Game #14 Patriots vs Pittsburgh Steelers 12/15/2018

redseat · Dec 17, 2018

BigKen said:
In that same series, James White did not have a defender within 15 yards of him and Brady overthrew a near impossible pass to Gronk in the back of the end zone. I hate to say it, but maybe Brady has to start bearing some of the burden. He's thrown a lot of bad passes that were very short, a lot of passes behind receivers and some very questionaleone like the INT at the five yesterday. Sometimes I wonder if he makes a decidion before he takes the snap from center. He used to be able to look at a WR and totally switch gears and go somewhere else. He's also throwing a lot of passes early when he senses any pressure. Just is not the play of the TB that we're used to seeing.

Maybe the overall poor play is causing us all to be a bit more critical, but even a few of the wins this year were "ugly".

I think that BB has had an ego problem that we've all been willing to overlook because the team was always a Super Bowl contender and would play for him. I also think that we've seen that ego deny the team a chance to win the Super Bowl against the Eagles, that ego may have been the reason that Brady and Gronk didn't attend anything in the off season that was not required. I think it's becoming a real issue and if Rboertor Johnathan Kraft doesn't step in, the team will suffer as long as he's HC.

If he's not willing to put his personal mini vendettas aside, then maybe it is time to move on. It's been an excellent 20 years and few teams or their fans will ever experience anything like it again. But eventually all things must end. The Krafts might want to take a page from Belichick's book and move on a year early rather than a year late..........Both TH and BB?

BB also seems to have totally gone away from using White for no reason and it does seem like he has something against White. I really think he (BB) should be getting more flack than he has been getting. Doesn't mean he should be fired but he really has seemed to have cost the Pats a few "Ws" with his "decision" making... Brady isn't anywhere close to what he once was and it's showing. He seems to be more focused on life after football more than he ever has before.

Do we expect too much from so much success... ABSOLUTELY, we have been greatly spoiled but this team isn't heading in the right direction currently

TP76 · Dec 17, 2018

White vs. a zone defense like Pittsburgh isn't ideal. The intermediate passing game was there, if they had capable WRs that could catch and an OL that would stop stepping on their own dicks with penalties.

patspa · Dec 17, 2018

redseat said:
BB also seems to have totally gone away from using White for no reason and it does seem like he has something against White. I really think he (BB) should be getting more flack than he has been getting. Doesn't mean he should be fired but he really has seemed to have cost the Pats a few "Ws" with his "decision" making... Brady isn't anywhere close to what he once was and it's showing. He seems to be more focused on life after football more than he ever has before.

Do we expect too much from so much success... ABSOLUTELY, we have been greatly spoiled but this team isn't heading in the right direction currently

Also BB loves Burkhead so much, its going to take away from Whites playing time. Which is stupid. But what doe we expect out of BB this year.

redseat · Dec 17, 2018

patspa said:
Also BB loves Burkhead so much, its going to take away from Whites playing time. Which is stupid. But what doe we expect out of BB this year.

I don't see why they can't use all 3... White, Burkhead and Michel... Would certainly make defenses hard to cover the Pats

patspa · Dec 17, 2018

redseat said:
I don't see why they can't use all 3... White, Burkhead and Michel... Would certainly make defenses hard to cover the Pats

You would think right.

Shoeshine Boy · Dec 17, 2018

White played the most snaps of the three yesterday. Brady said they were trying to lighten his load a bit now that Sony and Rex are healthy again after he had to do so much when they were out. Don’t think BB has it out for him.

redseat · Dec 17, 2018

Shoeshine Boy said:
White played the most snaps of the three yesterday. Brady said they were trying to lighten his load a bit now that Sony and Rex are healthy again after he had to do so much when they were out. Don’t think BB has it out for him.

playing the most snaps but not getting any touches. Can't just throw to Gordon and have Edelman drop passes. You need to use White... He can't just be window dressing anymore

TP76 · Dec 17, 2018

Shoeshine Boy said:
White played the most snaps of the three yesterday. Brady said they were trying to lighten his load a bit now that Sony and Rex are healthy again after he had to do so much when they were out.

White has looked beat up in recent weeks, especially right before Burkhead came back.

YankeeRebel · Dec 18, 2018

redseat said:
Should BB be on the "hot seat" more for this and the play the last few weeks? Not the hot seat as of being fired but should be getting a lot more "heat" then he currently is getting

Nahhh I don't think so.

Yankee Traveler · Dec 18, 2018

BigKen said:
No team can win when you have to play 11 against 17.

