Game of Thrones

Stakesarehigh · May 22, 2019

Bridgeburner said:
When did we bomb someone after the battle was won?

And no... I've never supported targeting civilians. You have?

We dropped two A Bombs no? Call the first one a battle?

Bridgeburner · May 22, 2019

Stakesarehigh said:
We dropped two A Bombs no? Call the first one a battle?

Huh? Are you saying that we won with the first drop of the bomb and then just dropped the second to add up a body count?

Stakesarehigh · May 22, 2019

Bridgeburner said:
Huh? Are you saying that we won with the first drop of the bomb and then just dropped the second to add up a body count?

That's the point

Dany didn't see the war as over

Payton · May 22, 2019

flyerhawk said:
I know you are going for snark here but I have NEVER called all slave owners evil.

Slavery is slavery. Putting someone up on a cross and sticking nails through their arms and legs is still crucifixion. Feeding your enemies to your dragon is still feeding your enemies to your dragon.

I don't believe that the people in King's Landing supported Cersei in any way and I think the show made a point to highlight that. But that doesn't mean that Dany saw it that way.

I'm assuming in Slaver Bay that there weren't just slavers and slaves, right? Why weren't the ordinary citizens slaughtered as complicit or supportive of the various regimes Dany "liberated" them from?

TemptressToo · May 22, 2019

juliansteed said:
I believe they are just nameless characters that we've never seen before for the most part. There was one guy who looked like a northern lord that I thought might have been Howland Reed but I'm sure they would have dropped his name at some point if that were the case.

The guy beside Sam is Howland Reed based on the upper part of his cloak. Frog "skin" and the grouping.

Sparhawk · May 22, 2019

Bridgeburner said:
That's the thing. If the people were effectively used by Cersei and were lost in the battle that's one thing. But that was a slaughter after the fact. A massive one. There's nothing in her character arch that supports that kind of slip into absolute madness.

There was a genetic one.

She did everything she could do to avoid turning into her father, but after losing Jorah and Missandei, losing her rightful claim to the throne to Jon, and wanting to take it to Cersei, she lost her marbles when the bells rang and flipped the script.

While your point is a fair one, this was just poor writing. Sure, we expected a Dany heel turn, but it was basically conducted in what, two episodes?

I mean, at some point, the mad king had to have been a decent bloke before things went haywire.

Sparhawk · May 22, 2019

TemptressToo said:
The guy beside Sam is Howland Reed based on the upper part of his cloak. Frog "skin" and the grouping.

Nice find.
I mean, would it have absolutely killed the producers to have Meera by his side to let us all in on this????

Now I want to know how Edmure was planning on ending his speech..... (what a great f'n pose)

TemptressToo · May 22, 2019

Sparhawk said:
Nice find.
I mean, would it have absolutely killed the producers to have Meera by his side to let us all in on this????

Now I want to know how Edmure was planning on ending his speech..... (what a great f'n pose)

He could have been nominating himself OR about to name someone else. Perhaps the books will solve the mystery.

Sparhawk · May 22, 2019

TemptressToo said:
He could have been nominating himself OR about to name someone else. Perhaps the books will solve the mystery.

It was actually a perfect ending befitting Edmure.

Sure, maybe he was inept at archery, negotiating castle sieges, and public speaking, but he was 1 for 1 on fathering a child, so there is that.....

Orlando Eagles · May 22, 2019

Sparhawk said:
There was a genetic one.

She did everything she could do to avoid turning into her father, but after losing Jorah and Missandei, losing her rightful claim to the throne to Jon, and wanting to take it to Cersei, she lost her marbles when the bells rang and flipped the script.

While your point is a fair one, this was just poor writing. Sure, we expected a Dany heel turn, but it was basically conducted in what, two episodes?

I mean, at some point, the mad king had to have been a decent bloke before things went haywire.

Exactly where my thoughts were. I think a really interesting part about Dany was that the duality was often there. She had to be talked of the ledge of quasi madness once or twice. And she listened. But once she got to Westeros the pummeling of losing people and important people (and yes, shunned by Jon) and not having advisors she could trust one lick made all the difference in the world.

I totally get the naysayers to this point......because they moved SO FUCKING fast on this turn. But the hints were there.

Since that episode I have thought more about the Dany we met at the start of the show. She spent all of her formidable years hearing how their family was betrayed by the whole of the continent.....but most certainly by that very city of Kings Landing. After all.....they dont share a family story that Dad was mad.....they likely shared a story that justified a reason he thought about burning the town.

