Trade Capital from Miami

Ruzious · Apr 7, 2020

Stymietee said:
I'm going to try something here that might change a some minds about Kerrigan. A couple of years back, I dared to suggest trading Kerrigan and met with some opposition. I was right then and I'm right now about doing that.

That said, there's a real possibility that there are some who won't admit to trading him based upon that early opposition and the reality of having to change their minds and admit that I was right then as now.

So, as of this moment, I officially change my mind and declare that in no way should Washington trade or release one Ryan Kerrigan. ( I hope that the emoji's don't give things away)

Makes perfect sense to me. Now that he's older, less durable, more expensive, fits worse in our new system, and... is not as good a player, let's keep him - so we can have less cap room next year!

skinz2winz · Apr 7, 2020

I think we can all say Kerrigan was a pillar and very good player for our team since he was drafted out of Purdue. HE will be in our Ring of Honor because of his work ethic, on field play and contributions off the field. This is a business and tough decisions are made. Time for Ryan to finish his career elsewhere because moving forward, he is not a fit on this young and upcoming team. Thank you for your service Ryan Kerrigan and I will be watching you this season no matter who you play for.

Stymietee · Apr 7, 2020

If body of work is the standard, I would love to see the following 43 players inducted into the D.C. ring of honor. Most are long overdue.

01.Trent Williams (post career)
02. Ryan Kerrigan (post career)
03. Donnie Warren
04. Mark May
05. George Stark
06. Rick "Doc" Walker (The final Hog)
07. Clint Didier
08. Terry Allen
09. Mike Bass
10.Jack Pardee
11.Turk Edwards
12.Jim Lachey
13.Ricky Sanders
14.Paul Krause
15.Raleigh McKenzie
16.Chip Lohmiller
17.Mike Nelms
18.Mark Murphy
19.Joe Washington
20.Speedy Duncan
21.Mike Sellers
22.Walt Rock
23.Lorenzo Alexander
24.Daryl Grant
25.Todd Bowles
26.Harold McLinton
27.Joe Washington
28.Pete Wysocki
29.Pat Richter
30.Mike Bragg
31.Jon Jansen
32.Chris Samuels
33.Mark Schlereth
35.Ray Brown
36.Vernon Dean
37.Charlie Harraway
38.Tre Johnson
39.Ray Schoenke
40.Joe Lavender
41.Terry Hermeling
42.Brig Owens
43.Darryl Grant

skinsdad62 · Apr 7, 2020

gkekoa said:
Do you understand that if we save 12 million in cap space this season, we have next years cap plus 12 million to spend next season?

if the NFL’s cap next season is 200 million

Not having RK on the books this season gives us 212 million in cap space next season.

I posted the new CBA above and I asked you to show me in writing that you can double dip on RK’s salary . I am still waiting for anyone to show me it . If they do I will say cool ,admit to being wrong ,and change my position . I didn’t see it in there, I believe it’s absorbed with no chance of double dipping and it’s just a matter of when you see the accounting which means if you see a guy you have to have get him , but if not in the end we end up at the same place

Ruzious · Apr 8, 2020

skinsdad62 said:
I posted the new CBA above and I asked you to show me in writing that you can double dip on RK’s salary . I am still waiting for anyone to show me it . If they do I will say cool ,admit to being wrong ,and change my position . I didn’t see it in there, I believe it’s absorbed with no chance of double dipping and it’s just a matter of when you see the accounting which means if you see a guy you have to have get him , but if not in the end we end up at the same place

There's no double-dipping. I guess you could think of the situation as having 2 benefits - one that trading him this year could increase our unused cap c/o to next year - and two that he won't be on our books next year, assuming they don't re-sign him (but I wouldn't count that since that's the case with all players with expiring contracts that you don't plan to re-sign).

Ruzious · Apr 8, 2020

Stymietee, why Speedie Duncan but not Eddie Brown? Actually, why either of them?

skinsdad62 · Apr 8, 2020

Ruzious said:
There's no double-dipping. I guess you could think of the situation as having 2 benefits - one that trading him this year could increase our unused cap c/o to next year - and two that he won't be on our books next year, assuming they don't re-sign him (but I wouldn't count that since that's the case with all players with expiring contracts that you don't plan to re-sign).

the point is I am being told and others agree that you can roll over his salary from this season ( if he is cut ) and then take another discount next year for the same amount ( I.e . Double dipping ) which I can’t find in my posted CBA nor does it make any sense

gkekoa · Apr 8, 2020

skinsdad62 said:
https://nflpaweb.blob.core.windows.net/media/Default/NFLPA/CBA2020/NFL-NFLPA_CBA_March_5_2020.pdf

Show me in here where it allows for double dipping on the rollover

Nobody is claiming “double dipping.”

Article 13, section 6, paragraph 5, on page 113 under the heading “CARRYING OVER ROOM”

It states, if we have unused cap room at the end of the season, then we can roll that amount over for next season, increasing next season’s cap space.

IE, if we don’t pay RK 12 million this season, then we can use that 12 million this season on other players, or we can roll that amount over to next season, increasing next season’s available cap.