I hate to blame the refs for everything, but there was A LOT of truth to this on Sunday.

Yankee Traveler · Dec 18, 2018

BigKen said:
I think that BB has had an ego problem that we've all been willing to overlook because the team was always a Super Bowl contender and would play for him. I also think that we've seen that ego deny the team a chance to win the Super Bowl against the Eagles, that ego may have been the reason that Brady and Gronk didn't attend anything in the off season that was not required.

I don't buy into that.
It was fairly widely reported that Butler was out many hours past curfew, was virtually comatose when he arrived at the hotel, could not walk to his room, could not drag his ass to the stadium even remotely on time...and yet he was going to save the season???

Nope.

That was not BB's ego, that was a good coaching decision.

Yankee Traveler · Dec 18, 2018

Shoeshine Boy said:
White played the most snaps of the three yesterday. Brady said they were trying to lighten his load a bit now that Sony and Rex are healthy again after he had to do so much when they were out. Don’t think BB has it out for him.

Keep him fresh for the playoffs too....

nefansince75 · Dec 18, 2018

Yankee Traveler said:
I don't buy into that.
It was fairly widely reported that Butler was out many hours past curfew, was virtually comatose when he arrived at the hotel, could not walk to his room, could not drag his ass to the stadium even remotely on time...and yet he was going to save the season???

Nope.

That was not BB's ego, that was a good coaching decision.

I think there's a misunderstanding between his ego and his convictions. Once he decided it was in the best interest of the team to sit MB, he stayed with that. Same with the timeout not taken in the waning moments of SB49 which worked out well, but would have everyone questioning it if Seattle just ran the ball.

Most of the percieved "ego moves" probably has an equal conviction explanation too.

....and he's had wayyyyy tooooo much success be on even a luke warm seat.

BigKen · Dec 18, 2018

nefansince75 said:
I think there's a misunderstanding between his ego and his convictions. Once he decided it was in the best interest of the team to sit MB, he stayed with that. Same with the timeout not taken in the waning moments of SB49 which worked out well, but would have everyone questioning it if Seattle just ran the ball.

Most of the percieved "ego moves" probably has an equal conviction explanation too.

....and he's had wayyyyy tooooo much success be on even a luke warm seat.

You may be closer to correct than I am. But the problem with conviction is that it is tied to one's ego. If you're convinced that your decision is correct and you go with and it's wrong, it makes one wonder if you were going with what you decided and to hell with anyone else's ideas, or you examined 10 or 12 options and honestly believed this one was best. A very very thin line between conviction and ego.

Like I said about being time to move on, I just wonder if he has the ears and minds of the newer players. These kids today are a totally different breed of cat than just 10 years ago. I sense it in myself every day.

Yesterday I was in a major grocery store doing a small amount of shopping. As I'm going to the meat aisle this kid about 12-13 years old is dancing and spinning in the middle of the aisle. Everyone is moving to avoid him. He does a piroetinto my cart and stumbles. The mother and father are shocked. The father who is about 6" shorter tha I am, comes right over and say, "You really need to watch where your going with that cart." I just smiled and said back, "This is a grocery store and not a fucking dance studio. Parents like you who don't have the balls to discipline your children, are a bigger problem than they are."

Through my childhood and most of my adult life, a parent would have stopped a child from doing stuff like that in a crowded environment. I have a problem with the new wave of parents who think that their kids do no wrong. I don't understand it. I have problems dealing with it.

I wonder if this same type of thing is going on with BB. OR is 2018 an anomale??

Yankee Traveler · Dec 18, 2018

BigKen said:
You may be closer to correct than I am. But the problem with conviction is that it is tied to one's ego. If you're convinced that your decision is correct and you go with and it's wrong, it makes one wonder if you were going with what you decided and to hell with anyone else's ideas, or you examined 10 or 12 options and honestly believed this one was best. A very very thin line between conviction and ego.

Like I said about being time to move on, I just wonder if he has the ears and minds of the newer players. These kids today are a totally different breed of cat than just 10 years ago. I sense it in myself every day.

Yesterday I was in a major grocery store doing a small amount of shopping. As I'm going to the meat aisle this kid about 12-13 years old is dancing and spinning in the middle of the aisle. Everyone is moving to avoid him. He does a piroetinto my cart and stumbles. The mother and father are shocked. The father who is about 6" shorter tha I am, comes right over and say, "You really need to watch where your going with that cart." I just smiled and said back, "This is a grocery store and not a fucking dance studio. Parents like you who don't have the balls to discipline your children, are a bigger problem than they are."