When all that stress took Dany over.....when that snap happened....it was likely those voices that were planted in her mind since her youngest memories came out clearly....and made all the innocent people of Kings Landing the guilty combatants who back Cersei's husband, who back Cersei, who needed to be eliminated so the rest of the world could be liberated.

I truly feel this would have sat much better if they had taken 1/2 to a full season laying out the decline....maybe flashbacks to her childhood and the common story their remaining family had. How they were wronged by the whole city. It would have gone so far to help explain her heel turn.....and even more to explain the giddy purveyor of a theory of genocide as the right thing, like she preached to Jon Snow right before the dagger caught her aorta.

Tin Man · May 22, 2019

The wheel had to be broken

Sparhawk · May 22, 2019

Orlando Eagles said:
Exactly where my thoughts were. I think a really interesting part about Dany was that the duality was often there. She had to be talked of the ledge of quasi madness once or twice. And she listened. But once she got to Westeros the pummeling of losing people and important people (and yes, shunned by Jon) and not having advisors she could trust one lick made all the difference in the world.

I totally get the naysayers to this point......because they moved SO FUCKING fast on this turn. But the hints were there.

Since that episode I have thought more about the Dany we met at the start of the show. She spent all of her formidable years hearing how their family was betrayed by the whole of the continent.....but most certainly by that very city of Kings Landing. After all.....they dont share a family story that Dad was mad.....they likely shared a story that justified a reason he thought about burning the town.

When all that stress took Dany over.....when that snap happened....it was likely those voices that were planted in her mind since her youngest memories came out clearly....and made all the innocent people of Kings Landing the guilty combatants who back Cersei's husband, who back Cersei, who needed to be eliminated so the rest of the world could be liberated.

I truly feel this would have sat much better if they had taken 1/2 to a full season laying out the decline....maybe flashbacks to her childhood and the common story their remaining family had. How they were wronged by the whole city. It would have gone so far to help explain her heel turn.....and even more to explain the giddy purveyor of a theory of genocide as the right thing, like she preached to Jon Snow right before the dagger caught her aorta.

I wrote about this earlier, but what if one of her earliest memories was being escorted out of the city while the bells were ringing when the mad king and his forces surrendered? That would bring symbolism to the bells ringing and bring us full circle back to the mad king.

Sparhawk · May 22, 2019

Tin Man said:
The wheel had to be broken

Just not by the writers....

Tin Man · May 22, 2019

flyerhawk · May 22, 2019

Orlando Eagles said:
I truly feel this would have sat much better if they had taken 1/2 to a full season laying out the decline....maybe flashbacks to her childhood and the common story their remaining family had. How they were wronged by the whole city. It would have gone so far to help explain her heel turn.....and even more to explain the giddy purveyor of a theory of genocide as the right thing, like she preached to Jon Snow right before the dagger caught her aorta.

I go back and forth on how much more they could have shown her descent. It's a fine balance between showing her get to that point and making the end utterly predictable.

Bridgeburner · May 22, 2019

Sparhawk said:
Sure, we expected a Dany heel turn, but it was basically conducted in what, two episodes?

Bingo. And that's my entire point right there.

Bridgeburner · May 22, 2019

Orlando Eagles said:
But the hints were there.

They were there. But there wasn't enough of them. It was too fast, too sloppy. It basically made a mockery of the entire character arch.

gob · May 22, 2019

flyerhawk said:
I go back and forth on how much more they could have shown her descent. It's a fine balance between showing her get to that point and making the end utterly predictable.

True. If you do too much, her burning the city down is just a cool scene. There is no "oh, shit" impact.

jayfan · May 22, 2019

Fog said:
I'm on Season 4 now so don't spoil it for me gall darn it.

You're in a good place.

Bridgeburner · May 22, 2019

gobucks0409 said:
True. If you do too much, her burning the city down is just a cool scene. There is no "oh, shit" impact.

Did anyone really not see that scene coming after the previous two episodes though? I shot my buddy a text telling him this is exactly what would happen. There was no shock or awe for me and I don't get the impression that a lot of other people were really surprised either.

Well, maybe I was surprised that she succeeded. I thought it was plain that they were going to do an abrupt turn with her character and make her the clear villain out of nowhere. I guess I shouldn't say there was no shock. But I thought this was plainly and clearly where they were going with it after the second to last episode.

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