Odds to win the SB

nebearsfan70 · Apr 20, 2019

The Derski said:
Are you going to hang that division banner at Soldier Field?

See, in Green Bay we display Lombardi trophies.

Are you going to hang onto the past?

See, in Chicago we know the Bears are relevant.

The Derski · Apr 20, 2019

nebearsfan70 said:
Are you going to hang onto the past?

See, in Chicago we know the Bears are relevant.

So are the Packers. We got so many threads in this forum.

Nosferatu · Apr 20, 2019

I can’t open the link on my iPad but wherever the Vikings are they are too high!

jarntt · Apr 21, 2019

How much would does this change the odds?

Across The Field · Apr 21, 2019

PhoenixEagles1 said:
I’m with you on this Jarntt. He asked what have teams like Philly and Dallas have that the Browns don’t. Well for one they both won playoff games last year. I can’t fathom how Cleveland is higher then LAC, Dallas, Philly.

So they both won playoff games last year. In 2017, both Tennessee and Atlanta won playoff games. How were they last year? Oh yeah. Not in the playoffs.

The Browns were 7-8-1 last year (with Hue frickin Jackson as HC for half the year) and have since added one of the best WRs of this generation, two beasts on the DL, and the NFL's leading rusher in 2017 to back-up PFF's top RB from 2018.

Teams change from year to year, so again, what do Philly and Dallas have right now that make them better teams in 2019?

Ricky Roma · Apr 21, 2019

It looks OK as of now. Nothing really stands out, except maybe Chiefs, Browns and Packers are too high and Vikes and Eagles are too low.

nebearsfan70 · Apr 21, 2019

The Derski said:
So are the Packers. We got so many threads in this forum.

The on-going collapse of GB is the only reason people are talking about the Packers in this forum. It was eventual, but shocking only to GB fans. The rest of us saw this coming for years.

As for relevancy... If you mean GB has a football team that participates in the NFL until the postseason, then yes.

So back to my original point... It has to hurt, huh?

dtgold88 · Apr 21, 2019

jarntt said:
So read what I wrote and tell me what's incorrect. I said time will tell and he is already top 20. Where did I say he is all about stats. I said:

"He doesn't even have to be that good to put up good stats with all of those weapons." Is this not true? This doesn't say he won't be any good. Someone was quoting stats. My point was he BETTER put up big stats this
year with those weapons.

"But stats are for people that can't judge talent with their eyes and read box scores." Today's QBs and players in general are graded more on their counting stats. It's the fantasy football, ESPN highlights mentality. You throw more and you get more stats. If you are in an explosive offense you get more stats. I judge QBs in particular on how they do what they are asked to do and if they can do it at important times. 300 yards used to mean something. Now guys do it while getting blown out. TD passes are more a function of your offense and opportunity (same for WRs). What do you do when the game is on the line or even more important your season is on the line. What do you do on 3rd down or in the 4th Qtr. The most important thing a QB does is not turn the ball over. I don't blame them for fumbles usually because it's usually them getting hit and not seeing it. But Ints are one of the most important things. He needs to be better here than last year. Teams that turn the ball over lose and wins are how QBs are judged. This is a statement in general, not a Mayfield statement. As soon as someone starts pointing to stats as their entire argument I know they don't really get it.

"I like him better as a fantasy QB right now than I do a real QB" You disagree with this statement for this year. I think he puts up pretty good stats this season. He has one of the best WRs in history, another good WR and what seems to be a good RB. I'm don't know what he will be as an NFL QB yet and am not sold on him as being a good QB, but I think his counting stats will be good. Personally If I'm ranking top QBs I don't rank him top 15 going into this year, but I sure as heck have him top 15 in fantasy.

I knew right away you were like many posters who just cannot man up and say their logic was offbase so this is probably futile on my part. But here goes.......

"All those weapons"? Had a solid WR in Landry and? His #2 was Callaway who was a 4th round pick and not played in a year. His #3 was Higgins, a 5th rounder who had never done much of anything. did have a solid runner in Chubb (who only started half the year).

Yes, I get many grade QBs on stats (or counting stats), but you have been told and hopefully know Baker is smart, makes quick decisions, is deadly accurate AND has a strong arm. Those are all the traits you want in a QB. are you actually trying to discredit him because he has those traits AND put up good numbers?

where we agree is he needs to do it again.....but no reason to think he wont or that he can't do it better.

Manster7588 · Apr 21, 2019

dtgold88 said:
I knew right away you were like many posters who just cannot man up and say their logic was offbase so this is probably futile on my part. But here goes.......

"All those weapons"? Had a solid WR in Landry and? His #2 was Callaway who was a 4th round pick and not played in a year. His #3 was Higgins, a 5th rounder who had never done much of anything. did have a solid runner in Chubb (who only started half the year).

Yes, I get many grade QBs on stats (or counting stats), but you have been told and hopefully know Baker is smart, makes quick decisions, is deadly accurate AND has a strong arm. Those are all the traits you want in a QB. are you actually trying to discredit him because he has those traits AND put up good numbers?

where we agree is he needs to do it again.....but no reason to think he wont or that he can't do it better.

Now tell us why Calloway was a 4th rd pick.

Baker had an amazing rookie season. Now let's see two more years.
Defenses will adjust to him making it more difficult for him, then we need to see if he can adjust to the adjustments.

Across The Field · Apr 21, 2019

Manster7588 said:
Now tell us why Calloway was a 4th rd pick.

Baker had an amazing rookie season. Now let's see two more years.
Defenses will adjust to him making it more difficult for him, then we need to see if he can adjust to the adjustments.

I don't know that anyone has argued this at all.

dtgold88 · Apr 21, 2019

Manster7588 said:
Now tell us why Calloway was a 4th rd pick.