Through my childhood and most of my adult life, a parent would have stopped a child from doing stuff like that in a crowded environment. I have a problem with the new wave of parents who think that their kids do no wrong. I don't understand it. I have problems dealing with it.

I wonder if this same type of thing is going on with BB. OR is 2018 an anomale??

Don't discount Ernie.

Analyzing stats for every variable of every scenario. BB is usually 5 plays ahead of whats still happening on the field.

nefansince75 · Dec 18, 2018

BigKen said:
You may be closer to correct than I am. But the problem with conviction is that it is tied to one's ego. If you're convinced that your decision is correct and you go with and it's wrong, it makes one wonder if you were going with what you decided and to hell with anyone else's ideas, or you examined 10 or 12 options and honestly believed this one was best. A very very thin line between conviction and ego.

Would you prefer gutless and wishy washy?

I don't think conviction is directly tied to ego, but ego is indirectly tied to lots of areas in life.

The MB decision may have been about controlling long term players (plural) behavior and not showing up one soon to be gone player. In the SB49 example, it was clear BB already decided no timeout was going to be called. There was no look of contemplation in his body language. It was more of a "your move, let's see what you got", followed by a YATZEE!

YankeeRebel · Dec 18, 2018

redseat said:
I don't see why they can't use all 3... White, Burkhead and Michel... Would certainly make defenses hard to cover the Pats

I agree not sure why Michel is being left out of this.

Hell Gronk is useless at this point. Play your 5 down linemen + Tom. Put Gordon and Hogan on the outside, Jules in the slot and Michel and White and rotate Burkhead in. A lot of short quick passes could work.

patspa · Dec 18, 2018

YankeeRebel said:
I agree not sure why Michel is being left out of this.

Hell Gronk is useless at this point. Play your 5 down linemen + Tom. Put Gordon and Hogan on the outside, Jules in the slot and Michel and White and rotate Burkhead in. A lot of short quick passes could work.

Wow thanks someone else is seeing it too, it seems they are trying to go outside the numbers way to much recently. With those three it could be nightmares for matchups. Even if your not using it a lot just new formations to old plays would cause some nightmares too. The last few weeks it seems that way too, that the d's, knew the formation and when white was in the game he was really blanketed. Just some changeups might help, anything at this point.

BigKen · Dec 19, 2018

We all have our opinions and 'convictions'. I think it might be time for BB to move on and for the Patriots to inject new blood and new ideas into a team that may have become stagnant. Belichick is in his mid 60's and like all of us Baby Boomers, he has a hard time dealing with change. As he gets older he'll accept it less. It's part of the process and there's very little we can do about it.

I don't know how many of you are in your 60's but when you get there, it's not only the mental part it's also the physical. You think you can still do the things that you could do ten years ago, but you can't. I'm turning 69 and I often try to do what I used consider simple things and I just can't do them anymore, the mind says yes, the body says no.

I used to be a basketball official, but I quit at 58 because I felt I was cheating the players. I couldn't sprint back and forth with high school players and fairly call a game. It probably was happening when I was 55 but I thought I was doing okay. I did elementary school until I was 65 but that was no where near as taxing as the teenagers.

For some it happens gradually. For others it's very sudden. For all, it happens.

nefansince75 · Dec 19, 2018

BigKen said:
We all have our opinions and 'convictions'. I think it might be time for BB to move on and for the Patriots to inject new blood and new ideas into a team that may have become stagnant. Belichick is in his mid 60's and like all of us Baby Boomers, he has a hard time dealing with change. As he gets older he'll accept it less. It's part of the process and there's very little we can do about it.

I don't know how many of you are in your 60's but when you get there, it's not only the mental part it's also the physical. You think you can still do the things that you could do ten years ago, but you can't. I'm turning 69 and I often try to do what I used consider simple things and I just can't do them anymore, the mind says yes, the body says no.

I used to be a basketball official, but I quit at 58 because I felt I was cheating the players. I couldn't sprint back and forth with high school players and fairly call a game. It probably was happening when I was 55 but I thought I was doing okay. I did elementary school until I was 65 but that was no where near as taxing as the teenagers.

For some it happens gradually. For others it's very sudden. For all, it happens.

No need to mock me. It just undermines your statement "we all have our opinions". Ken - you do a great service here, but embracing other opinions is not one of them.

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