole Miss
Tennessee
Vanderbilt

SWC (10)
Baylor
Houston
Memphis
Nebraska
Oklahoma
Oklahoma St
TCU
Texas
Texas A&M
Texas Tech
-------------
AAC (10)
App St
Army
Marshall
Mid Tennessee
Navy
So Florida
Temple
UAB
UCF
W Kentucky

C-USA (10)
Arkansas St
LA Tech
New Mexico
No Texas
Rice
SMU
So Miss
Tulane
Tulsa
UTSA

ECC (10)
Charlotte
East Carolina
FAU
FIU
James Madison
Liberty
Old Dominion
Rutgers
UConn
UMass

MAC (12)
Akron
Ball St
Buffalo
Bowling Green
C Michigan
E Michigan
Kent St
Miami (OH)
No Illinois
Ohio
Toledo
W Michigan

Sun Belt (10)
Co Carolina
GA Southern
Georgia St
Louisiana
New Mexico St
So Alabama
Texas St
Troy
UL-Monroe
UTEP

WAC (10)
Air Force
Boise St
Colorado St
Fresno St
Hawaii
Nevada
San Diego St
UNLV
Utah St
Wyoming

Blackshirts BLVD · Jul 6, 2020

This is a conference of hate.

SWC (10)
Baylor
Houston
Memphis
Nebraska
Oklahoma
Oklahoma St
TCU
Texas
Texas A&M
Texas Tech

LawDawg · Jul 6, 2020

Deep Creek said:
That is already happening in the P5s isn't it? The only reason Northwestern and Illinois receive as much as they do is because the networks are willing to pay a larger hunk if Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State, etc are in the package. Remove those three, and the amount the networks would be willing to pay would drop like a rock.

I recall Chris Del Conte (prior to going to Texas) saying the only reason TCU was able to do what they have is because the networks are willing to pay the conference a lot of money because OU and Texas are in it. Without them the payout wouldn't be very large. While every school gets 10% of Tier 1 and Tier 2, the total is as high as it is because of those two. Same for every conference. Those revenue generators are willing to share with the others in order to have a conference...mainly for the other sports.

Teams like Vandy, Ky, Kansas, Illinois, and NW are Haves, not Have Nots. Just because they don't win doesn't mean they don't provide value to the conference. Some are basketball powers, some in other sports, some provide academic excellence, et. All have been in their conferences for close to a century so they have tradition. Sure, they don't bring in much for TV revenue, but they are better than FIU, FAU, Georgia Southern, and the like.

Although it may be amusing to post all there possibilities, there is no way something like this will ever happen. You just won't see 100 years of tradition ditched, and teams kicked to the curb.

LawDawg · Jul 6, 2020

Olyduck said:
70%??? He has UGA with Florida, Florida St. Miami, GT, and 2 of the better G5 teams this past decade. Id hardly say 70%

Well, I see it this way:
"Have nots": UCF, FAU, FIU, UAB, USF, GaState, GaSouthern
"Haves": UF, FSU, Miami, GaTech

That's 7 of 11, have nots, or 63%. So close enough to 70% for my quick math.

We already play UF and GaTech every year. If you think any Dawg wants UCF, FAU, FIU, UAB, USF, GaState, GaSouthern instead of Auburn, USCjr, UT, Ky, Mizzou, Vandy and rotating games against Bama, LSU, TAMU, etc., you're crazy.

PhilSimms11 · Jul 6, 2020

Blackshirts BLVD said:
This is a conference of hate.

Is that a good thing?

Olyduck · Jul 6, 2020

its a hard guess tho teams that have moved up like Utah and TCU have had success. Louisville has had ups and downs. Rutgers not so much

LawDawg said:
Well, I see it this way:
"Have nots": UCF, FAU, FIU, UAB, USF, GaState, GaSouthern
"Haves": UF, FSU, Miami, GaTech

That's 7 of 11, have nots, or 63%. So close enough to 70% for my quick math.

We already play UF and GaTech every year. If you think any Dawg wants UCF, FAU, FIU, UAB, USF, GaState, GaSouthern instead of Auburn, USCjr, UT, Ky, Mizzou, Vandy and rotating games against Bama, LSU, TAMU, etc., you're crazy.

still upset about UCF beating UGA 10 years ago?

LawDawg · Jul 6, 2020

Olyduck said:
its a hard guess tho teams that have moved up like Utah and TCU have had success. Louisville has had ups and downs. Rutgers not so much

still upset about UCF beating UGA 10 years ago?

Not in the least. Bowl game under Richt with arguably our worst team in 20 years.

Deep Creek · Jul 6, 2020

Olyduck said:
under Forde new system that chance would increase tho

Yeah, from 0% to 1%....if that.

Deep Creek · Jul 6, 2020

LawDawg said:
Teams like Vandy, Ky, Kansas, Illinois, and NW are Haves, not Have Nots. Just because they don't win doesn't mean they don't provide value to the conference. Some are basketball powers, some in other sports, some provide academic excellence, et. All have been in their conferences for close to a century so they have tradition. Sure, they don't bring in much for TV revenue, but they are better than FIU, FAU, Georgia Southern, and the like.

Although it may be amusing to post all there possibilities, there is no way something like this will ever happen. You just won't see 100 years of tradition ditched, and teams kicked to the curb.

I know all that. That's why I said they provide something for hoops and olympic sports. And some are charter members. But those big ticket schools pay the freight whether the lower level P5s admit it or not. And the freight payers are willing to subsidize them to keep them in the conferences for reasons you stated. But, the freight payers would make it fine without them.

Cold hard fact is the networks are willing to fork over MORE money to conferences in order to broadcast games like Ohio State vs Northwestern as well as Ohio State vs Michigan. Indiana vs Northwestern is just content filler for the networks. Casual CFB fans in places outside the B1G don't care to watch the latter. They'll tune in if Ohio State is playing anyone though. Same for the SEC and other conferences. Casual CFB fans outside the southeast don't care to watch Miss State vs Kentucky. But, they'll tune in to watch both Bama vs Kentucky and Bama vs Miss State. (The CFP maniacs like ourselves will watch anything.)

Deep Creek · Jul 6, 2020

LawDawg said:
You just won't see 100 years of tradition ditched, and teams kicked to the curb.

I wish you were right...because I'm definitely a traditionalist. I used to think the same way but money is the almighty driver now.

Texas and Texas A&M first played each other in 1894. That 100+ years of tradition got ditched and kicked straight ass to the curb. How's that tradtion working now?

And I never thought I would see the day that Oklahoma and Nebraska wouldn't play each other every year.

Pat Forde's realignment plan.

What do you think of Pat Forde's realignment plan?

Yes, great idea.

No, with all due respect, I don't like it.

Pat Forde needs to be drug tested.

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