Does that suffice?

skinz2winz · Apr 8, 2020

skinsdad62 said:
the point is I am being told and others agree that you can roll over his salary from this season ( if he is cut ) and then take another discount next year for the same amount ( I.e . Double dipping ) which I can’t find in my posted CBA nor does it make any sense

Well, trade him now (this off season) and he and his salary are gone this year and next. Love the player but at this point he really doesn't fit the youth movement moving forward with his current salary. Has he earned it? Quite possibly all though this business can be brutal sometimes. I'm all onboard with the youth movement in DC.

skinz2winz · Apr 8, 2020

gkekoa said:
Nobody is claiming “double dipping.”

Article 13, section 6, paragraph 5, on page 113 under the heading “CARRYING OVER ROOM”

It states, if we have unused cap room at the end of the season, then we can roll that amount over for next season, increasing next season’s cap space.

IE, if we don’t pay RK 12 million this season, then we can use that 12 million this season on other players, or we can roll that amount over to next season, increasing next season’s available cap.

Does that suffice?

Pretty clear.

Stymietee · Apr 8, 2020

Ruzious said:
Stymietee, why Speedie Duncan but not Eddie Brown? Actually, why either of them?

I pulled them from memory, so, blame the head and not the heart.
BTW: outside of Brian Mitchell or a couple of kickers, there's rarely a time when we consider special team players.
For example: I just remembered Pete Wysocki, James Thrash, and Greg Manusky were terrors on "teams" when they played.

skinsdad62 · Apr 8, 2020

gkekoa said:
Nobody is claiming “double dipping.”

Article 13, section 6, paragraph 5, on page 113 under the heading “CARRYING OVER ROOM”

It states, if we have unused cap room at the end of the season, then we can roll that amount over for next season, increasing next season’s cap space.

IE, if we don’t pay RK 12 million this season, then we can use that 12 million this season on other players, or we can roll that amount over to next season, increasing next season’s available cap.

Does that suffice?

no it doesn’t . All of you are acting like we gain cap space in 2021 if we cut him now and get a “ roll over “ I have said all along that when free agency starts In 2021 we will be in the exact same place cap wise . No double dipping which you all are implying when you talk about roll overs .

and as I have said unless you see a must have player in this years free agency or a draft that is worth it then there is no need to do anything until TC and he shows he has fallen off a cliff.

I damn sure not worried about dan Snyder’s payroll unless it interferes with retaining players or getting what we need

sherff isn’t an issue because he ain’t getting 42 mil a yr . He costs us 15 this year and we still have 27 mil

now show me the must have player or players and I will be open to your position

skinsdad62 · Apr 8, 2020

gkekoa said:
I think it is funny. Wouldn’t that extra 12 million in cap space be nice to have going into next year? It is absurd to keep a guy as a role model at that price, especially going into a new system.

my point and thus is where double dipping comes from

whether we carry it into next year or not the money will be there period

RK will be gone next year hence the 12 mil is there regardless making the point moot

the only thing it affects is if you give a crap about dan Snyder’s money which you may.

as far as I am concerned let him come toTC and let him earn a roster spot unless there is a must have piece in FA this yr. or you can get a good draft pick for him

skinsdad62 · Apr 8, 2020

skinz2winz said:
Well, trade him now (this off season) and he and his salary are gone this year and next. Love the player but at this point he really doesn't fit the youth movement moving forward with his current salary. Has he earned it? Quite possibly all though this business can be brutal sometimes. I'm all onboard with the youth movement in DC.

Ok and if you can get the right deal then fine but whether we keep him or not in March of 2021 we will be at the same place cap wise making that talking point moot

Ruzious · Apr 8, 2020

skinsdad62 said:
no it doesn’t . All of you are acting like we gain cap space in 2021 if we cut him now and get a “ roll over “ I have said all along that when free agency starts In 2021 we will be in the exact same place cap wise . No double dipping which you all are implying when you talk about roll overs .

and as I have said unless you see a must have player in this years free agency or a draft that is worth it then there is no need to do anything until TC and he shows he has fallen off a cliff.

I damn sure not worried about dan Snyder’s payroll unless it interferes with retaining players or getting what we need

sherff isn’t an issue because he ain’t getting 42 mil a yr . He costs us 15 this year and we still have 27 mil

now show me the must have player or players and I will be open to your position

See, this is what happens when someone wants to put Speedie Duncan in the Ring of Fame.

But seriously, why do you call it double-dipping? There's a carryover, and presumably trading him now would increase the carryover - though they might end up spending some of the savings this season - thereby decreasing the amount available for c/o - but presumably getting some use from that spending.

gkekoa · Apr 8, 2020

skinsdad62 said:
no it doesn’t . All of you are acting like we gain cap space in 2021 if we cut him now and get a “ roll over “ I have said all along that when free agency starts In 2021 we will be in the exact same place cap wise . No double dipping which you all are implying when you talk about roll overs .

and as I have said unless you see a must have player in this years free agency or a draft that is worth it then there is no need to do anything until TC and he shows he has fallen off a cliff.