Baker had an amazing rookie season. Now let's see two more years.
Defenses will adjust to him making it more difficult for him, then we need to see if he can adjust to the adjustments.

sure. He had off-the-field issues. Guessing not playing didn't help.

Agree defenses will adjust and then he needs to adjust. Like every QB going into year 2. Very few had a rookie season like his, though, and also did not take over an 0-16 team.

Across The Field · Apr 21, 2019

dtgold88 said:
I knew right away you were like many posters who just cannot man up and say their logic was offbase so this is probably futile on my part. But here goes.......

"All those weapons"? Had a solid WR in Landry and? His #2 was Callaway who was a 4th round pick and not played in a year. His #3 was Higgins, a 5th rounder who had never done much of anything. did have a solid runner in Chubb (who only started half the year).

Yes, I get many grade QBs on stats (or counting stats), but you have been told and hopefully know Baker is smart, makes quick decisions, is deadly accurate AND has a strong arm. Those are all the traits you want in a QB. are you actually trying to discredit him because he has those traits AND put up good numbers?

where we agree is he needs to do it again.....but no reason to think he wont or that he can't do it better.

Baker showed several of the traits of an elite QB last year - 2nd in the league in RZ QB rating, 1st in the league in deep ball completions and completion %, and once Hue was fired he was near the top of the league in QB rating when facing pressure. All of this as a rookie is extremely promising. I expect him to certainly take another step forward this year.

dtgold88 · Apr 21, 2019

Across The Field said:
Baker showed several of the traits of an elite QB last year - 2nd in the league in RZ QB rating, 1st in the league in deep ball completions and completion %, and once Hue was fired he was near the top of the league in QB rating when facing pressure. All of this as a rookie is extremely promising. I expect him to certainly take another step forward this year.

Exactly....though Haley going was the issue as he had 100% control of the offense. still cannot figure out if he's an idiot or wanted to get Hue fired (or both).

either way, worked out perfectly as we would not know who Kitchens was if Haley wasn't such a dunderhead.

Across The Field · Apr 21, 2019

dtgold88 said:
Exactly....though Haley going was the issue as he had 100% control of the offense. still cannot figure out if he's an idiot or wanted to get Hue fired (or both).

either way, worked out perfectly as we would not know who Kitchens was if Haley wasn't such a dunderhead.

Well whatever it was, it obviously needed to be done. What it boils down to is that Kitchens knew how to get the most out of him and, moreso, his OL last year. Pretty unreal that they lost one of the greatest OTs of all-time to retirement and actually managed to improve overall from the year before from a grading standpoint. Kitchens knows his stuff.

dtgold88 · Apr 21, 2019

Across The Field said:
Well whatever it was, it obviously needed to be done. What it boils down to is that Kitchens knew how to get the most out of him and, moreso, his OL last year. Pretty unreal that they lost one of the greatest OTs of all-time to retirement and actually managed to improve overall from the year before from a grading standpoint. Kitchens knows his stuff.

My guess is Kitchens called plays where Baker could make quicker choices (or maybe gave him more freedom?). Having Chubb play, of course, helped a ton as they had to respect the play action more.

LeCharles Bentley always said if you want to improve the line just get a QB who can make quick decisions.

with pretty much the same line the difference was astonishing with Freddy as opposed to Haley. Going by memory, but the stat that jumps out at me was Baker was hit something like 9 times the entire second half. Next closest was hit 28 times.

Shane_O_Mac812 · Apr 21, 2019

If this makes sense, I think the Colts will be a better team than last year, but with a worse record. Overall the team has improved, but this years schedule is fucking brutal. Probably 9-7 but that could maybe win the division. I think I'm going to drop a few hundo on Atlanta before Vegas catches its mistake and changes that. Those are very tempting odds. They have to be valuing Tevin Coleman more than he is worth or something.

The Derski · Apr 21, 2019

nebearsfan70 said:
The on-going collapse of GB is the only reason people are talking about the Packers in this forum. It was eventual, but shocking only to GB fans. The rest of us saw this coming for years.

As for relevancy... If you mean GB has a football team that participates in the NFL until the postseason, then yes.

So back to my original point... It has to hurt, huh?

Green Bay will always be relevant. The fact that we occupy your brain 24-7 is proof.

Manster7588 · Apr 21, 2019

Across The Field said:
Baker showed several of the traits of an elite QB last year - 2nd in the league in RZ QB rating, 1st in the league in deep ball completions and completion %, and once Hue was fired he was near the top of the league in QB rating when facing pressure. All of this as a rookie is extremely promising. I expect him to certainly take another step forward this year.

LMAO at the ELITE take.

He has shown traits of a Franchise QB, there is a big difference between Elite and Franchise QBs.

You're starting to have Traits of a few Eagles posters.

PDay8810 · Apr 21, 2019

Across The Field said:
Dallas have right now that make them better teams in 2019?

that would be a healthy Travis Fredrick at center, the trade for Quinn to play opposite of Lawrence, a much better yards after catch slot receiver, Jaylon Smith another year more healthy, and Connor Williams adding 15 lbs of muscle this offseason. We'll see but Dallas on paper is a better team than 2018

Across The Field · Apr 21, 2019

Manster7588 said:
LMAO at the ELITE take.

He has shown traits of a Franchise QB, there is a big difference between Elite and Franchise QBs.

You're starting to have Traits of a few Eagles posters.

What would you call the numbers I listed? Would you not call deep ball accuracy and red zone efficiency signs of elite QBs? Would you not say the elite QBs remain calm under pressure and complete passes?

Odds to win the SB

Did Vegas get this right?

About right

Way off

Pretty close except...

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