I damn sure not worried about dan Snyder’s payroll unless it interferes with retaining players or getting what we need

sherff isn’t an issue because he ain’t getting 42 mil a yr . He costs us 15 this year and we still have 27 mil

now show me the must have player or players and I will be open to your position

Dude I can’t help you if you read the CBA and don’t understand the rollover. I literally showed you in the CBA what it says and it uses the word rollover. I will try to explain this to you one more time.

The 2020 cap is 198 million.

We currently have 24 million in cap space. If we didn’t spend another dime this season, we would carry that cap space over into next season.

Meaning, if the 2021 cap was 200 million, we would have 224 million in cap space for 2021.

Now if we don’t have RK on the books this season, our cap space for this season increases to 36 million. That means we would have 236 million in cap space for next season.

skinsdad62 · Apr 8, 2020

gkekoa said:
Dude I can’t help you if you read the CBA and don’t understand the rollover. I literally showed you in the CBA what it says and it uses the word rollover. I will try to explain this to you one more time.

The 2020 cap is 198 million.

We currently have 24 million in cap space. If we didn’t spend another dime this season, we would carry that cap space over into next season.

Meaning, if the 2021 cap was 200 million, we would have 224 million in cap space for 2021.

Now if we don’t have RK on the books this season, our cap space for this season increases to 36 million. That means we would have 236 million in cap space for next season.

It’s there GK whether it’s “ rolled over “or not . You get no extra benefit from it at all . RK ‘s salary will be there for use whether you cut him now or allow him to play out the contract . The money will be there by the new season free agency signing period whether it’s “ rolled over “ or not . The only benefit is that mr Snyder ‘s money doesn’t go in RK’s pocket this year. But our 24 mil roll over from this year will be there as will RKs 12 . You don’t get an additional 12 mil because the cap space was not used .

the only way what you are saying is if you can double dip meaning you get the 36 mil “ roll over “ plus the 12 mil in cap space next. Year . Now your post doesn’t say a damn thing about it in the CBA

so to break it down for you , yes you can roll it over or you can let him play out his contract but at the end of the day on the first day of the new league year you are at the same place with he 36 mil there and the money that makes up the projected 124 mil in cap space

so it comes down to what free agent piece or pieces are must haves or what draft pick you can get . Both of which I am on board with but since you can’t double dip it doesn’t matter when the space is available all things staying the same

gkekoa · Apr 9, 2020

skinsdad62 said:
It’s there GK whether it’s “ rolled over “or not . You get no extra benefit from it at all . RK ‘s salary will be there for use whether you cut him now or allow him to play out the contract . The money will be there by the new season free agency signing period whether it’s “ rolled over “ or not . The only benefit is that mr Snyder ‘s money doesn’t go in RK’s pocket this year. But our 24 mil roll over from this year will be there as will RKs 12 . You don’t get an additional 12 mil because the cap space was not used .

the only way what you are saying is if you can double dip meaning you get the 36 mil “ roll over “ plus the 12 mil in cap space next. Year . Now your post doesn’t say a damn thing about it in the CBA

so to break it down for you , yes you can roll it over or you can let him play out his contract but at the end of the day on the first day of the new league year you are at the same place with he 36 mil there and the money that makes up the projected 124 mil in cap space

so it comes down to what free agent piece or pieces are must haves or what draft pick you can get . Both of which I am on board with but since you can’t double dip it doesn’t matter when the space is available all things staying the same

Dude, you don’t get it at all. Article 13, section 6, paragraph 5, on page 113 under the heading “CARRYING OVER ROOM”

1- Do you agree, if we don’t use all our cap room this season, it increases our cap room next season?

2- If we don’t pay Ryan Kerrigan this season, it increases our available cap room this season?

skinsdad62 · Apr 9, 2020

gkekoa said:
Dude, you don’t get it at all. Article 13, section 6, paragraph 5, on page 113 under the heading “CARRYING OVER ROOM”

1- Do you agree, if we don’t use all our cap room this season, it increases our cap room next season?

2- If we don’t pay Ryan Kerrigan this season, it increases our available cap room this season?

I absolutely do not agree that we won’t be at the same place next year in regards to the cap . Nowhere in what you posted allows for double dipping , nowhere . It says you can carry over from last years cap which doesn’t change where we will be either by keeping him or not

as for this season yes it does but again I have asked what must have free agents are out there that we need to get ? No one has given me any answer to this

the only thing I can conclude is that you care about Snyder’s money and who gets it . I don’t

Ruzious · Apr 9, 2020

skinsdad62 said:
the point is I am being told and others agree that you can roll over his salary from this season ( if he is cut ) and then take another discount next year for the same amount ( I.e . Double dipping ) which I can’t find in my posted CBA nor does it make any sense

There's no rollover of his salary; it's a rollover of the team's unused cap from this season to next season - that's the benefit we're talking about by trading him this year (assuming the trade is just for a draft pick). Our concern here is the cap money available - not Snyder's money - and Eddie Brown vs Speedy Duncan.

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